- My Forums
- Tiger Rant
- LSU Recruiting
- SEC Rant
- Saints Talk
- Pelicans Talk
- More Sports Board
- Fantasy Sports
- Golf Board
- Soccer Board
- O-T Lounge
- Tech Board
- Home/Garden Board
- Outdoor Board
- Health/Fitness Board
- Movie/TV Board
- Book Board
- Music Board
- Political Talk
- Money Talk
- Fark Board
- Gaming Board
- Travel Board
- Food/Drink Board
- Ticket Exchange
- TD Help Board
Customize My Forums- View All Forums
- Show Left Links
- Topic Sort Options
- Trending Topics
- Recent Topics
- Active Topics
Started By
Message
re: Offensive Line vs Scheme. NE vs KC - perfect explanation why LSU's scheme needs to change
Posted on 1/19/19 at 8:15 pm to SEC Grapevine
Posted on 1/19/19 at 8:15 pm to SEC Grapevine
Rant Myths are started by Dereck & Ben who both are paid to support Coach O and OC, defend the indefensible Offense, etc. One of their favorite refrains is the O-Line not giving the QB 3 or more seconds to throw. Two things here fall into the Myth category 1) O-Line is only a problem for LSU and if we had 'better players' that would fix things (players don't determine Scheme), 2) QBs should have 3-4 seconds to set, go through progressions and throw.
Max Protect limits the number of receivers to longer isolation routes in double coverage so it is a self-defeating Scheme that puts extra stress on the OL because of the lack of Spread, Receivers, & Time to throw -Phone Booth football exactly like what has plagued QBs for over 10 yrs.
The OLine: LSU vs ALA = no contest in the trenches - spread the field, you are never going to win vs ALA in the trenches, no one has.
If the OLine could just give Burrow 3 more seconds to survey the field, go through progessions, blah, blah, trenches.
The average time a QB has to throw the ball is 2.5 seconds. Anything more than that and Completion % drops off, sack rate goes up, as does % QB hurries. It is a constant with the variable becoming faster, not slower. "Build a wall" will not work.
This Trend information was through 2015 and things have gotten faster across the FBS & NFL and resulted in the benchmark of 2.5 secs or less being needed for a successful passing game, not to mention, RPO, spread, Tempo all things that LSU Offense is lacking due to Scheme/Coaching and Player Development. Teams with Innovative Offensive Coaches & Coordinators dominate from HS, FBS, to the NFL. All of these basic Scheme characteristics can be found in every CFPNC contender:
quote:
The scheme was severely limited by Oline play. I don't understand why people couldn't see that. It's my belief as of now that the anti O crowd actually saw it but would rather ignore the lack of depth and slam the coaches.
Max Protect limits the number of receivers to longer isolation routes in double coverage so it is a self-defeating Scheme that puts extra stress on the OL because of the lack of Spread, Receivers, & Time to throw -Phone Booth football exactly like what has plagued QBs for over 10 yrs.
The OLine: LSU vs ALA = no contest in the trenches - spread the field, you are never going to win vs ALA in the trenches, no one has.
If the OLine could just give Burrow 3 more seconds to survey the field, go through progessions, blah, blah, trenches.
The average time a QB has to throw the ball is 2.5 seconds. Anything more than that and Completion % drops off, sack rate goes up, as does % QB hurries. It is a constant with the variable becoming faster, not slower. "Build a wall" will not work.
This Trend information was through 2015 and things have gotten faster across the FBS & NFL and resulted in the benchmark of 2.5 secs or less being needed for a successful passing game, not to mention, RPO, spread, Tempo all things that LSU Offense is lacking due to Scheme/Coaching and Player Development. Teams with Innovative Offensive Coaches & Coordinators dominate from HS, FBS, to the NFL. All of these basic Scheme characteristics can be found in every CFPNC contender:
This post was edited on 1/21/19 at 1:02 pm
5
Posted on 1/19/19 at 8:43 pm to SEC Grapevine
Stopped reading at
SEC Grapevine dumbfrick.
SEC Grapevine dumbfrick.
Posted on 1/19/19 at 8:49 pm to SEC Grapevine
quote:
Max Protect limits the number of receivers to longer isolation routes in double coverage
You are seriously stupid.
