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Sonos Question

Posted on 7/3/18 at 8:17 am
Posted by BigPerm30
Member since Aug 2011
25921 posts
Posted on 7/3/18 at 8:17 am
I want to use the Sonos system for my surround sound but I want to hide the two play 1s for the rear speakers. Do you think it's possible to mount these in the ceiling with a grill that could be painted? Would I lose a lot of sound quality in the attic?
Posted by ellunchboxo
Gtown
Member since Feb 2009
18796 posts
Posted on 7/3/18 at 8:38 am to
As long as they’re firing down it should be fine.
Posted by BigPerm30
Member since Aug 2011
25921 posts
Posted on 7/3/18 at 9:11 am to
As an alternative, I could use a connect amp and ceiling speakers. The website told me I need two connect amps. One for the left and one for the right. That's $1,000 for just the two amps and no speakers.

Any suggestions?
Posted by DoubleDown
New Orleans, Louisiana
Member since Oct 2008
12869 posts
Posted on 7/3/18 at 9:11 am to
quote:

Do you think it's possible to mount these in the ceiling with a grill that could be painted? Would I lose a lot of sound quality in the attic?

Definitely possible and the Play:1's fire from the front even though they appear to have the grill all around. It might be easier to just buy some premade wall mounts and just wall mount them as rears maybe 10feet up firing down at the sofa or wherever someone will be watching the TV.

Guess it all depends on where you have power outlets though. Both options require some drywall "updates".
Posted by BigPerm30
Member since Aug 2011
25921 posts
Posted on 7/3/18 at 9:18 am to
quote:

Guess it all depends on where you have power outlets though. Both options require some drywall "updates".


It’s new construction so I can virtually do anything.
Posted by DoubleDown
New Orleans, Louisiana
Member since Oct 2008
12869 posts
Posted on 7/3/18 at 9:20 am to
quote:

As an alternative, I could use a connect amp and ceiling speakers. The website told me I need two connect amps. One for the left and one for the right. That's $1,000 for just the two amps and no speakers.

Any suggestions?

Yes!!! Now you're exactly as my setup. Good news, you don't need 2 Connect:AMPs, just 1. I have 1 connect AMP connected to my 4 in ceiling speakers. You just have to twist the 2 blacks together and then twist the 2 reds together and stick them into the connect amps black and red, respectively.

Then you'll have to follow directions to make those 4 in ceiling speakers your surround right and left but it isn't too bad of a setup. From what I recall it's a intranet site you go to within your home wifi and then you just do like 2 setup steps and boom, simulated surround sound. It sounds good too.

In short, your front right and left will be mimicking the same sound as your back right and left but it sounds good in my environment.
Posted by BigPerm30
Member since Aug 2011
25921 posts
Posted on 7/3/18 at 9:24 am to
That’s not exactly the set up. I’d have a playbar for the center and front speakers. They want me to use a connect amp for one rear right and the other for the rear left.
Posted by DoubleDown
New Orleans, Louisiana
Member since Oct 2008
12869 posts
Posted on 7/3/18 at 9:45 am to
Sorry, I forgot to mention that I have the Playbar for my Front R/C/L as well. So my setup is:
1 Playbar
1 connect:amp which is connected to 4 in ceiling speakers

You could also simply do 1 connect:amp and just wire in 2 Rear speakers, however, the audio for music with the full on 4 in ceiling speakers is... awesome. My living room rocks the hell outta some frozen soundtracks and my girls go crazy when it's the playbar + 4 in ceiling speakers jamming "LET IT GO, LET IT GOOOOOOOO!".
Posted by TigerWise
Front Seat of an Uber
Member since Sep 2010
35113 posts
Posted on 7/3/18 at 10:05 am to
Double Down has four rear surround speakers. Two in front and two in the rear. Bama gonna Bama brah.
Posted by Croacka
Denham Springs
Member since Dec 2008
61441 posts
Posted on 7/3/18 at 10:05 am to
If you have 2 rear speakers connected to the same outputs on 1 amp, you can’t be getting true surround unless I am misinterpreting something.

I’m not all that familiar with sonos
Posted by Marco Esquandolas
Member since Jul 2013
11426 posts
Posted on 7/3/18 at 10:29 am to
quote:

Double down



You are doing it wrong....totally.

While that improper setup may work for you, please don’t steer the OP into doing it wrong (having 4 surround channels running in stereo).

Also, the connect amp doesn’t “double down” (an audio amplifier term meaning doubling its power as impedance halves—which you will be doing driving multiple speakers off a single tap). The connect amp is not designed to drive a 4 ohm load—you will burn it up.


I know a thing or four about this.
This post was edited on 7/3/18 at 10:37 am
Posted by Marco Esquandolas
Member since Jul 2013
11426 posts
Posted on 7/3/18 at 10:33 am to
To the OP.....get an Emotiva 3 or 5 channel amp, depending on if you need to drive the rears and center, or all 5 speakers.

