quote:
The existence of something that most people on the planet don't think exists is not a fact in their opinion but in reality it is a fact that sea serpents exist since I have the evidence that proves it is a fact that sea serpents exist.

quote:
And I'm the insane one?

Yes.

At least I have video and photographic evidence that proves my "claim" that sea serpents exist is correct.

quote:
If something actually exists then it is a fact it exists even if everyone on the planet thinks it doesn't exist.

quote:
Correct. What I'm trying to tell you is that no one can have an opinion that sea serpents exist, because such a statement is within the realm of the verifiable.

Meh, a lot of people can have the opinion that they believe sea serpents exist but there are only a few people who can have the opinion that they know it's a fact that sea serpents exist because they have seen with their own eyes the evidence that sea serpents exist.

I am one of those few people who know it's a fact that sea serpents exist.

quote:
In the case of sea serpents existing, it is a fact that my brother and I had a definitive close sighting of a sea serpent on February 5, 1985 even if everyone on the planet thinks we didn't have a definitive close sighting of a sea serpent on February 5, 1985.

quote:
I assume you're talking about the video we've all seen...

You assume wrong as usual.

I'm talking about my and my brother's first sighting of a sea serpent which occurred on February 5, 1985 when we saw the animal expose its entire body except for its tail above the surface of the water only 20 yards away from us.

We didn't take our first video of a sea serpent in SF Bay until 2004.

quote:
It is your opinion that your "sighting" was "close". In my opinion, that "sighting" was "far away". So far, in fact, that there is absolutely nothing definitive proven by that tape.

Now that you know I am talking about my and my brother's first sighting of a sea serpent from only 20 yards away, is it your "opinion" that 20 yards is a close sighting?

quote:
My apologies if you're talking about another sighting which was not captured on video, in which case there is zero evidence to verify that fact. I would refer to that as an unproven fact, or just generally a claim. It is definitely not an opinion.

You don't need to apologize to me for your own ignorance.

It doesn't matter if everyone on the planet except me believes that sea serpents don't exist. It's still a fact that sea serpents actually exist even if they haven't seen any evidence for the existence of sea serpents.

quote:
If I see a mountain lion in my backyard and tell my neighbors that it is a fact there was a mountain lion in my backyard but my neighbors don't believe it is a fact that there was a mountain lion in my backyard because there has never been a sighting of a mountain lion in that area and there is no evidence in my backyard that a mountain lion was in my back yard, my neighbors' disbelief does not alter the fact that a mountain lion was in my backyard and that I saw it in my backyard.

quote:
All correct.

Since you agree with that statement then when "mountain lion" is replaced with "sea serpent. you must also agree with the statement.

quote:
An opinion that is based on facts can be a fact even if no one believes that opinion can be a fact.

quote:
Ugh.

If you make a statement or claim that is based on facts (as opposed to based on feelings, views, or beliefs), then it is not an opinion. If the claim is phrased in a way that makes it verifiable, then it is not an opinion.

Many opinions are based on facts which are verifiable.

A good example is when before we ever sent a man to the moon, scientists had the opinion that we could send a man to the moon based on the laws of physics and other scientific facts.

quote:
Again, by example:

Grapes are the best fruit.
Trump is the greatest threat to social justice in america today.

Both of those statements are strictly opinions. They express the views or beliefs of a particular person. Neither can be verified or disproved. There cannot exist a piece of evidence that makes either statement true or false. That is just the way the language works, man. It doesn't matter how strongly you believe either statement to be incorrect; you cannot invalidate an opinion via your own opposing opinion. I don't know what else to say to help you to understand.

You use examples of opinions that deal with what is the "best" or "greatest" which are subjective in nature.

Some opinions don't deal with what is subjective such as when scientists had the opinion that we can send a man to the moon because their opinion was based on actual scientific laws and facts that were known at the time.

The definition of opinion is, "a view or judgment formed about something, not necessarily based on fact or knowledge."

That means an opinion may be based on facts.

