re: I can’t help but think a lot of people driving newer cars with upside down loans

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This was years back, but my friends girlfriend worked at a Credit Union and this was when Tahoe's were going for about 50K loaded. She would see the actual price the dealership paid and one time she showed us the invoice for a Tahoe that was sold for 47K but the actual dealership price was $19375. Thats how much they are raping people with these vehicles.

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She lied to you and you are dumb for believing that.

I don't know what it is now but the invoice price on new GM's was a flat percentage of the sticker. Around 95% iirc. Cadillacs had a larger spread than the rest of GM but they changed that in the late 90s/early 2000s.

There isn't nearly as much spread between invoice and sticker as people think.

And no, the dealer doesn't necessarily pay invoice either as there is holdback which is for covering the floorplan and advertising is also in there. And, manufactures can offer dealer cash to move slow product instead of rebates. Luxury brands usually use this as rebates are not a good look for "high end" cars. Dealer cash is not advertised but allows the dealer to either put a lower sale price on, or more commonly, boost what they show for trade in on your hooptie.

ETA-The vast majority of the time, Covid craziness excepted, the dealer makes money in the used cars, finance office and service department. New cars are generally not a big profit center but rather a vehicle to get you to spend money in other ways at the dealer.

Example-Get your financing through the dealer? They're probably holding points on the loan. ie-You get a 7% rate the bank is likely kicking 2% back to the dealer for selling the loan.