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re: Reality Check: LSU has never been an elite SEC program
Posted on 10/27/10 at 5:15 pm to Y.A. Tittle
Posted on 10/27/10 at 5:15 pm to Y.A. Tittle
quote:
Right. [Florida's] lack of significant history before then puts them second tier overall.
I understand and respect that point of view. I just respectfully disagree because of the magnitude of the arse kicking Florida dished out.
And I hope to hell that the blows Florida has been dealt this year are not an anomaly, but a recurring theme this decade. I HATE Florida.
I'd be much happier if the East were balanced between Florida, Georgia and Tennessee and the West were balanced between LSU, Auburn and Bama. With LSU on top and the other schools stepping up in whatever year we slip. A SEC national title every year would be sweet, especially if LSU wins a respectable share. So if LSU continues to slip this year (likely), I hope Bama or Auburn represents the SEC and kicks some arse in the BCS title game. At the end of every season, we should all be chanting "SEC! SEC! SEC!"
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Posted on 10/27/10 at 5:35 pm to pdxlsufan
quote:
LSU was super awesome elite in the 80s. Remember how we totally pwned those allegedly elite Nebraska teams in the Orange Bowl and two Sugar Bowls???
I remember, it wasn't pretty.
Posted on 10/27/10 at 5:35 pm to pdxlsufan
quote:
The reason LSU and Auburn have such a highly competitive game every year is because LSU and Auburn are almost mirror images of each other. Both of want to be better than Bama, just as much as the Red Sox want to be better than the Yankees. We aren't.
that is bullshite! Yea, maybe the past 2 years bama has been better than us, but we have definently been the better team this decade! Bullshite comparison too!
Posted on 10/27/10 at 5:37 pm to Morgus
quote:
LSU was 4-5-1 against them in the 80's. You already had 2 losses by 1983.
I think you're trying to fully leverage our pride. Unfortunately, how anyone does against one team, even ours, doesn't make them generally successful and certainly doesn't vault them into elite status
No, I just posted the record.
Posted on 10/27/10 at 5:38 pm to Hitchcock
quote:
I remember, it wasn't pretty.
I was in the Dome for both. And no, it wasn't pretty. Neither was LSU's bowl record prior to 1995.
Fortunately, we've kicked a lot of arse in bowl games since then to make it over the .500 hump.
Posted on 10/27/10 at 5:42 pm to Mclovin2991
Again, LSU shouldn't brag too much about beating Bama in the 2000s. A lot of SEC teams beat Bama in the 2000s.
Again, let's review those 10 seasons from Bama's perspective:
2000: 3-8 (lost to LSU)
2001: 7-5 (lost to LSU)
2002: 10-3 (beat LSU 31-0)
2003: 4-9 (lost to LSU)
2004: 6-6 (lost to LSU)
2005: 10-2 (lost to LSU)
2006: 6-7 (lost to LSU)
2007: 7-6 (lost to LSU)
2008: 12-2 (beat LSU)
2009: 14-0 (beat LSU)
All but one year (2005), when LSU beat Bama they were mediocre or just downright awful.
And now we face a one loss Bama team that won the national title last year and has one regular season SEC loss in the last 3 years.
If we fail to beat them this year, we'll just be repeating the history I illustrated above. Want to be an elite team, you've got to beat elite teams when they're good. Beating a 3-6 Bama team made us feel good and gave the fans an excuse to storm the field, but it proved nothing in a season when everybody else beat Bama.
Again, let's review those 10 seasons from Bama's perspective:
2000: 3-8 (lost to LSU)
2001: 7-5 (lost to LSU)
2002: 10-3 (beat LSU 31-0)
2003: 4-9 (lost to LSU)
2004: 6-6 (lost to LSU)
2005: 10-2 (lost to LSU)
2006: 6-7 (lost to LSU)
2007: 7-6 (lost to LSU)
2008: 12-2 (beat LSU)
2009: 14-0 (beat LSU)
All but one year (2005), when LSU beat Bama they were mediocre or just downright awful.
And now we face a one loss Bama team that won the national title last year and has one regular season SEC loss in the last 3 years.
