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re: Why do LSU fans settle for mediocrity at the QB position?
Posted on 9/11/11 at 2:27 am to extremetigerfanatic
Posted on 9/11/11 at 2:27 am to extremetigerfanatic
quote:
While it is effective for doing well in the SEC, can't say that we have the offensive fire power (and a QB) to come back from behind and win a big game when we are forced to pass only.
Well first, I don't see where LSU might be in the position of having to only pass except a last minute situation or multiple scores behind with time ticking, and I would think Mett would be a option, I don't think this staff will not use him if they think they need him. He certainly has plenty of skill to my eye tonight
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Posted on 9/11/11 at 2:27 am to extremetigerfanatic
quote:
Newton played like shite.
Yeah, ok...now I've heard it all on the Rant.
Posted on 9/11/11 at 2:38 am to Gtiger9757
I went back and looked at the QB's you mentioned as being way more awesome than anything LSU puts out:
Tebow's Heisman season: 3,286. 32 TD's. 66.6%.
Sanchez's last season at 'SC: 3,207. 34 TD's. 65.8%.
Chris Leak's senior season at UF: 2,942. 29 TD's. 63.6%.
Leinart's Heisman season: 3,322. 33 TD's. 65.3%.
Bradford's Heisman season: 4,720. 50 TD's. 67.9%.
Now, LSU's best four QB's of the decade:
'06 Russell: 3,129. 28 TD's. 67.8%.
'03 Mauck: 2,825. 28 TD's. 64%.
'01 Davey: 3,347. 18 TD's. 59.1%.
'07 Flynn: 2,407. 21 TD's. 56.3%
So basically. With the exception of Flynn (who missed two games in '07, it's worth noting), anytime LSU has had an "elite level" QB in the past decade, they have put up similar passing numbers to schools with Heisman winning/national title winning QB's. People tend to forget how awesome Russell was in 2006.
The only other QB on that list who completely obliterates all of LSU's recent QB is Bradford. But if you're hoping for numbers like that, you need to start following the NFL and not college.
It's also worth noting that since Perrilloux was kicked off the team, LSU simply hasn't had a QB with the intangibles to put up those kind of numbers. And with Miles' penchant for pounding the rock, it's probably pretty hard to draw the elite QB's. Lee and Mettenberger both will have a chance to reverse that trend.
One more point: SEC secondaries are absolutely nasty, and LSU plays against them eight or nine times a year. Bradford, who easily had the best season of the guys I listed above, threw for 80 yards less than his average and threw two of his eight picks on the season when he played against Florida in '08.
Long, long post made short: I don't agree with your assessment.
Tebow's Heisman season: 3,286. 32 TD's. 66.6%.
Sanchez's last season at 'SC: 3,207. 34 TD's. 65.8%.
Chris Leak's senior season at UF: 2,942. 29 TD's. 63.6%.
Leinart's Heisman season: 3,322. 33 TD's. 65.3%.
Bradford's Heisman season: 4,720. 50 TD's. 67.9%.
Now, LSU's best four QB's of the decade:
'06 Russell: 3,129. 28 TD's. 67.8%.
'03 Mauck: 2,825. 28 TD's. 64%.
'01 Davey: 3,347. 18 TD's. 59.1%.
'07 Flynn: 2,407. 21 TD's. 56.3%
So basically. With the exception of Flynn (who missed two games in '07, it's worth noting), anytime LSU has had an "elite level" QB in the past decade, they have put up similar passing numbers to schools with Heisman winning/national title winning QB's. People tend to forget how awesome Russell was in 2006.
The only other QB on that list who completely obliterates all of LSU's recent QB is Bradford. But if you're hoping for numbers like that, you need to start following the NFL and not college.
It's also worth noting that since Perrilloux was kicked off the team, LSU simply hasn't had a QB with the intangibles to put up those kind of numbers. And with Miles' penchant for pounding the rock, it's probably pretty hard to draw the elite QB's. Lee and Mettenberger both will have a chance to reverse that trend.
One more point: SEC secondaries are absolutely nasty, and LSU plays against them eight or nine times a year. Bradford, who easily had the best season of the guys I listed above, threw for 80 yards less than his average and threw two of his eight picks on the season when he played against Florida in '08.
Long, long post made short: I don't agree with your assessment.
This post was edited on 9/11/11 at 2:41 am
Posted on 9/11/11 at 2:42 am to fuzzymayo
quote:
Long, long post made short: I don't agree with your assessment.
Yeah, but you're using statistics to back up your assessment. Our OP and the rest of the rantards are using gut feelings.