This post was edited on 9/29/17 at 10:48 am

1 Jump to Post ...

Report Post Jump to Post

Posted by Korkstand

Member since Nov 2003

28890 posts

Posted on 9/29/17 at 11:56 am to DawgfaninCa

quote:
Meh, a lot of people can have the opinion that they believe sea serpents exist but there are only a few people who can have the opinion that they know it's a fact that sea serpents exist because they have seen with their own eyes the evidence that sea serpents exist.

I am one of those few people who know it's a fact that sea serpents exist.

Ugh, I'm trying to tell you that "opinion" is not the right word to use here.

quote:
You assume wrong as usual.

I'm talking about my and my brother's first sighting of a sea serpent which occurred on February 5, 1985 when we saw the animal expose its entire body except for its tail above the surface of the water only 20 yards away from us.

We didn't take our first video of a sea serpent in SF Bay until 2004.

Well, you'll have to excuse my incorrect assumption. In my defense, the quality of your 2004 video looks like it was shot in the 80s.

quote:
Now that you know I am talking about my and my brother's first sighting of a sea serpent from only 20 yards away, is it your "opinion" that 20 yards is a close sighting?

Yeah, 20 yards is pretty close for a giant sea serpent sighting. IMO.

quote:
You don't need to apologize to me for your own ignorance.

Then please pardon me for being ignorant of your own personal life experiences.

quote:
It doesn't matter if everyone on the planet except me believes that sea serpents don't exist. It's still a fact that sea serpents actually exist even if they haven't seen any evidence for the existence of sea serpents.

We can't call it a fact without (much) more evidence. What we can say, though, is that your claim is a statement of fact (as opposed to a statement of opinion).

quote:
Since you agree with that statement then when "mountain lion" is replaced with "sea serpent. you must also agree with the statement.

Sure. If you say "I saw a sea serpent", that is a claim that can possibly be proven. If, instead, you say "I saw something that looked like a sea serpent", there is no way to dispute that. If it looked like a sea serpent to you, there is no way to prove or disprove that statement. It is an opinion.

quote:
Many opinions are based on facts which are verifiable.

A good example is when before we ever sent a man to the moon, scientists had the opinion that we could send a man to the moon based on the laws of physics and other scientific facts.

It's all in the phrasing. Words have meaning, you know. Yeah, some definitions are up for interpretation, but there's a pretty clear difference between "fact" and "opinion".

A claim that we can send a man to the moon is in no way an opinion. There is a very straightforward way to test the claim: send a man to the moon.

If someone were to say "I think we can send a man to the moon", that is an opinion. It is subjective, a statement based on what that person thinks. It may be possible to change that person's opinion by presenting or discovering new facts, but we can't test the opinion. We cannot falsify the opinion, because a person's thought is the person's thought. It is simply a fact that the opinion exists.

quote:
You use examples of opinions that deal with what is the "best" or "greatest" which are subjective in nature.

Are you starting to get it now?

quote:
Some opinions don't deal with what is subjective such as when scientists had the opinion that we can send a man to the moon because their opinion was based on actual scientific laws and facts that were known at the time.

Just because you call it an opinion doesn't make it an opinion. As I hope you are starting to understand, it depends on whether the phrasing is subjective or objective.

quote:
The definition of opinion is, "a view or judgment formed about something, not necessarily based on fact or knowledge."

That means an opinion may be based on facts.

Absolutely. If you were to go around spouting opinions that are not based on facts, then most would just call you a crazy person.

So let's talk about my opinion that grapes are the best fruit. First, grapes are indeed a fruit (fact). They are bite-sized (fact), which is convenient (opinion). They come in a variety of flavors to suit different tastes (fact). The peel is edible (fact), which is nice (opinion).

My opinions, and those of most of us, are usually based on facts. That does not change the fact that they are opinions.

2 Jump to Post ...

Report Post Jump to Post

Political Talk - Replies to Post

Return To Board

Page 1

Return To Board