If we fail to beat them this year, we'll just be repeating the history I illustrated above. Want to be an elite team, you've got to beat elite teams when they're good. Beating a 3-6 Bama team made us feel good and gave the fans an excuse to storm the field, but it proved nothing in a season when everybody else beat Bama.
Posted on 10/27/10 at 5:47 pm to Mclovin2991
quote:
that is bullshite! Yea, maybe the past 2 years bama has been better than us, but we have definently been the better team this decade! Bullshite comparison too!
His LSU & Auburn comparison seem accurate.
LSU vs. Bama: 23-45-5
Auburn vs. Bama: 33-40-1
This post was edited on 10/27/10 at 5:48 pm
Posted on 10/27/10 at 6:30 pm to Hitchcock
quote:
This guy is a typical Louisianian. Filled with self-loathing, unable to enjoy a modicum of success. Why so much hate?
Do yourself a favor, seek professional help.
The "we aint, we can't, we won't" mentality is typical loser BS. Do us all a favor and cut ties to this non-elite program. We'd be better off without you.
nice sid!!!
yes just enjoy the good times...... dude, how elite do u want?? looks like they r right there....pretty fking close....
Posted on 10/27/10 at 7:01 pm to pdxlsufan
quote:
We're paying Miles an elite salary because he were desperate to keep Michigan from taking him just before the SEC Championship in 2007... So we rewarded him for 2 3/4 very good seasons and banked on him delivering the national title in 2007. He did. But since then, we haven't gotten our money's worth. That's the chance you take when you offer a new contract. Miles wouldn't be making the salary he is if not for 2005-2007 and the fact that Michigan came calling when they did. LSU had to make a move so we did.
quote:
The highest paid coaches in the SEC are the ones who brought home a crystal football or two.
LSU is paying an elite price (in your words) because we have won 2 crystals, but LSU is not an elite school.
quote:
As of today, it's a weak claim at best. In the 2010s that may change. We could win a couple more crystal footballs and multiple SEC titles. Like every fan, I hope we do. I hope we win like Florida did in the 1990s. But based on our history, I wouldn't bet on it.
LSU is not an elite school (historically). Why keep paying an inflated price?
So, LSU is or is not paying too much for 2008-10?
Should LSU keep paying full freight and lower their expectations?
Posted on 10/27/10 at 7:09 pm to Fast Times @ LSU
quote:
LSU is paying an elite price (in your words) because we have won 2 crystals,
Did you read what I posted?
No. We're paying Miles elite money because the Skipper had to make Miles an offer to KEEP him from bolting to Michigan. We had to act fast or jeopardize spoiling our shot at a title. It was the week of the SECCG and the Skipper felt (correctly) that we had a chance to win another title and wanted to lock up Miles. Skip made a gamble and it paid off. In 2007. Since then, not so much.
quote:
LSU is not an elite school (historically). Why keep paying an inflated price?
So, LSU is or is not paying too much for 2008-10?
Oy vey. Sure we're paying too much in hindsight. But we didn't know that in 2007 when we made the contract offer. We couldn't have possibly known how things would play out in 2008-10. We still don't know how 2010 will finish.
You also have to remember that the upper half of the SEC pays a lot more than most conferences do. We're in an arms race with Georgia, Florida, Auburn, Bama, Tennessee and Arky and to a lesser degree Carolina and Ole Miss. Just like MAD in the Cold War, we've got to pay our coach more and more just to "close the missile gap".
Posted on 10/27/10 at 7:13 pm to pdxlsufan
quote:
Did you read what I posted?
Not only did i read it.
I reposted it for you.
Two Things:
1) LSU is paying an elite price.
2) In your opinion, LSU is not an elite school.
Does that not seem odd?
Posted on 10/27/10 at 7:16 pm to Fast Times @ LSU
Here is an appropriate website this thread can be logged under:
www.WhoGivesADayum.com
www.WhoGivesADayum.com
Posted on 10/27/10 at 7:17 pm to Fast Times @ LSU
quote:
LSU is not an elite school (historically). Why keep paying an inflated price?
So, LSU is or is not paying too much for 2008-10?
Should LSU keep paying full freight and lower their expectations?