Posted on 1/19/19 at 9:02 pm to SEC Grapevine
Trevor Lawrence has a Quicker Release than Brady. That is particularly amazing considering that Brady is throwing short quick passes of 5-6 yds and Lawrence is throwing much longer passes.
The new crop of young studs – Jared Goff, Carson Wentz, Patrick Mahomes, Baker Mayfield et al – are playing a different sport to the veterans. They play with a fearlessness the league has been lacking. It’s a cautious aggression, a deadly cocktail brewed up in the college ranks. Finally, it’s translating to the pro game.
Offensive and defensive schemes are evolving
The NFL can only use the talent that college provides. That’s always been true: the professionals like to the think of themselves as the wise ones. They send down football decrees from on high and the rest of the football universe takes note.
The reverse is actually true. High school coaches innovate. College guys steal and evolve those ideas. And the NFL folks do the same, pinching players and ideas from college, before twisting and contorting them to fit their own needs. Evolution in high school takes weeks. It’s a genius born of desperation. Evolution in the NFL, meanwhile now takes days. A successful play a team does at any level makes the highlight reel and teams incorporate it in their Scheme.
We’re finally seeing the fruits of the changes at the high school and college level paying dividends in the NFL – if you like high-scoring games, that is.
College style offenses – which feature multi-receiver sets, an emphasis on spacing the field, switch releases to attack man-coverage (receivers crisscrossing at the line of scrimmage), spread formations, and all manner of pre-snap deception – make the game easier for quarterbacks. There’s no other way to say it. It’s how schools routinely chuck out 4,000-yard passers, regardless of the individual player’s talent.
Past NFL coaching staffs have been hesitant to change. Their way was the best way. They were the pros. They were smarter. Now, pace-and-space principles are rampant across the league. The line between a college and NFL offense is blurring. This is facilitated by fossilized coaches having to make way for the Sean McVays, and a fresh batch of offensive coordinators who have pushed the quarterback-driven league into overdrive.
Red-Zone Pass Play from Clemson - Lawrence hit as he releases the ball. This happened quite a lot. He was never sacked but within a split second of being sacked many times. Conversely, ALA did not have a reliable goal line pass play in close quarters where Clemson defended their WRs, who are not as good as Dabo's. ALA tried to punch it in with runs 3-4 times and could not.
Patriots' Red-Zone "Iso" Slant to Rob Gronkowski: The NFL's most unstoppable play. This is a 3x1 formation out of Posse/11 personnel (3 WR, 1 TE, 1 RB) with Gronkowski removed as the backside "X" receiver (split end).
[b]Clemson Scheme and Coaching - They were built to beat ALA and win the CFP NC: It is not the players, it is the Coaches/Scheme:
Their Scheme is multi-dimensional spread, RPO, up-Tempo, with so many options that the Defense is not able to key on the QB, RB, TE, WRs and if they blitz Clemson breaks an explosive run, quick pass, or vertical pass.
Their Coaching group has steadily been building Tempo, and developing QBs to throw to those WRs, RBs: Tajh Boyd, Watson, Trevor Lawrence, true FR.
Just for fun try and guesstimate how fast Etienne runs the first 40 yds. He is believed to be the fastest.
For the season, Etienne has had a Clemson record 1658 yards and 24 touchdowns. In the ALA game he had 3 TDs( 1 on shovel pass), 86 yds.
The new crop of young studs – Jared Goff, Carson Wentz, Patrick Mahomes, Baker Mayfield et al – are playing a different sport to the veterans. They play with a fearlessness the league has been lacking. It’s a cautious aggression, a deadly cocktail brewed up in the college ranks. Finally, it’s translating to the pro game.
Offensive and defensive schemes are evolving
The NFL can only use the talent that college provides. That’s always been true: the professionals like to the think of themselves as the wise ones. They send down football decrees from on high and the rest of the football universe takes note.
The reverse is actually true. High school coaches innovate. College guys steal and evolve those ideas. And the NFL folks do the same, pinching players and ideas from college, before twisting and contorting them to fit their own needs. Evolution in high school takes weeks. It’s a genius born of desperation. Evolution in the NFL, meanwhile now takes days. A successful play a team does at any level makes the highlight reel and teams incorporate it in their Scheme.
