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You conveniently skipped over the preceding 4 verses of chapter 2 where we are to seek and give prayers and intercession by and for all people, and that this is pleasing to God.

NONE of whom are dead people.

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This is not the Catholic teaching, and the Council of Trent actually condemns works based salvation.

Yet it lays it upon people within the RCC with works. Lip service to the truth, but in reality it lays upon them sacraments as well as gives them no assurance of salvation Christ gifted us with, dooming them to some purgatory place of existence they have to pay their way out of. Nothing says works as much as that does.

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Another contradiction.

There is no contradiction at all. Salvation is a free gift. If someone gives me a gift, I don’t pay for it, work it off, or even earn it.

I receive it or I reject it. Believing is accepting the gift given.

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Can you show me where scripture says he was not baptized?

Also, can you show me where this thief had true saving faith in Christ as the Messiah, and not some generic belief that Jesus was an important innocent figure? This is the same faith Muslims and Mormans have about who and what Jesus was, which you would say isn't saving faith.

Another contradiction.

Oh....and he was crucified when the Davidic covenant was still in place. So he was saved through circumcision and works of the OT law.

The man was a thief on a cross. To one side of Christ a believer who testified of that, and the other an unbeliever.

Romans 10:9-10 also confirms this.

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That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

That’s it.

But you are wrong that Muslims believe upon Christ alone for their salvation. They do not believe in Christ as their savior, or that He is God in human flesh. They attribute Him to being a prophet, and I think you know that already.

The Davidic covenant saved NOBODY. The law also saved no one. The law condemned, and if you read scripture, it’s crystal clear on that point. Christ was needed to overcome the law, for if you think anyone is going to appeal to God through keeping of the law, and not be found guilty of offending even one part of the law, meaning they are guilty of the penalty of sin, then you are only fooling yourself.

The perfect Passover Lamb’s blood is the only thing that will cause spiritual death to pass you by. That’s it, and that’s been the plan since the very beginning. Only faith in that saves.

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Posted by Stitches

Member since Oct 2019

917 posts

Posted on 10/18/23 at 5:35 pm to Mike da Tigah

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NONE of whom are dead people.

So you're saying God lied when he said he's God of the living NOT the dead.

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Yet it lays it upon people within the RCC with works. Lip service to the truth, but in reality it lays upon them sacraments as well as gives them no assurance of salvation Christ gifted us with, dooming them to some purgatory place of existence they have to pay their way out of. Nothing says works as much as that does

None of this is even remotely true. The RCC teaches you have assurance of salvation, just not an absolute assurance. Purgatory isn't a place, its a process. You can't buy your way out of it either. None of that is a "work".

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I receive it or I reject it. Believing is accepting the gift given.

Earlier you said you play absolutely no part in your salvation. Now you're saying it's contingent upon you believing. Which is it? You're continuing to contradict yourself.

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The man was a thief on a cross. To one side of Christ a believer who testified of that, and the other an unbeliever.

Romans 10:9-10 also confirms this.

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That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

So one has to believe in Christ rising from the dead to be saved.....which the thief didn't do, because Jesus hadn't died yet. Exactly my point.

He definitely didn't have faith in the risen Christ, he may have been baptized, but he definitely died under the Davidic covenant.

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But you are wrong that Muslims believe upon Christ alone for their salvation. They do not believe in Christ as their savior, or that He is God in human flesh. They attribute Him to being a prophet, and I think you know that already.

That's not what I said. I said they believe Jesus to be an important figure basically, and not that he was the risen messiah.....just like the good thief.