The amplifier doesn’t have to be Sonos to drive a Sonos speaker.
Posted by DoubleDown
New Orleans, Louisiana
Member since Oct 2008
12869 posts
Posted on 7/3/18 at 10:38 am to
quote:

Double Down has four rear surround speakers. Two in front and two in the rear.

I do. I literally said that just in a different sentence structure.
quote:

Bama gonna Bama brah.

I know, when Bama wins (so every weekend) it sounds good in my Sonos setup.
Thanks!
Posted by TigerWise
Front Seat of an Uber
Member since Sep 2010
35113 posts
Posted on 7/3/18 at 10:39 am to
quote:

The connect amp is not designed to drive a 4 ohm load


I agree DD’s set up is not right but you can drive four 8 ohm speakers on a connect amp. It can run at 4 ohm.
Posted by BigPerm30
Member since Aug 2011
25921 posts
Posted on 7/3/18 at 10:42 am to
quote:

The amplifier doesn’t have to be Sonos to drive a Sonos speaker.


How do you connect it to the Sonos environment?
Posted by DoubleDown
New Orleans, Louisiana
Member since Oct 2008
12869 posts
Posted on 7/3/18 at 10:45 am to
quote:

To the OP.....get an Emotiva 3 or 5 channel amp, depending on if you need to drive the rears and center, or all 5 speakers.

The amplifier doesn’t have to be Sonos to drive a Sonos speaker.

I'm not sure that's a true statement. How is he going to get the Sonos Playbar to work with those and the amp? You have to enable the surround sound feature through the Sonos app and it'd have no way to do that with external hardware.

I think you could use the Sonos Playbar with an AV receiver that uses the optical cable but even that appears debatable given the Sonos forums I've looked at online.
Posted by DoubleDown
New Orleans, Louisiana
Member since Oct 2008
12869 posts
Posted on 7/3/18 at 10:51 am to
quote:

you can drive four 8 ohm speakers on a connect amp. It can run at 4 ohm.

You defintely can, I've confirmed with Sonos. They gave me the obligitory "it may shorten the life of the amp" but it's been kicking for 2 years with this setup.
quote:

I agree DD’s set up is not right

I feel like I remember us having this argument but why do you say my setup isn't right? Just because I have 2 ceiling speakers that are front R/L that pump out back L/R sound?

Yea, I agree but my alternative is to take out those but then I lose them for music.
This post was edited on 7/3/18 at 10:55 am
Posted by Marco Esquandolas
Member since Jul 2013
11426 posts
Posted on 7/3/18 at 10:58 am to
TigerWise, I don’t see anywhere on the specs that says it is capable of driving a 4 ohm load...it says “55 Watts isn’t 8ohms”.

Is is stated somewhere else and I am just overlooking it?

Normally, if an amp is capable of driving a 4 ohm load, it will state that (kinda like bragging rights—“yeah, we can do that”).


Posted by DoubleDown
New Orleans, Louisiana
Member since Oct 2008
12869 posts
Posted on 7/3/18 at 11:02 am to
quote:

How do you connect it to the Sonos environment?

You don't. Look, I'm not gonna shite on them like they tried to shite on me but I can tell you that my setup works. However, I already had 4 in ceiling speakers done when I bought my house.

If you're building yours and want to spend that kind of cash and are open to the traditional AV receiver and wired speakers, I'd probably go that route. Don't do 4 in ceiling speakers. I'd probably just do a traditional F/C/R and then 2 rears and a sub all wired to an AV receiver.
If your walls are already opened up, that might be a good route. Sonos is expensive with the playbar + sub + connect:AMP + 2 rear play:1s.

Sonos does a "simulated 5.1" experience. It's not true 5.1 but it sounds good enough for me and my family and it's simple. Much simpler than a receiver with multiple inputs for my wife and 2 really small kids. If that's not a concern for you, definitely keep an open mind about an av receiver and traditional 5.1 setup.
Posted by Marco Esquandolas
Member since Jul 2013
11426 posts
Posted on 7/3/18 at 11:04 am to
quote:

You defintely can, I've confirmed with Sonos. They gave me the obligitory "it may shorten the life of the amp"



....There’s your answer— it isn’t designed to drive a 4ohm load.

If an amp is truly designed to drive a 4ohm load, it will usually double its power output as impedance halves. It will also do it, without compromise, for the same life span as doing it for an 8ohm load.

When an amp is designed to drive a lower impedance, the power supply gets beefier to handle such demand. Given the size of the connect amp and their “plug and play” target audience, it makes sense that it would not be designed this way. It would also raise the price.

Yes, it will “work”, but don’t drive them to high volumes for extended periods. You will be taxing the hell out of that amp—-thus shortening its life.
This post was edited on 7/3/18 at 11:13 am
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