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Shaq needs a dominant 2 guard to win championships

Posted on 6/25/09 at 12:24 am
Posted by westcoastf00l
Member since Aug 2005
1456 posts
Posted on 6/25/09 at 12:24 am
or get to the finals

Look at his resume.
Posted by Archie Bengal Bunker
Member since Jun 2008
15595 posts
Posted on 6/25/09 at 12:26 am to
Posted by mattz1122
Member since Oct 2007
55394 posts
Posted on 6/25/09 at 12:27 am to
Michael Redd
Posted by AlexLSU
Member since Jan 2005
25341 posts
Posted on 6/25/09 at 12:34 am to
Any great player needs good players to win an NBA title in the modern era, so congrats on the breakthrough.
Posted by lsutiger2486
Baton Rouge
Member since Nov 2007
6761 posts
Posted on 6/25/09 at 12:36 am to
So if he makes it to the finals and wins a championship he has proven himself. I mean Lebron is technically considered a 3 and I would call him more of a 3/4.

If the Cavs were to win next year he would be considered the piece of the puzzle that won three franchises championships. It would not be Shaq needs Kobe, Lebron, or Dewayne.
Posted by shel311
McKinney, Texas
Member since Aug 2004
112610 posts
Posted on 6/25/09 at 12:38 am to
quote:

Any great player needs good players to win an NBA title in the modern era, so congrats on the breakthrough.


So true.

This thread was groundbreaking.
Posted by Maximus
Member since Feb 2004
81390 posts
Posted on 6/25/09 at 12:43 am to
Jordan needs a Pippen. Look it up, he must have fricking sucked big dicks like your mother.
Posted by AlexLSU
Member since Jan 2005
25341 posts
Posted on 6/25/09 at 12:45 am to
Just do me a favor and name me the last NBA champion that had one star and no help. People need to STFU about Shaq and Kobe needing each other. Of course they needed each other. I guess they should have just toughed it out with Rick Fox, Mark Madsen, and Slava Medvedenko.
Posted by lsutiger2486
Baton Rouge
Member since Nov 2007
6761 posts
Posted on 6/25/09 at 1:02 am to
quote:

People need to STFU about Shaq and Kobe needing each other.


I think the only reason the Kobe needed to win without Shaq thing existed because people were trying to put Kobe there with Jordan. Kobe is obviously not close to Jordan. Most honest people feel Shaq was the lead man at the time.

If people weren't comparing Kobe to Jordan you wouldn't hear anything about it.
Posted by shel311
McKinney, Texas
Member since Aug 2004
112610 posts
Posted on 6/25/09 at 1:08 am to
quote:

Most honest people feel Shaq was the lead man at the time.


Kobe was definitely not the lead man.

That's why it was a big deal. Kobe's going to go down as a top 5 GOAT when he's done, but(for me at least), he had to lead a team to a title in order to crack that top 5 one day.

Now he has, so he's gonna be a shoe in. This title was BIG for Kobe's legacy, no doubt about it.
Posted by AlexLSU
Member since Jan 2005
25341 posts
Posted on 6/25/09 at 1:14 am to
Shaq was the lead man in 00 and 01, but the Lakers don't even have a 2000 title without Kobe. He came up huge as a youngster to carry them through game 7 against Portland while Shaq was having a poor game.

They needed each other equally in the sense that neither would have won shite without the other. Portland, Sacramento, and Sacramento would have NBA rings if one of the two players were out of the equation.

And Kobe is close to MJ in a sense of all time ranking and SG rankings. People who just say "he is not close" are hopefully saying that because of the point he is at in his career. Kobe is top 10 now and is on pace to hold a shite load more records. He isn't MJ and probably never will be BETTER, but he is in the realm.
Posted by BevoEatsTigers
Member since Jun 2009
48 posts
Posted on 6/25/09 at 2:40 am to
This is the only 1 star NBA champion I can think of

