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re: Season Record Prediction Using Mathematical Analysis of Point Spreads 2015

Posted on 8/21/15 at 1:14 pm to
Posted by Salviati
Member since Apr 2006
6019 posts
Posted on 8/21/15 at 1:14 pm to
quote:

The fundamental flaw here is expected value of random variable only indicates large amount of repetitions of an experiment. Using your coin toss analogy, for each match you are tossing each coin exactly once, not 100 times. Thus the outcome might not be close to expected value at all.
I feel almost certain that we all understand that expected values might not reflect actual values. Of course, a penny might not land on heads every other coin flip. Of course, a penny might land on heads 10 times in a row.

The purpose of a a preseason prediction is predict the expected outcome and, of course, it might not reflect the actual outcome. That is fundamental.


quote:

Additionally, although each match can be seen as independent event, the odds/lines for games are highly correlated to the outcome of previous games.
You are really trying HARD to throw mud in the water. The fact that Vegas uses, IN PART, the history of a team (previous games) to predict the result of future games is IRRELEVANT to the correlation between the odds/lines for a game and the outcome of that game. In short, the odds/lines for a game are highly predictive of the outcome of that game.


quote:

Thus the pre-game odds can be a lot of different from current odds which makes the prediction inaccurate.
This sentence makes zero sense.

In what universe are the pregame odds for a game different from the current odds for a game. I'd like to make wagers in that universe.

The relevant odds/lines for a game are always the pregame odds for the game. (Unless you made a bet on the game and want to collect.)
Posted by CptBengal
BR Baby
Member since Dec 2007
71661 posts
Posted on 8/21/15 at 1:23 pm to
Why do you keep ignoring the failure of the math you used...

P(A or B) = P(A) + P(B)...

NOT P(A,B,...) = P(A) + P(B)
Posted by nickbear
Member since Nov 2014
195 posts
Posted on 8/22/15 at 10:09 pm to
quote:

I feel almost certain that we all understand that expected values might not reflect actual values. Of course, a penny might not land on heads every other coin flip. Of course, a penny might land on heads 10 times in a row.

The purpose of a a preseason prediction is predict the expected outcome and, of course, it might not reflect the actual outcome. That is fundamental.



Well, you claimed your prediction is based on mathematical analysis and I am just pointing out where the analysis doesn't make much sense mathematically. Ever heard the quote "averages without variances are meaningless - or worse misleading"? You were trying to predict using mean value but totally ignored the small variance assumption this methodology based on. In your case, one single event's variance for many events is large enough to make the prediction based on mean value useless. For example, in 50% odd case the variable is as large as .25. What makes things much worse is that you are taking summation of these variables. Based on your assumption that these events are independent, if you ever heard of Bienayme formula you can calculate the variance of the summation variable which is the summation of all independent variance - that's huge! The variance of summation variable is large enough so that its mean value means a little better than nothing.

quote:

You are really trying HARD to throw mud in the water. The fact that Vegas uses, IN PART, the history of a team (previous games) to predict the result of future games is IRRELEVANT to the correlation between the odds/lines for a game and the outcome of that game. In short, the odds/lines for a game are highly predictive of the outcome of that game.



It seems I overestimate your level and you seems didn't understand what I was talking about. I was not arguing about whether an odd/line is correlated to event outcome at all. Let's put it in easy to understand way - after game X happened, will the the odd/line be adjusted for future games? Do you think using adjusted odd to calculate then leads to more actuate prediction at that point? If your answers to both problems are yes, then can you tell the difference between your independent events model and a different model that takes account for prior probabilities? Ever heard of the word random process?

quote:

This sentence makes zero sense.

In what universe are the pregame odds for a game different from the current odds for a game. I'd like to make wagers in that universe.

The relevant odds/lines for a game are always the pregame odds for the game. (Unless you made a bet on the game and want to collect.)


It seems you cannot even understand plain English without math. Your number is predicted using current, today's, 8/22/2015's odd for all games, and do you think the pregame odd before each game is exactly the same as current odd? If your predict is totally based on current odd, then the number doesn't mean much since the odds change a lot.

In summary, I don't have any problem with you doing some high school math exercise and call it your prediction. But I wouldn't calling it mathematical analysis - the method and model have some systematic flaws and leads to meaningless results. To me the model performance is probably similar to a dummy model that picks a random number from a few numbers.
This post was edited on 8/22/15 at 10:13 pm
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