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Started By
Message
3
Posted on 7/8/14 at 1:51 pm to ZereauxSum
quote:
How does that prove that Apple created the problem intentionally?
What's the difference between intentionally creating a problem, and failing to fix or even address an obvious problem for years?
And this problem that you feel they created unintentionally is something that is discussed on day 1 of the design process. It's a very simple question: what happens to messages that our system fails to deliver because the customer can no longer access them? If the answer is that they just sit there until they are deleted 30 days later, that is what's typically termed a 'showstopper'.
Posted on 7/8/14 at 1:53 pm to Brettesaurus Rex
quote:
I don't give a shite what others do
quote:
The True Differences Between Apple and Android and which may be better for you.
quote:
If you like having all those options, then Android may be for you.
On the other hand, Apple takes great care and measure to make sure they anything and everything they add to their ecosystem works flawlessly and does not deteriorate from the overall experience and connectedness of iOS. If you like that aspect of your OS, then Apple may be for you.
Posted on 7/8/14 at 1:53 pm to Brettesaurus Rex
quote:So you've spent the last 3 days telling us why you stick with Apple because...
I don't give a shite what others do
Posted on 7/8/14 at 2:20 pm to Korkstand
quote:
You can use iMessage on an iPhone without an Apple ID. Your iMessage account is tied to your phone number, and it can only be deactivated on the phone itself.
Fair enough, but most people who buy iPhones set up an Apple ID because you do need it for the App Store, iCloud, find my phone, and iTunes (radio and store).
And it's right in the middle of the setup process. You'd have to deliberately skip it and the prompts telling you that you won't be able to use most of the services on the phone.
quote:
If a company that I am no longer a customer of prevents me from receiving text messages, which they have nothing to do with, I think "shitty" is putting it nicely.
"Preventing?" And "nothing to do with"?
The messages go through their servers. You're talking like they're stalking people and snatching them out of the air after the user has left
Look, I've said repeatedly that it's a problem that Apple needs to fix. It's quite obviously their problem. It's inconvenient to have to call apples customer service. I get that. But we'll really have to agree to disagree on this because while it's a problem, I just don't feel like this is some crime on the level of genocide.
quote:
if the messages fail to go through for a couple days, they could very easily send you an actual SMS message asking for a response from you, and that response could have them turn off iMessage and they could help you retrieve the undelivered messages.
This is actually a pretty good idea.
quote:
but instead they just don't do anything about it other than cause problems for people new to Android.
It's all about android isn't it?
I'll stop ignoring the fact that this happens on windows phones and blackberries so that I can point out that this happens on windows phones and blackberries.
Posted on 7/8/14 at 2:23 pm to Korkstand
quote:
What's the difference between intentionally creating a problem, and failing to fix or even address an obvious problem for years?
One is malicious and one is not?
Maybe it's incompetence, maybe it's a lack of resources, maybe they haven't found a solution that they find acceptable.
Who knows? But there is a hell of a lot of difference between that and creating issues with your services on purpose.
Posted on 7/8/14 at 2:23 pm to Korkstand
quote:
So you've spent the last 3 days telling us why you stick with Apple because...
Posted on 7/8/14 at 2:27 pm to ZereauxSum
quote:
address an obvious problem for years?
quote:
Maybe it's incompetence, maybe it's a lack of resources, maybe they haven't found a solution that they find acceptable.
wait
is this your final answer?
that no one at apple..the company y'all claim is the most innovative on the planet..can fix a basic messaging bug that just so happens to make all non-apple phones appear defective?
This post was edited on 7/8/14 at 2:27 pm
Posted on 7/8/14 at 2:31 pm to CAD703X
quote:
that no one at apple..the company y'all claim is the most innovative on the planet..can fix a basic messaging bug that just so happens to make all non-apple phones appear defective?
First, find where I've ever said that Apple is the most innovative company in the world, or anything remotely close to this.
Second, I have no clue why they haven't fixed it. Like I said, it could be a number of things including and not limited to sheer incompetence.
My point has been, is, and remains that it is hard to believe that Apple created this issue intentionally. If you want to believe this because it fuels your well-documented hatred for Apple then go for it.
Posted on 7/8/14 at 2:40 pm to ZereauxSum
quote:
My point has been, is, and remains that it is hard to believe that Apple created this issue intentionally. If you want to believe this because it fuels your well-documented hatred for Apple then go for it.
if the issue was that the apple iMessage server had been breached by hackers and sending spam to all the phone #s stored there, you think it would still be happening 4 years later?
you can say i have a well-documented hatred for apple but i also have 25+ years of experience writing and debugging software code and like kork said, its very hard to believe this issue is so unsolvable by the collective minds at apple unless they simply DONT CARE.
Posted on 7/8/14 at 2:44 pm to ZereauxSum
quote:Yes, "preventing", and yes, "nothing to do with". The messages go through their servers because their servers have instructed all of your contacts' phones to do so. And their servers make little effort to inform either party that messages are not being delivered. Messages that are supposed to be delivered in near-real-time, but that may sit undelivered for 30 days before being deleted. Do you not find this unacceptable as a standard procedure?
"Preventing?" And "nothing to do with"?
The messages go through their servers. You're talking like they're stalking people and snatching them out of the air after the user has left
quote:Nobody said it's on the level of genocide, but it is on the level of anti-competitive practices.
Look, I've said repeatedly that it's a problem that Apple needs to fix. It's quite obviously their problem. It's inconvenient to have to call apples customer service. I get that. But we'll really have to agree to disagree on this because while it's a problem, I just don't feel like this is some crime on the level of genocide.
quote:Ok, let's include the little guys, too. No, it's not all about Android, it's only 90% about Android.