1994 Houston Rockets

HAKEEM OLAJUWON 34 Center 6-11 250 30 Houston, 1984
OTIS THORPE 33 Power Forward 6-10 248 31 Providence, 1984
VERNON MAXWELL 11 Shooting Guard 6-4 190 28 Florida, 1988
KENNY SMITH 30 Point Guard 6-3 170 28 North Carolina, 1987
CHRIS JENT 21 Guard 6-7 220 24 Ohio State, 1992
ROBERT HORRY 25 Forward 6-10 230 23 Alabama, 1992
MARIO ELIE 17 Guard/Forward 6-5 225 29 American International, 1985
SAM CASSELL 10 Point Guard 6-3 185 23 Florida State, 1993
SCOTT BROOKS 1 Point Guard 5-11 165 28 UC-Irvine, 1987
CARL HERRERA 7 Power Forward 6-9 225 26 Houston, 1990
LARRY ROBINSON 20 Shooting Guard 6-3 180 25 Centenary, 1990
MATT BULLARD 50 Forward 6-10 228 26 Iowa, 1990
RICHARD PETRUSKA 3 Center 6-10 230 24 UCLA, 1993
EARL CURETON 35 Forward/Center 6-9 215 36 Detroit, Robert Morris, 1980
ERIC RILEY
Posted by shel311
McKinney, Texas
Member since Aug 2004
112610 posts
Posted on 6/25/09 at 2:48 am to
Hakeem had Drexler for both championships, didn't he?
Posted by BevoEatsTigers
Member since Jun 2009
48 posts
Posted on 6/25/09 at 3:05 am to
I'm pretty sure Drexler didn't get traded to Houston until the next year.

I know, it's hard to believe that lineup is championship worthy.
Posted by lsutiger2486
Baton Rouge
Member since Nov 2007
6761 posts
Posted on 6/25/09 at 3:13 am to
There was also no Jordan in the league.
Posted by BevoEatsTigers
Member since Jun 2009
48 posts
Posted on 6/25/09 at 3:16 am to
Yep.
Posted by xenythx
Member since Dec 2007
33233 posts
Posted on 6/25/09 at 3:26 am to
Correlation does not imply causation. Just because he's only played with great 2 guards during the prime of his career doesn't mean he couldn't have done it with just an above average sidekick as opposed to guys like Kobe and Wade. Heck, Penny was good but he wasn't exactly an all-time great and Orlando still almost won a title.
Posted by AlexLSU
Member since Jan 2005
25341 posts
Posted on 6/25/09 at 8:10 am to
Good example, but I said great players need good players around them to win a title. Those Rockets don't have the star power as other champs for sure, but after Hakeem, the next 5 scorers averaged:

14, 14, 12, 10, 9 points per game. For reference, their next 5 scorers averaged 58ppg, while this year's Lakers' next 5 averaged 62ppg. Also, 14 of those points from LAL came from Bynum, who all but disappeared in the playoffs.

Posted by TulaneTigerFan
Seattle
Member since Sep 2005
35856 posts
Posted on 6/25/09 at 8:20 am to
quote:

And Kobe is close to MJ in a sense of all time ranking and SG rankings. People who just say "he is not close" are hopefully saying that because of the point he is at in his career.


nah, he's really not close. jordan dominated his peers at a level that kobe has never gotten close to. even if kobe were to win another 2 titles his other career achievements would fall way short of jordan's. MJ is so far out ahead of whoever ends up finishing as the #2 guard all time
Posted by AlexLSU
Member since Jan 2005
25341 posts
Posted on 6/25/09 at 8:26 am to
Kobe will more than likely finish ahead of MJ in points and could come close titles wise.

Kobe's current career averages are 25ppg 5rpg 5apg on 46% shooting, while MJ's are 30ppg, 6rpg, 6apg on 50% shooting. Truly remarkable that he shot 50% for a career (a lot of which was watered down from his time with Washington). Kobe should finish around 26/27 ppg for a career with the same assist/rebound numbers. He will have more points if he stays healthy as well.

He won't pass Jordan, but yeah, he will be close. Not close as in a coin toss between the two, but close as in one of the greatest players ever. I think Kobe has faced better teams throughout the years than Jordan, especially in the mid 90s.
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