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re: Bucks and Magic are boycotting tonight's game UPDATE All games postponed

Posted on 8/29/20 at 2:16 pm to
Posted by shel311
McKinney, Texas
Member since Aug 2004
111704 posts
Posted on 8/29/20 at 2:16 pm to
quote:

That isn’t going to help his case at all I dont think,

I know the "we must have watched different videos" joke gets thrown around a lot but I'm truly wondering if you watched a different video to come to these opinions. Everything you say is just not rational at all based on the video.

quote:

Basically Kyle hears something and turns around and wildly fires his gun
Like this, for example. Did you not watch the video where he retreated until he could no longer retreat then shot his gun at the very last moment before the attacker attacked him?

quote:

That is not self defense in response to identifiable mortal harm, that is reactionary and indiscriminate gunfire. And chasing someone is not identifiable mortal harm.
If you can't logically say he could reasonably for great bodily harm in that mob with that dude chasing him, you're not even striving for objectivity at this point.

quote:

I can not say enough, this is NOT a stand your ground state
Yep, and Kyle did NOT stand his ground, he retreated from his aggressor until he could not retreat any more and the aggressor was about to attack him. That happened, factually. It's on video. Kyle 100% did not stand his ground, he had a duty to retreat, and he did retreat.

quote:

I was tired of retreating, or a I was worried that gunfire was aimed toward me, or the gunfire startled me, despite not being in a position to see it or orientate anything, is not justification to start indiscriminately shooting at someone.
I don't think indiscriminately means what you think it means. He shot the guy chasing him trying to attack him. I don't think he missed, I think all shots hit the guy trying to attack him. That's almost literally the opposite of indiscriminately shooting. He shot at one specific guy, the attacker.

quote:

And if you are someone that just saw this kid shoot someone in the head, he is a murderer and a threat
What? He is not automatically a murderer. It very well could be self defense.

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but the logic some seem to be imploring is absurd, that because he feels threatened by people that might try to disarm him for killing someone
Did you watch the video? They were not trying to disarm him, they were attacking him. One dude hit him with a skateboard, the other dude had a gun and said he wished had had unloaded his entire clip sooner on Kyle. They were not trying to subdue, so why are you trying to say that is what they were trying to do? Very disingenuous on your part, one guy even admitted to it and you're STILL saying the guy didn't have that intention?

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But of course if feeling threatened is a justifiable reason to kill
Yes or no, was Kyle under a threat of physical attack in both videos? Yes or no...

quote:

if you just thought this guy was stalking you with a gun in approaching you, under that logic, you have the right to shoot him because you feel mortally threatened.
Didn't you reference the law earlier? The law says you have a duty to retreat. They were literally going towards him and after him. Everything you're saying is irrelevant to what we saw in the video, nothing is logical about any of these points you've made in this post, almost everything you've said is the complete opposite of what we can see in videos.

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It’s absurd and gets to the absurdity of a lot of self defense logic
Are you on record saying Kyle was never under any threat of physical harm in both videos? Yes or no...

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As to the charges, this is a racist police department and racist city, I suspect, and would not be surprised, if most of those charges are actually designed to be unprovable and therefore allow him to get off.
You're just trying to set up your next excuse. You know darn well 1st degree murder isn't in play here, so now you'll just set up an excuse to say the city is racist so he got off, nevermind that the racist city just overcharged this dude with 1st degree murder for shooting guys who were clearly attacking him while he retreated, again factually speaking.

It is an indisputable fact that he is retreating in both videos, and also indisputable that he shot guys who were physically attacking him. You trying to pretend he should have never felt any danger whatsoever is disingenuous, to say the least.
This post was edited on 8/29/20 at 2:17 pm
Posted by Bronc
Member since Sep 2018
12646 posts
Posted on 8/29/20 at 2:33 pm to
How many times must this be repeated: Wisconsin IS NOT A STAND YOUR GROUND STATE!

You do not automatically have the right to unleash lethal force because someone is running at you or you hear a gunshot. You MUST demonstrate your life was in imminent mortal danger or imminent grave bodily harm. You must demonstrate you had no ability to further retreat. Chasing someone, especially without further context, Lunging at someone, especially without further context, deciding you don’t want to retreat anymore, is not that. Let alone when you swing around and fire indiscriminately and apparently shoot someone in the back after they are down.

The rest of your post largely becomes irrelevant because you are propping up arguments on unsupportable assumptions or injecting straw men. It seems clear you want certain narrative to be true, one that conforms to the points i made earlier, white guy hero, black people allies bad guys. Despite still not having any initial context for the situation, despite having to bend over backwards to claim jumping or chasing someone constitutes imminent mortal danger.
This post was edited on 8/29/20 at 2:41 pm
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