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re: Is Carlos Beltran a Hall of Famer?
Posted on 8/30/15 at 2:00 pm to Lester Earl
Posted on 8/30/15 at 2:00 pm to Lester Earl
But you already see that "advantage" in the stats. Maybe without switch-hitting, Beltran would have been a .270 career hitter instead of .281. So why should being a switch hitter get him an even further bump in HOF consideration? It's like he's being rewarded for it twice.
1
Posted on 8/30/15 at 2:02 pm to LSU82BILL
quote:
you rarely hear about Williams in the conversation as the greatest hitter of all time
He's one of the guys who is ALWAYS brought up in that conversation
Posted on 8/30/15 at 2:02 pm to LSU82BILL
quote:
Switch hitting doesn't make a hitters accomplishments more impressive.
you're not in touch with reality if you think that.
Posted on 8/30/15 at 2:05 pm to Buckeye Fan 19
quote:
But you already see that "advantage" in the stats. Maybe without switch-hitting, Beltran would have been a .270 career hitter instead of .281. So why should being a switch hitter get him an even further bump in HOF consideration? It's like he's being rewarded for it twice.
because switch hitting is hard. Yes, there is an advantage if you are good at it. Not many are good at it though, which is why it becomes important in his HOF candidacy
Posted on 8/30/15 at 2:07 pm to Lester Earl
quote:
I dont think Lofton is a HOF though.
You drinkin today???????????????? Lofton is the 2nd best leadoff hitter in MLB history,,,,,,,,,,
Posted on 8/30/15 at 2:13 pm to dukke v
quote:
Lofton is the 2nd best leadoff hitter in MLB history,,,,,,,,,,
pete rose, ichiro, tim raines, craig biggio > Lofton
Posted on 8/30/15 at 2:13 pm to Lester Earl
Player A:
1204 Runs
434 Home Runs
1289 RBIs
11 OPS+
152 Steals
67.1 WAR
10 Gold Gloves
5 All Star
Player B
1432 Runs
386 HR
1423 RBIS
311 SB
65.5 WAR
8 ASG
3 GG
Player C
1528 Runs
130 HR
781 RBI
622 Steals
62.4 WAR
6 ASG
4 Gold GLoves
1204 Runs
434 Home Runs
1289 RBIs
11 OPS+
152 Steals
67.1 WAR
10 Gold Gloves
5 All Star
Player B
1432 Runs
386 HR
1423 RBIS
311 SB
65.5 WAR
8 ASG
3 GG
Player C
1528 Runs
130 HR
781 RBI
622 Steals
62.4 WAR
6 ASG
4 Gold GLoves
This post was edited on 8/30/15 at 2:23 pm
Posted on 8/30/15 at 2:14 pm to dukke v
quote:
Lofton is the 2nd best leadoff hitter in MLB history,,,,,,,,,
3.2% in his only year on the ballot. He is off the ballot.
Posted on 8/30/15 at 2:16 pm to Lester Earl
Yeah. It's really awesome that he can switch hit. And it helps him beat pitchers. You shouldn't give more credit for doing it. The credit is already in the stats.
Posted on 8/30/15 at 2:17 pm to Lester Earl
I think this goes back to the means vs. ends thing. Basically, your argument would be, all else being equal, a .300 only right-handed hitter is not as good of a hitter as a .300 switch-hitter, and I disagree. They're the same. (The right-handed hitter would probably be better against lefty pitchers than the switch-hitter but the switch-hitter would probably be better against righty pitchers than the right-handed hitter. But overall, they're equal.)
Posted on 8/30/15 at 2:19 pm to Buckeye Fan 19
quote:
I think this goes back to the means vs. ends thing. Basically, your argument would be, all else being equal, a .300 only right-handed hitter is not as good of a hitter as a .300 switch-hitter, and I disagree. They're the same. (The right-handed hitter would probably be better against lefty pitchers than the switch-hitter but the switch-hitter would probably be better against righty pitchers than the right-handed hitter. But overall, they're equal.)
Thank you. It's like if I was giving a basketball player credit for hitting tougher shots when he was just as useful as player who took and made easier shots. Cool. It's impressive that you are making tougher shots, but the object of the game is to score.
Posted on 8/30/15 at 2:19 pm to SwaggerCopter
So by your same reasoning players shouldn't be compared to their peers at respective positions?
31, I think both should be in. Jones on his defense alone presents a great case for him
31, I think both should be in. Jones on his defense alone presents a great case for him
Posted on 8/30/15 at 2:21 pm to Lester Earl
That isn't my reasoning at all. You aren't that stupid.
Posted on 8/30/15 at 2:23 pm to Lester Earl
Got in an argument with ScubaBlake and 950 the other day. Pudge: Yes or no?
Posted on 8/30/15 at 2:26 pm to LSU82BILL
quote:
but you rarely hear about Williams in the conversation as the greatest hitter of all time
WTF?????????????
Posted on 8/30/15 at 2:28 pm to SwaggerCopter
That's basically what you're saying. That him switch hitting doesn't matter, because in the end he produces stats like any other player.
Whereas the HOF is weighed heavily on positions & sub categories comparative to their peers. The fact that he was a great switch hitter comparative to the norm will be a big part of his candidacy.
Start going down the line and see where he ranks among switch hitters. His 386 HRs aren't overly impressive on the surface. But compared to switch hitters it's near the top. When you are in that company you simply can't just compare him to a normal right handed hitter. Because if they could switch hit, they would
Whereas the HOF is weighed heavily on positions & sub categories comparative to their peers. The fact that he was a great switch hitter comparative to the norm will be a big part of his candidacy.
Start going down the line and see where he ranks among switch hitters. His 386 HRs aren't overly impressive on the surface. But compared to switch hitters it's near the top. When you are in that company you simply can't just compare him to a normal right handed hitter. Because if they could switch hit, they would
Posted on 8/30/15 at 2:29 pm to Lester Earl
quote:The end result is the only thing that should matter.
you're not in touch with reality if you think that.
If 2 players have the exact same career, I don't see any reason to give the one who is a switch hitter any added advantage, he wasn't any better in the hypothetical.
Posted on 8/30/15 at 2:30 pm to Lester Earl
quote:if you're a righty, isn't hitting off of righty SPs hard as well?
because switch hitting is hard
Posted on 8/30/15 at 2:30 pm to lsu31always
Steroid allegations aside, pudge yes. Lock
Posted on 8/30/15 at 2:33 pm to Lester Earl
quote:
pete rose, ichiro, tim raines, craig biggio > Lofton
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