Favorite team:Georgia Tech 
Location:Atlanta, GA
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Registered on:12/3/2008
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re: LSU D approach vs. GT

Posted by GoldenTornado on 12/22/08 at 4:51 pm to
quote:

We completely shut down their full back run in the first half, completely. And didn't really give them much of it in the 2nd half though they were a little more successful with it then, but nothing dramatic. What killed us was that Johnson realized we were committing so much to stopping the full back dive, they kept running the speed sweep and getting out on the end which meant a DB or S had to come up and make the play most of the time on the perimeter.


Good analysis.

The GT-VT game early in the season went much the same way. They completely shut us down up the middle, and Johnson went to the outside. Dwyer only had about 25 yards in the VT game -- it was his worst game of the season by far.

The big difference in the VT and UGA games, from the GT D vs. opp's O point of view, was that GT had -3 turnovers against VT, and effectively +2 vs. UGA (which both led to immediate touchdowns).

It's true for any offense but maybe even more true for GT's: with an even or positive turnover margin, the Jackets are probably gonna win.
quote:


This year's Ga Tech team may have beaten UGA, but the same team almost lost to Gardner Webb.



Hey now! LSU is no Gardner Webb!

For your information, sir, G-W leads the nation in defense vs. third-string dropback QB's running triple-option offenses.

:cheers:
quote:

We gonna whip y'alls arse. Book it.


Is that Bettie Page in your avatar? I might not mind if she whipped my arse....

:spank: :lol:
I was really surprised noone mentioned John Bunting.

Hiring a coaches who has never been a coordinator is usually a recipe for disaster. John Bunting, Chuck Amato, Ed Orgeron.
quote:


That's exactly what I had in mind for this game.

Georgia Tech= pass first offense.


BTW, you will never make GT a pass first offense. Johnson is stubborn and patient and he flat out won't abandon the run, no matter what you do, even if you've stopped it cold all game.

Stacking the box with 8 or 9 guys is nothing new. At Navy every week he faced much bigger and faster teams that stacked the box with 8 or 9 guys, and he still ran the ball on them. Usually pretty effectively.
quote:



Run and shoot from the flexbone? Now, that's something I'd like to see.



A lot of people assume the "flexbone" evolved from the wishbone. But it didn't. At least, Johnson's version didn't -- but there are other versions. Here's what I've been able to piece together about the evolution of modern flexbone (a name PJ dislikes and doesn't use -- he's called it the spread for 20+ years).

PJ's offense came about in 1985 at Georgia Southern, which had run the 'Shoot from double-slot in 84. Erk Russell wanted to run the ball more, and PJ in his first year as OC convinced Erk to let him put option packages into the double-slot rather than installing the I. The slots moved in to run the ball better and that made it the flexbone.

Similar formations emerged two other ways: from the wishbone at Air Force under Ken Hatfield, and from the Wing-T in various southern HS's and small colleges.

And then inevitably they all influenced each other and they've continued to merge together. Johnson runs rocket toss and rocket motion plays that came from the wing-T guys. Air Force and Rices' line splits got bigger under Hatfield and DeBerry. Option got added into the Wing-T to make the Wofford Wingbone.

One difference that still shows the Run and Shoot roots of PJ's version is that he has never used tight ends. He's never even carried a TE on the roster. The other variants of the flexbone/wingbone all do use TE's at least sometimes.
quote:


I would think it would be just a few plays, not an entire offense and probably nothing too fancy. I could see it. It would be a nice wrinkle for them.


Right, it's not an entire new offense. Just adding more passing plays than are already there. Johnson's offense evolved from running the option out of the double-slot Run and Shoot, and the passing game has always been based on the 'Shoot.
Past seasons:

Stan Brock, Army
John Bunting, UNC
Ed Orgeron, Ole Miss
Al Groh, Virginia (and they keep extending him)
Ty Willingham, Washington
Mike Sherman, aTm
Ted Roof, Duke
Mike Shula, Alabama
Ron Prince, Kansas State
Greg Robinson, Syracuse

This year:

Gene Chizik, Auburn
Dabo Swinney, Clemson
Doug Marrone, Syracuse
I'm surprised no GT fans have addressed this!

First there's a scheme problem, on which more later. Second, being an a-hole can be good or bad, and in Tenuta's case, there's more bad than good.

At Tech he ruined team unity with an "offense vs. defense" mentality. A star player told me he and Nix hated each other, and he was openly contemptuous of Nix before the 2007 GT-Miami game. He reportedly had the same effect on the UNC staff.

His schemes are too all-or-nothing. His all-out blitzing and soft zone coverages tend to get abused by experienced QB's under good OC's.

GT's D returned only 4 starters this year, had a lot of injury problems and only started 2 true freshman DB's in the last half of the season.
But the D improved overall -- the run D was slightly worse but the pass D was a LOT better.

This year GT gave up somewhat fewer total yards, yards per play, and points than under Tenuta. All of this was accounted for by giving up about 40% fewer big plays.

Tenuta's all-or-nothing schemes seem best suited to teams that can't score. He probably allowed Gailey to win more overall games at the expense of more blowout losses. We would win games against good teams with "LSU-Auburn" scores like 7-3, 10-9, 14-10 etc.; but then lose 51-7, 39-3 etc. when Tenuta got burned.

For a team with a good offense, it makes less sense to me -- and apparently to Paul Johnson.

Finally, Tenuta does not generate all that many turnovers. This year under Wommack, GT has more takeaways in 12 games than Tenuta ever had in 13-14 games.

