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Books About Writing (Books)

Posted on 7/11/17 at 9:12 pm
Posted by PublixSubs
Maine
Member since Sep 2015
907 posts
Posted on 7/11/17 at 9:12 pm
Any recs? I majored in journalism, interned at the USA Today while in college, but in my mid 20s gave up writing b/c I could only do so if I was wasted or miserable.

Fast forward 15 years later...

Any other writers here? Advice? Books? Have plenty of ideas but need some direction. Any good books out there on writing? Strategy? TIA.
Posted by Decisions
Member since Mar 2015
1554 posts
Posted on 7/11/17 at 9:27 pm to
I've been working and rewriting on a book series since....around 6th grade. I'm still not even close to finished, but if there are two bits of advice I'd give any writer they would be:

1. Just write. Write every day. Write about everything, no matter how mundane or trivial. It doesn't have to be a lot. Just get some practice in writing about things and conveying thoughts, feelings, and scenes. Keep the gears turning and eventually the inspiration will come, usually from the strangest of places.

2. Hunt new experiences in your life. Go to a new restaurant, talk to strangers, try to pick up a musical instrument. Often times these challenges will get your brain in gear and moving in different ways than you normally do. A rut is the enemy of inspiration, if you ask me. Challenge yourself.

Pick it back up, bud! I always enjoy how it puts my mind in a different gear after a long day of work.
Posted by Kafka
I am the moral conscience of TD
Member since Jul 2007
151063 posts
Posted on 7/11/17 at 9:35 pm to
Starting from Scratch by Rita Mae Brown -- Good general introduction to writer's life and concerns

How to Write a Novel by John Braine -- Braine wrote the classic Room At The Top. Wm F Buckley used this as his guide when he started writing novels

Becoming a Writer by Dorothea Brande

Telling Lies for Fun & Profit: A Manual for Fiction Writers by Lawrence Block

If you're interested in screenwriting read Adventures In The Screen Trade by Wm Goldman (wrote Butch Cassidy & The Sundance Kid)
Posted by PublixSubs
Maine
Member since Sep 2015
907 posts
Posted on 7/11/17 at 9:52 pm to
Awesome advice and much appreciated!
Posted by PublixSubs
Maine
Member since Sep 2015
907 posts
Posted on 7/11/17 at 9:53 pm to
Kafka, thank you as well. I will look in to all of them.
Posted by LoveThatMoney
Who knows where?
Member since Jan 2008
12281 posts
Posted on 7/11/17 at 10:17 pm to
Books:
James Scott Bell's Plot and Structure. It is absolute gold.

Chris Fox's 5,000 Words Per Hour. It will help you set out good writing habits and provide some motivation.

Other James Scott Bell books are good too. How to Make a Living as a Writer has good tips. But the first two were the most helpful books I've ever read. And Chris Fox's is really about practicalities. Not how to be a good writer.

Advice:
Write daily at the same time each day for an hour or so at least. It is like working out. If you have a routine, you're more likely to stick to it. If you like writing at Starbucks or the library, go there. If you like writing in your study, go there. Eliminate distractions by getting them out of the way. Spend 5 to 10 minutes checking shite on here or email or whatever other nonsense you know distracts you, then turn off the WiFi, set up the scene or scenes you plan to write on a scratch piece of paper, and get to work.

Do not micro manage your work. Know it will suck. You are not Hemingway. You are not Faulkner. And even they had shitty first drafts.

As Neil Gaiman said at his talk last weekend, whatever you're writing, finish it. It could be complete garbage. Just finish it. Ignore the voice in your head telling you it sucks.

For me, I need an outline. Even when I wrote daily, the shite was hard to keep straight. The more detailed for me the better. Think of outlining as writing. It basically is. Allow yourself to explore different paths at the outlining stage. Then cut the shite that sucks. Only after editing your outline should you start writing your story.

