Lebron vs Kobe and the importance of winning

For the record, I don't agree at all with the notion that winning is the best way to judge the greatness of a player- in any sport. I somewhat can see in basketball how it matters because 1 player can make a much greater difference, but in the end it is still a team game and number of titles is not an indication of where you rank amongst the greats.

Now, about Kobe vs. Lebron (comparing both in their primes). The only argument Kobe has on Lebron is rings. Lebron is a more efficient and better scorer, and most definitely a better passer. I think the versatility Lebron has on D makes him an easy choice for better defender. Rebounding, I think Lebron has a higher avg. but considering he's a forward, not going to count that against Kobe.

So if the argument is winning, I don't see how you can blindly ignore the drastic effect Lebron has on his team's winning. Lebron's first stint in Cleveland, he came in as a rookie and immediately improved them. Got them to the playoffs by his second or third year which was an impressive feat in it's own right. Had them get to the finals, and had them as legit title contenders for 3 years or so, on a roster with no one at all. Lebron left the Cavs and they went instantly from contender to last in the league. That's an outstanding difference. Now, he leaves Miami and even though they replaced him with a quality SF in Deng, and have had Whiteside emerge as an exxtremely talented center, they are still fighting to get into the 8 or 7 seed in an awful at the bottom east. Yes, they've had injuries, but they have dealt with that the past 2 years and still been title contenders playing in June. (Without a Center like Whiteside). Now Lebron goes to the Cavs and they go from missing the playoffs in East to contenders again (albeit they also added Love, even if he's dissapointed so far, and some nice role players).

It's more difficult to see Kobe's impact because he's always been a Laker. But when they lost Shaq (undoubtedly a better and more dominant player than anyone Lebron has ever played with), they were pretty bad. Kobe had poor talent around him, granted, but they still were bad. Missed the playoffs one year, and were not contenders until they got Gasol. The West is and was a lot more tough than the East, so I wouldn't expect him to take a bad team to the finals like Bron did, but at least have them competitive.

Long post but in conclusion, I think Lebron helps his team win a lot more than Kobe despite Kobe's ring advantage. Both are all-time great players but personally I seee Kobe as top 10-20ish all time great, and Lebron as top 5.