We’re finally seeing the fruits of the changes at the high school and college level paying dividends in the NFL – if you like high-scoring games, that is.
College style offenses – which feature multi-receiver sets, an emphasis on spacing the field, switch releases to attack man-coverage (receivers crisscrossing at the line of scrimmage), spread formations, and all manner of pre-snap deception – make the game easier for quarterbacks. There’s no other way to say it. It’s how schools routinely chuck out 4,000-yard passers, regardless of the individual player’s talent.
Past NFL coaching staffs have been hesitant to change. Their way was the best way. They were the pros. They were smarter. Now, pace-and-space principles are rampant across the league. The line between a college and NFL offense is blurring. This is facilitated by fossilized coaches having to make way for the Sean McVays, and a fresh batch of offensive coordinators who have pushed the quarterback-driven league into overdrive.
Red-Zone Pass Play from Clemson - Lawrence hit as he releases the ball. This happened quite a lot. He was never sacked but within a split second of being sacked many times. Conversely, ALA did not have a reliable goal line pass play in close quarters where Clemson defended their WRs, who are not as good as Dabo's. ALA tried to punch it in with runs 3-4 times and could not.
Patriots' Red-Zone "Iso" Slant to Rob Gronkowski: The NFL's most unstoppable play. This is a 3x1 formation out of Posse/11 personnel (3 WR, 1 TE, 1 RB) with Gronkowski removed as the backside "X" receiver (split end).
quote:
That creates a "trips" look (3 WR) to the open side of the formation, while Gronkowski is isolated on the other side against a defender in coverage. Now, Brady has a true one-on-one matchup to target with the league's top tight end running a basic, one-step slant against both Cover 1 (man-free) and Cover 0 (blitz-man) schemes.
quote:
The Patriots do an excellent job of creating isolation situations for Rob Gronkowski by removing the tight end from the formation. This forces the defense to walk out a linebacker, safety or even a cornerback in coverage against the size, power and athleticism of the Patriots tight end. With Gronkowski aligned as a wide receiver in the deep red zone, a safety has to try to take away the slant. Once that ball is snapped, Gronkowski consistently whips defensive backs on the release to give quarterback Tom Brady a clear throwing window to rack up another touchdown pass.
[b]Clemson Scheme and Coaching - They were built to beat ALA and win the CFP NC: It is not the players, it is the Coaches/Scheme:
Their Scheme is multi-dimensional spread, RPO, up-Tempo, with so many options that the Defense is not able to key on the QB, RB, TE, WRs and if they blitz Clemson breaks an explosive run, quick pass, or vertical pass.
Their Coaching group has steadily been building Tempo, and developing QBs to throw to those WRs, RBs: Tajh Boyd, Watson, Trevor Lawrence, true FR.
Just for fun try and guesstimate how fast Etienne runs the first 40 yds. He is believed to be the fastest.
For the season, Etienne has had a Clemson record 1658 yards and 24 touchdowns. In the ALA game he had 3 TDs( 1 on shovel pass), 86 yds.
Posted on 1/20/19 at 2:54 pm to SEC Grapevine
quote:
Rant Myths are started by Dereck & Ben who both are paid to support Coach O and OC
Here is SEC Grapevines second post in this thread. It was before I posted here.
This is not a difference of opinion. This is a straight defamatory attack. The poster has no evidence whatsoever to back up his accusation but that doesn't stop him at all.
This poster has been flinging these accusations for quite some time now.
I responded with verbal attacks of my own.
To say that I was unprovoked is just plain dishonest.
It's funny that I don't roam around this board thread to thread making up scenarios attacking other posters. The posters that are here attacking me are well aware of of the comments by Grapevine. They misrepresent what has been said and outright lie about the circumstances.
I hope now that certain posters have had their dishonesty exposed that this can all be put to rest.
Posted on 1/23/19 at 8:53 pm to SEC Grapevine
The LSU line was different the first several games.
Guy injured. Moved positions.
No two games the same guys on line.
Who thinks you can expect much with that?
They did great considering.
Guy injured. Moved positions.
No two games the same guys on line.
Who thinks you can expect much with that?
They did great considering.
Page 1 of 1
Popular
Back to top
Follow TigerDroppings for LSU Football News