LSU is 7-1 #13 in the Nation.
Looks like you'll be back to paying the bargain basement prices real soon
Posted on 10/27/10 at 7:20 pm to Fast Times @ LSU
quote:
Two Things:
1) LSU is paying an elite price.
2) In your opinion, LSU is not an elite school.
Does that not seem odd?
No. To put it in Miles-ese we have the WANT to be elite, ergo we're willing to take a chance to become elite and pay elite money. And if Miles doesn't work out, we won't be afraid to make another attempt to get to the elite level and stay there long enough to make a more credible claim to eliteness.
Don't like the decisions? Take it up with the Skipper.
He hired two coaches in two different sports who each won a national title and the Skipper knows a thing or two about turning a non elite program into an elite program. If at first you don't succeed, try try again...
This post was edited on 10/27/10 at 7:22 pm
Posted on 10/27/10 at 7:41 pm to Hitchcock
quote:
His LSU & Auburn comparison seem accurate.
LSU vs. Bama: 23-45-5
Auburn vs. Bama: 33-40-1
Yea for overall records against bama, but I'm talking about this decade. My point is that the op is trying to say bama has always been a top tier team and LSU is not, which is not true, especially when you look at this past decade.
Posted on 10/27/10 at 7:54 pm to Mclovin2991
quote:
My point is that the op is trying to say bama has always been a top tier team
Nope. Never said it.
In fact, I pointed out 6 years in the 2000s when Bama was mediocre or awful. Those are 6 of the 7 years LSU managed to beat Bama.
Elite programs don't have to have elite results every goddamn year. If they did, no program would ever be considered elite. No program can be that damn good every year. But you do have to reassert your eliteness by periodically winning a MNC or going on a spurt of awesomeness. Something LSU has thus far done every 40 years or so. Thus far. The 2010s may change that. Or we may fall back right towards our historic norm.
No one seriously disputes that Bama's claim to be an elite team. And if Bama isn't, then NO ONE IN THE SEC CAN MAKE THAT CLAIM. And if you read all 15 pages of this thread, you won't find anyone seriously disputing Bama's status as an elite team.
This post was edited on 10/27/10 at 7:56 pm
Posted on 10/27/10 at 9:19 pm to pdxlsufan
quote:
No one seriously disputes that Bama's claim to be an elite team. And if Bama isn't, then NO ONE IN THE SEC CAN MAKE THAT CLAIM. And if you read all 15 pages of this thread, you won't find anyone seriously disputing Bama's status as an elite team.
And I am not denying that Bama is not an elite team! If u correctly read what I wrote then u should realize that I'm not disputing that Bama is not am elite team. I'm trying to figure out how in the hell u think LSU is not an elite team! I'll even day that LSU might not have been an "elite" team at the start of this decade, but there is no way in he'll that u can argue that LSU hasn't asserted itself as an "elite" team!!
Posted on 10/27/10 at 9:29 pm to pdxlsufan
Alright, now that we have decided we are an elite program, let's act like it... Fan base included
Posted on 10/27/10 at 10:51 pm to pdxlsufan
dipshit.
Posted on 10/28/10 at 12:09 am to Mclovin2991
quote:
I'll even day that LSU might not have been an "elite" team at the start of this decade, but there is no way in he'll that u can argue that LSU hasn't asserted itself as an "elite" team!!
I think I need the Miles-ese translator to decipher what the hell you just said... but I'll guess at what you just said.
Since it sounds like you concede LSU wasn't elite at the start of the 2000s (I would agree), then we're really arguing about whether LSU's performance in the 2000s vaulted us once and for all into elitedom. Briefly, yes. But to be an elite you have to stay there and when you slip (as all programs, even the elite ones, inevitably do) get back there in some reasonable period. LSU had almost 40 years in between the mid 2000s spurt and our last elite-like spurt in the late 50s and early 60s. And if it takes another 40 years to do it again, that ain't elite. The clock is ticking. If we want to prove ourselves worthy of the elite title, we've got to follow the example of our baseball team and get back to the show. Otherwise, we'll remain a historically damn good program with occasional spurts of greatness every 40 years or so. But not elite.
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