If you're writing as a journalist, I don't really know where to point you. I'm sure there are books on how to make it as a freelance journalist. There are websites dedicated to that. Can't recall their names offhand, but Google and "freelance writing website" and I'm sure it will come up.
This post was edited on 7/11/17 at 10:19 pm
Posted by PublixSubs
Maine
Member since Sep 2015
907 posts
Posted on 7/11/17 at 10:45 pm to
That is incredible advice. I'd like to think I'm the next Hunter S. Thompson, Joseph Heller, I know I am not. Which leads me to, I know whatever I am working on presently isn't great, and so I keep scraping everything. Everything. Way too much striving for perfection. Half my brain tells me to keep in the search for the greatest work of all time, while the other half hates everything after three chapters and a bunch of notes. I do not yet have a middle ground.

I also found that writing scenes is coming naturally, but dialogue is a miserable mess.

Either way, I truly appreciate your post. Many thanks.
Posted by dbeck
Member since Nov 2014
29454 posts
Posted on 7/12/17 at 1:19 am to
Realize that writing is rewriting. Get the whole thing written before you start editing.

"The first draft of anything is shite." - Hemingway

"Write drunk, edit sober." - Hemingway

Writing is essentially storytelling and storytelling is about engaging the audience, keeping them interested, and hopefully giving then something of significance to take away from the experience.

No one wants to listen to a boring story and that's why a lot of advice on writing focuses on trimming the unnecessary from your writing. Learn from other storytelling mediums like graphic novels and movies.

You can't just read, you have to study and analyze the masters to learn the craft. The first time you read something you are only focusing on plot. You want to find out what happens next. Read something great 2-3 times because after you know the plot you can focus on the writing mechanics. Dissect the writing, learn how it works.

Don't worry about rules. In the arts there is but one rule: "Entertain your audience." You might not need books on how to write if you enjoy analyzing writing.

"I didn't go to film school, I went to films." - Tarantino
Posted by LoveThatMoney
Who knows where?
Member since Jan 2008
12281 posts
Posted on 7/12/17 at 7:44 am to
I haven't read it, but the Write Great Fiction series of books to which Plot and Structure belongs also has a book on Dialogue.
Dialogue
Posted by pkloa
Member since Jan 2011
2280 posts
Posted on 7/12/17 at 1:48 pm to
I'm not an English major, but I found On Writing by Stephen King to be very interesting. Even though I have no desire to write, having him explain things helped me read better.
Posted by S
RIP Wayde
Member since Jan 2007
164696 posts
Posted on 7/12/17 at 1:55 pm to
On Writing by King is a good one. Fun read.

How Not To Write by William Saffire

The First Five Pages by Noah Lukeman

And it's always nice to have a copy of White and Strunk's "The Elements of Style" handy.

If you get serious about trying to get published, get a copy of The Novel abd Short Story writer's market.

I've written some short stuff and a novel and found all the above helpful.
Posted by LSUMBA91
The Holy City
Member since Nov 2007
246 posts
Posted on 7/12/17 at 3:14 pm to
I'll second the recommendation of Stephen King's "On Writing."

Anne Lamott's "Bird by Bird" is also good.

Joseph Campbell helps alot with structural issues.

Somebody has a snowflake method that is also good for structure.

Join a local writers' group. Find a buddy. Write shitty first drafts. Enter contests, get feedback. Go.


quote:

Any other writers here? Advice? Books? Have plenty of ideas but need some direction. Any good books out there on writing? Strategy? TIA.


Posted by S
RIP Wayde
Member since Jan 2007
164696 posts
Posted on 7/13/17 at 5:10 am to
Like Sean Connery says in Finding Forrester:

quote:

Do you know what the absolute best moment is? When you've finished your first draft ... and you read it by yourself. Before these assholes take something they couldn't do in a lifetime and tear it down in a single day.