You need to step your game up.
This post was edited on 9/11/11 at 2:43 am
Posted on 9/11/11 at 2:54 am to fuzzymayo
Mark Sanchez didn't win a heisman or national championship.
Posted on 9/11/11 at 2:55 am to rickgrimes
To answer to other stupid question, LSU has had some great quarterbacks, Tommy Hodson was probably the last great throwing QB (but according to you, that is the dark ages). Actually Bert Jones didn't do all that great at LSU except for one year. mike Miley was a great one.
When people talk about history of LSU football, the qb's name rarely come up. It is usually the rb's & db's.
How many people can name the QB of the 58 team? His name rarely comes up, it is all about the rb's. He'll, even the rb threw the only TD in the 59 Sugar Bowl.
LSU will never have a Sam Bradford because LSU does not play the passing game, so the Sam Bradfords will not come. They will go to the Big 12 or other throwing conference.
When people talk about history of LSU football, the qb's name rarely come up. It is usually the rb's & db's.
How many people can name the QB of the 58 team? His name rarely comes up, it is all about the rb's. He'll, even the rb threw the only TD in the 59 Sugar Bowl.
LSU will never have a Sam Bradford because LSU does not play the passing game, so the Sam Bradfords will not come. They will go to the Big 12 or other throwing conference.
Posted on 9/11/11 at 2:58 am to rickgrimes
The last couple of years, we've "settled for a mediocre coach." Now we're #2 in the nation, a legitimate national title contender, our coach has lead us thru tons of off season adversity....now the Rantards are shifting to "settling for mediocre QB's." I promise if we could trade for Kellen Moore or Andrew Luck, I would.
I loathe you people.
I loathe you people.
This post was edited on 9/11/11 at 3:07 am
Posted on 9/11/11 at 3:35 am to DanglingFury
This thread makes me think back to the 2003 national championship when OU had the heisman qb and we had Matt Mauk. I dont think anyone in their right mind expected us to win that game because we could never match OU's offensive output. All we did was make them uncomfortable all night by taking away the passing game options they relied on all season. They had no answer, and the rest is history. Football is the ultimate team sport and the qb is only one guy. It doesn't always matter how good he is, and it's really not fair to put most of the responsibility of a championship team on his shoulders the way 'fun and gun' spread offenses do. Not if you don't have to. Les understands that when the passing game isn't going as planned(and against the better defenses, it won't), you'd better have a reliable running game. Championships are often won by the team that doesn't even have the best qb on the field(see McElroy 2009). All that matters is that everyone understands their role and is capable of executing it.
Posted on 9/11/11 at 3:38 am to rickgrimes
1. There is very little "mediocrity" in any aspect of lsu football.
2. In your opinion Would it be better if we passed for twice as many yards a game but lost?
Ask Texas Tech, Hawaii, Houston, and even Oklahoma if they would trade all of their passing records for our.championships..
Why are their fans.content with mediocre seasons.. year after year after year??
I'll take 7 passing touchdowns any season if said season comes with an 11-2 record
2. In your opinion Would it be better if we passed for twice as many yards a game but lost?
Ask Texas Tech, Hawaii, Houston, and even Oklahoma if they would trade all of their passing records for our.championships..
Why are their fans.content with mediocre seasons.. year after year after year??
I'll take 7 passing touchdowns any season if said season comes with an 11-2 record
Posted on 9/11/11 at 3:41 am to rickgrimes
quote:Really? Please give examples... Also, please list W/L and defensive rank, and you'll see a corelation.
College QBs around the country regularly throw for over 300-350 yards and 3-4 touchdowns with seeming ease every week
The past 4 years, only top 10 passing offense teams averaged over 300 ypg.
Teams with good defenses that win games don't have to throw 40 times a game to come from behind.
Over the past 4 years, here are the only QBs who have averaged over 250 ypg playing in the SEC:
Andre Woodson - 2007
Tim Tebow - 2007
Matthew Stafford - 2008
Ryan Mallet - 2009, 2010
Mike Hartline - 2010
None of them averaged 300 ypg.
This post was edited on 9/11/11 at 3:48 am
Posted on 9/11/11 at 3:43 am to rickgrimes
quote:
Didn't seem much different when Saban was the coach. But that could have been Jimbo Fisher and his type of play calling.
It was.
Fisher threw lots of short slants and WR screens.
Posted on 9/11/11 at 3:43 am to rickgrimes
I pretty much agree with what you're saying...name me one SEC Champ, National Champ, or any team that won a BCS bowl that didnt have a good QB. The list is very short, I'll bet on that.