This doesn't appear to be luck -- in 6 seasons as a DC Wommack has generated 29+ takeaways four times, while Tenuta's best effort out of seven seasons was 27.
quote:

is shia labeouf in it? LINK /

btw, that movie is about the game that actually IS called the greatest game ever played. Never heard of a football game called that.


I'd love to see a good movie about the 1913 US Open.

Unfortunately that is probably the worst movie I've seen in five years. The book by Mark Frost isn't that much better.
The October issue of The Atlantic had a great article on this game:

Distant Replay
Red is right about PJ's run and shoot package. PJ's particular version of the 'flexbone' evolved from running the triple option out of the double-shot run and shoot rather than from the wishbone. He just said last week that he has a run and shoot package that he hasn't installed at GT yet. GT's passing game has been pretty simplistic this year -- screens, waggles and verticals.

He did throw relatively a lot the first four seasons at Hawaii but it was more like 180-200 yards per game than 400. The run-pass ratio was about 60:40 to 65:35, compared to 80:20 to 85:15 at Navy, GSU and GT so far.

Oh and on Chizik at Auburn.... he did have better defenses at Auburn and Texas than Muschamp has had. Still, all I can say is :rotflmao:
quote:

Must be a rough life over there.


True. But it does get better when we graduate and marry SEC hotties.

:thup:
quote:

Why would Johnson leave GT for Auburn? He can win an average of 7-9 games per year at Tech, and still have job security.


I know you're trying to be nice and all. But if 7-9 wins a year was sufficient by itself, Johnson wouldn't be at GT because his fired predecessor did that.
Napoleon, don't be jealous that I've been chatting online with babes all day. Besides, we both know that I'm training to be a cage fighter.
quote:


Is this the Oregon Duck board? C'mon guys...you should have 2 unis - home and away. Throwbacks and different color combinations are a mockery to tradition. And uniforms don't make you run faster or play any better.


On the contrary -- or in honor of our esteemed hosts, au contraire -- the whole point of the thread is that Holy LSU Tradition includes only one uniform combination.

Which is white jerseys both at home and on the road.

GT is the one other major-college program that abides by the same tradition, since at least the 1950's. Though we haven't kept to our traditions as avidly as LSU, as shown in part by the arena league look adopted on the Flats this year. Not my favorite, but it looks good streaking down the sidelines on an option pitch.

So, hey, it's all relative. And down here in LA and GA, we mean that literally. :cheers:

GT fans, and I suspect LSU fans as well, know we can't touch the Big Ten and especially Ohio State for Perfect Holy Tradition. If only leather helmets and metal spikes were still legal, all would be right in Buckeye World!

Finally, you may be right about new uniforms having no effect on team speed. But in the last few seasons tOSU has proven the inverse beyond the shadow of a doubt: NOT changing uniforms definitely DOESN'T help team speed!

Good luck against Texas!

:lol: :lol:

re: The Perfect Coach

Posted by GoldenTornado on 12/11/08 at 2:04 pm to
heh, right. Seems I had forgotten about y'alls' beef with USC. :)

You should set up a home and home. They generally seem willing to play anybody and schedule more big name OOC opponents than anyone else, by far. I seem to recall them stomping the SEC-W champs 2 years ago....

I think on average USC plays the toughest schedules around. But then I respect the PAC-10 - they are weak this year though.

re: The Perfect Coach

Posted by GoldenTornado on 12/11/08 at 12:42 pm to
Great topic! :cheers:

quote:



Any votes for Frank Beamer here?


Yep!

Getting most from talent levels
-------------------------------
Low talent -- Jim Grobe, Paul Johnson
Mediocre talent -- Tom O'Brien, Houston Nutt (EDIT)
Good talent -- Frank Beamer, Tommy Tuberville
Great talent -- Pete Carroll, Urban Meyer

Superlatives
------------
All-time greatest active -- Bobby Bowden
Builder from nothing -- Frank Beamer
Quick and dirty -- Dennis Erickson, Rick Neuheisel
Consistency -- Mark Richt, Mike Bellotti
Upset wins -- Houston Nutt
Recruiting -- Nick Saban, Mack Brown
Playcalling balls -- Les Miles
Beating rivals -- Paul Johnson
Media image -- Mark Richt, Mack Brown

Unit coaching awards
--------------------
Passing -- Mike Leach
Rushing -- Paul Johnson
Balanced offense -- Urban Meyer
Defense -- Nick Saban, Tommy Tuberville
ST's -- Frank Beamer


Honorable mentions
------------------
Emotional weeping -- Dabo Swinney
Bottle tanning -- Mark Richt
Self-importance -- Nick Saban
Press tirades -- Mike Gundy
Deceitfulness -- Bobby Petrino, Dennis Franchione
Lip balm application -- Rick Neuheisel
To clarify, GT was 7-5 in the regular season in 1991, then won the bowl game. So LSU could post exactly the same record as GT.

But GT was a freak MNC. LSU is a consistent power.

BTW just from an outsider's viewpoint the idea that LSU 07 was a weak MNC team is ludicrous.
LSU played a monster schedule in the toughest year for the SEC in my memory, crushed a good VT team OOC and then crushed the only 1-loss BCS team in the title game. Very strong statements. LSU lost two games in overtime -- which means pre-1995 y'all would've been 12-0-2. Noone could possibly have complained about that record.

BYU in 1984 has no close contenders for weak MNC in the modern era. The most undeserved was the one Colorado split with GT in 1990 -- b/c of the 5th down they were really a 9-2-1 team.
We were told GT has some different unis we haven't seen yet this year. We've worn white 12 games this year, mostly with white pants on the road and mustard gold at home. But I wouldn't mind seeing us in some navy blue jerseys they supposedly bought, with the white pants....
What was that? Completely lost my train of thought due to rpg's avatar.