It's all about android isn't it?
I'll stop ignoring the fact that this happens on windows phones and blackberries so that I can point out that this happens on windows phones and blackberries.
quote:I know, and I just pulled it out of my arse. Why can't Apple come up with 40 better ways to do it after several years of complaints?quote:This is actually a pretty good idea.
if the messages fail to go through for a couple days, they could very easily send you an actual SMS message asking for a response from you, and that response could have them turn off iMessage and they could help you retrieve the undelivered messages.
Posted on 7/8/14 at 2:46 pm to Korkstand
quote:
I know, and I just pulled it out of my arse. Why can't Apple come up with 40 better ways to do it after several years of complaints?
Because 90% of people think that they aren't getting messages because their new phone "sucks."
Posted on 7/8/14 at 2:49 pm to CAD703X
quote:
if the issue was that the apple iMessage server had been breached by hackers and sending spam to all the phone #s stored there, you think it would still be happening 4 years later?
This isn't even remotely the same level of problem.
quote:
unless they simply DONT CARE.
I'd believe this before I believe that Apple has created a persistent issue in iMessage simply to stick it to people switching away from iPhones just to make android look bad when it has only made Apple look bad to anyone who gives it a few seconds of thought.
Posted on 7/8/14 at 3:04 pm to ZereauxSum
quote:
One is malicious and one is not?
Failure to address a problem with your product for several years, a problem that is easily fixed by any number of solutions, a problem that isn't obviously your fault, and a problem that just so happens to make your competitors look bad to the uninformed, is most certainly malicious.
quote:I could buy that if we were talking about Microsoft.
Maybe it's incompetence
quote:I could buy that if we were talking about Blackberry.
maybe it's a lack of resources
quote:Any solution is more acceptable than simply not delivering messages. Especially after years of complaints. Would you agree?
maybe they haven't found a solution that they find acceptable
Just as examples, as alternatives to the solution I proposed earlier, they could:
Inform the senders of undelivered messages that they haven't been received, and prompt a resend as SMS. Android handles undelivered messages similarly, with a small but noticeable icon on conversations with an unsent message, and the same icon next to the specific message that hasn't gone through.
Email the user (if there is an address associated with the user) to inform them of undelivered messages.
MAKE IMESSAGE ACCESSIBLE ON THE WEB, OR ON OTHER PLATFORMS.
It just goes on and on, man. There are so many ways to handle this, that to not handle it at all amounts to malicious negligence.
Posted on 7/8/14 at 3:09 pm to Korkstand
quote:
Yes, "preventing", and yes, "nothing to do with". The messages go through their servers because their servers have instructed all of your contacts' phones to do so. And their servers make little effort to inform either party that messages are not being delivered. Messages that are supposed to be delivered in near-real-time, but that may sit undelivered for 30 days before being deleted. Do you not find this unacceptable as a standard procedure?
I find this to be an inconvenient problem that should have been fixed a long time ago. Sure, it's unacceptable in the sense that Apple always boasts about it's products "just working", but I still don't see any indication that this is deliberate.
quote:
Nobody said it's on the level of genocide, but it is on the level of anti-competitive practices.
How is this anti-competitive? The only ones who are being harmed here is Apple. It's their problem and everyone knows it.
If this had happened to me in the days (hours, minutes?) before everyone figured out what was going on, I would never buy another Apple product and I sure as hell wouldn't go back to my old one.
Posted on 7/8/14 at 3:12 pm to ZereauxSum
quote:
I'd believe this before I believe that Apple has created a persistent issue in iMessage simply to stick it to people switching away from iPhones just to make android look bad when it has only made Apple look bad to anyone who gives it a few seconds of thought.
Well, you are in a thread full of people who have given it more than a few seconds of thought. And yeah, it makes Apple look bad. So, whether it's intentional or not, malicious or not... it makes Apple look bad regardless. Why have they not offered a solution? Companies aren't in the business of looking bad. Unless, of course, looking bad to some is more profitable than looking good. No matter how you look at it, the lack of a fix has to be intentional. There is just absolutely no way that the company with more resources than any other on the face of the earth hasn't been able to elegantly solve this problem, if they actually wanted to.
Posted on 7/8/14 at 3:17 pm to ZereauxSum
quote:
The only ones who are being harmed here is Apple. It's their problem and everyone knows it.
o rly?
i'm saying the average iphone purchaser doesn't go beyond 'well imessage only works on an iphone of course since its an apple product. duh.'
you really think they see a problem here or understand what is truly going on if they switch to another phone?
really?
"everyone knows it"
This post was edited on 7/8/14 at 3:19 pm
Posted on 7/8/14 at 3:18 pm to ZereauxSum
quote:Then you aren't listening to reason.
I still don't see any indication that this is deliberate.
quote:Because the problem manifests itself in a way that makes it seem as though the problem is with either the cell provider or with the competitor's device.
How is this anti-competitive?
quote:Not true. If it were, they would have fixed it by now.
The only ones who are being harmed here is Apple.
quote:Everyone? That seems awfully embarrassing. But even if as many as 90% of those who try to switch know what the problem is, that leaves 10% that will go back to iPhone who otherwise might not have.
It's their problem and everyone knows it.
Posted on 7/8/14 at 3:21 pm to Korkstand
Googles stock had dropped 11 points today.
#tDecline is real
#tDecline is real
Posted on 7/8/14 at 3:26 pm to Brettesaurus Rex
quote:
I don't give a shite what others do
You're regressing.
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