Just keep writing. And when you finish that first draft, take some time off (couple weeks at least--can't stress this enough) and enjoy what you've done, then get back to work. Editing and rewriting is tough, but you'll know what to do.
Posted by DumbCollegeKid
Steens,Ms
Member since Apr 2013
1620 posts
Posted on 7/13/17 at 11:39 am to
Find a group of like minded people and put your work out there for criticism. Take that criticism with a grain of salt. Write about what you know. Get something, anything, published. Read a metric shiteton of books, particularly in genre you want to write in. I've been published a few times, and those rejection letters sting, but the acceptance letters make it all worth it.
Posted by LoveThatMoney
Who knows where?
Member since Jan 2008
12281 posts
Posted on 7/13/17 at 1:29 pm to
quote:

ind a group of like minded people and put your work out there for criticism


This is one of the harder things to do. You can find groups online that meet in person, but they can be incredibly frustrating. People are inherently lazy and do shite jobs reading and critiquing your work. May have better luck at your local college or simply through email correspondence with a group you connect with through an online forum of dedicated writers. I've found that many people are either total shite writers with no idea what they're doing or don't care about getting published or don't want to do anything beyond tinkering with their little musings.

For what it's worth, I'm happy to read whatever you'd like me to. I will say that I am busy and I don't wear kid gloves. I am not rude, or try not to be, but I am bluntly honest. Which I think is a good thing.
Posted by DumbCollegeKid
Steens,Ms
Member since Apr 2013
1620 posts
Posted on 7/13/17 at 2:12 pm to
I was always "that guy" in my writing workshops. I want to hit it big, so I find that it pays to be humble in a group setting. I agree with you about the caliber of writers you find in most settings. People don't want to hear the truth, they want smoke blown up their asses. I make it a point to be blunt in my critiques because that allows others to be blunt in kind.
Posted by Breesus
House of the Rising Sun
Member since Jan 2010
68030 posts
Posted on 7/13/17 at 3:02 pm to
Stephen King wrote a great one On Writing
Posted by LoveThatMoney
Who knows where?
Member since Jan 2008
12281 posts
Posted on 7/13/17 at 4:07 pm to
quote:

was always "that guy" in my writing workshops. I want to hit it big, so I find that it pays to be humble in a group setting. I agree with you about the caliber of writers you find in most settings. People don't want to hear the truth, they want smoke blown up their asses. I make it a point to be blunt in my critiques because that allows others to be blunt in kind


Literally every workshop in undergrad I had to start the critiques. Even in my fricking 7000 level course (which was a master's course on writing the novel I took while in undergrad) they often turned to me because they knew I had no qualms with upsetting people. Once the first nick was given, the others could smell blood and give critiques. It was fricking weird. My capstone seminar was basically me picking apart peoples' stories and then everyone else either glomming on to my critiques or trying to downplay them. There were a handful of people that seemed to really care about learning and critiquing. The rest all thought I was an a-hole. But I got the A and most others got Bs and Cs, so whatever. Haven't been able to publish much yet. I wish I had really pushed that. I decided that if I ever were to teach a course in fiction writing, fully one half of the class would be dedicated to getting published.
Posted by PublixSubs
Maine
Member since Sep 2015
907 posts
Posted on 7/13/17 at 11:43 pm to
Picked up On Writing. Thanks to all, will be a great start in the right direction. Hope this thread continues for all those that want to read AND write.
Posted by LSUMBA91
The Holy City
Member since Nov 2007
246 posts
Posted on 7/14/17 at 8:29 am to
quote:

I decided that if I ever were to teach a course in fiction writing, fully one half of the class would be dedicated to getting published.


Publishing is a different game than it was before Amazon & self-publishing came along. The literary agent/big publishing house model still exists, but the author can make more by self-publishing in a smart way (e.g. hire free-lance editors that got laid off from big houses in mergers).

Poor editing is my biggest issued with self-published works, but I've seen some crappy editing done by the houses, too.
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