re: Comparing MJ and Lebron

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Now I will agree those people (and those of my age) may indeed be guilty of a recency bias against Lebron as it applies to judging his place on the list below Jordan. In my opinion, he isn't even top 5 (MJ, Magic, Jabbar, Chamberlin, Bird) but I realize I am likely swayed by being a fan of "my" era.

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First let's at least agree that this isn't something either of us can prove. I've not seen evidence of older NBA fans overwhelmingly saying that MJ is the best of all time but you have. Fine.


I will say that if you're saying Bird is above Lebron in any way then your opinion can't purely be about the game itself. Bird does not measure up on numbers to make it a compelling conversation.

And that's pretty much my argument. My argument is fans don't change because human nature doesn't change. Fans find reasons to fit their argument when the measurable facts don't line up with their beliefs. You're placing Bird above Lebron is about more than the game, and that's how those Russell/Chamberlain/Kareem fans think too.

I bet in your mind Lebron could win 5 more championships and it wouldn't change your mind. It should but it wouldn't. Similarly there's nothing MJ did that could change fans of that previous era into thinking that he's better than their guys. That's just the way fans are.

I remember a friend in school that said MJ is the best and nothing anyone could do would change that, and he doesn't watch basketball anymore because nothing will ever be like that again. How could you say who the best is if you don't even watch basketball anymore to consider any additional evidence? This is the way fans are. Kareem, Wilt, Russell all had those same types.

1 on 1 would be fantastic. 90s defense rules. Jordan would be chippy as hell and talking shite. LeBron would whine his head off and start jacking up threes and quit

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That said, no one beats Jordan in his prime 1 on 1.

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Jordan ain’t stopping Giannis in 1 on 1 either…

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What is he now, about 5? Luka, Steph, Jokic, Giannis

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Steph isn’t top 5 currently. Tatum playing better, and LeBron

He has not been best player in the league in many years. You can’t have a sub .500 team and go half a decade only winning a playoff series one year and claim “best player”. there is a winning component that has to accompany the stats in order to claim best player.

Let me put it this way.
Jordan was the best player every year from pretty much rookie until 2nd retirement, and he was still about top 5 in his twilight with the Wizards
Lebron was the best player every year from pretty much rookie until Steph, a fellow player overtook him and now he's still about top 5 in his twilight with the Lakers.

I don't really think LeBron has many more years as the best player. Than Jordan or Wilt. Like a lot of this this stuff, it's heavily due to early entry and early peak development, which shouldn't be held against him but his only real competition in all the "youngest player" accolades are Kevin Garnett and Moses Malone. It's a very very small pool against a very few exceptions over the years. It's a dumb statistic made up for him.

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and he was still about top 5 in his twilight with the Wizards

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Has not been anywheres close to the top players statistically in years and years.

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Led league in assists and won chip 4 years ago…. He’s been averaging over 30 ppg the last 2 years.

Is that not close to the top players considering he almost won scoring title last year and would have but didn’t qualify by 1 or 2 games missed?

We ain’t talking about counting stats. He led the league in assists but his team was bottom Half of the league offensively. Scoring - again his team offense was trash. Prime lebron made his teammates better and wasn’t out for his own numbers. None of the one number advanced metrics that are used these days have lebron anywhere nearthe top of the league for many years.

23, 5.5, 5.7 and 1.5 stls on 45% shooting
5 40-point games (top 5 in the league, AI led with 9) and he shot over 50% in all of them
Next season was a slight dip in points but better assists and more efficient shooting, and 4 more 40-point games again all over 50% shooting
All while not being able to jump anymore and being a tragic shell of his former self. That's what he was compared to
He was easily one of the best players in the league by all statistics and unquestionably still the greatest 40 year old player ever, though LeBron with his HGH may pass him