Having a good running game and defense is great until you get behind. The defense cant pitch a shut out every game. To win the big games you need a QB that can lead the team and make the right decisions in those moments...something LSU has lacked since 2007.
Having a good running game and defense is great until you get behind. The defense cant pitch a shut out every game. To win the big games you need a QB that can lead the team and make the right decisions in those moments...something LSU has lacked since 2007.
This post was edited on 9/11/11 at 3:44 am
Posted on 9/11/11 at 3:44 am to GeauxTigersLee
quote:
Really? Please give examples
already asked, never given
quote:
Over the past 4 years, here are the only QBs who have averaged over 250 ypg playing in the SEC:
Andre Woodson
Tim Tebow
Matthew Stafford
Ryan Mallet
Mike Hartline
None of them averaged 300 ypg.
and KABOOM
Posted on 9/11/11 at 3:54 am to heehaw
quote:Passing ypg for the last 4 BCS NC:
I pretty much agree with what you're saying...name me one SEC Champ, National Champ, or any team that won a BCS bowl that didnt have a good QB.
Matt Flynn - 200.6
Tim Tebow - 196.1
Greg McElroy - 179.1
Cam Newton - 203.9
All these guys must suck then because they can barely average over 200 ypg.
Posted on 9/11/11 at 3:57 am to fuzzymayo
I think that you may have cherry picked yearly stats that suit your argument. You also left out TD to INT ratio and QB Ratings in your post which I think are important indicators of QB performance. I have a feeling if you include those and look at whole career stats, it will show a completely different picture. I will look it up tomorrow.
The truth is if any of those QBs in the list were available, we would all have taken them in a heart beat over any of the LSU QBs, JR included. Anybody that denies that is just being dishonest and needs to put down their purple rimmed gold shaded glasses.
The truth is if any of those QBs in the list were available, we would all have taken them in a heart beat over any of the LSU QBs, JR included. Anybody that denies that is just being dishonest and needs to put down their purple rimmed gold shaded glasses.
Posted on 9/11/11 at 4:01 am to rickgrimes
quote:
The truth is if any of those QBs in the list were available, we would all have taken them in a heart beat over any of the LSU QBs, JR included. Anybody that denies that is just being dishonest and needs to put down their purple rimmed gold shaded glasses.
If any of those "great quarterbacks" came to LSU, they would be "mediocre" because LSU does not pass, we run
This post was edited on 9/11/11 at 4:02 am
Posted on 9/11/11 at 4:20 am to rickgrimes
In my youth, I shared your sentiments.
"Why don't LSU blow people out 60 or 70 to nothing?"
"Why don't any LSU players get mentioned for Heisman?"
"Why don't we ever get the big name QB?
I have since learned that players won't stand out like that at LSU because as a team, LSU is a 400-pound go-frickin-rilla with a chainsaw for a penis. Anyone that plays us talks about how many "weapons" we have. LSU can lose it's starting QB and still spank the arse of a top 5 opponent. LSU has rarely hung its fate on one player, although Matt Flynn and Matt Mauck may not have been Heisman QBs, we likely would not have won the NC without them. Just learn to enjoy the fact that LSU can spank the asses of top ten teams, and them whip a little team like NWS 49-3, all the while getting the praise of the victim on how classy out players are. Makes me proud to be a Tiger fan these days!
"Why don't LSU blow people out 60 or 70 to nothing?"
"Why don't any LSU players get mentioned for Heisman?"
"Why don't we ever get the big name QB?
I have since learned that players won't stand out like that at LSU because as a team, LSU is a 400-pound go-frickin-rilla with a chainsaw for a penis. Anyone that plays us talks about how many "weapons" we have. LSU can lose it's starting QB and still spank the arse of a top 5 opponent. LSU has rarely hung its fate on one player, although Matt Flynn and Matt Mauck may not have been Heisman QBs, we likely would not have won the NC without them. Just learn to enjoy the fact that LSU can spank the asses of top ten teams, and them whip a little team like NWS 49-3, all the while getting the praise of the victim on how classy out players are. Makes me proud to be a Tiger fan these days!
Posted on 9/11/11 at 4:24 am to theantiquetiger
quote:FIFY
If any of those "great quarterbacks" came to LSU, they would be "mediocre" because LSU has a top 10 defense and doesn't run up the score when they're up by 30.
Posted on 9/11/11 at 4:28 am to rickgrimes
I love les, but jamstcus could have win the heisman. We let off the pedal. Against the shite teams ge didnt finish the game. It helped out in the ling run getting flynn ready. But yes we could have put 70+ pn teams when we didnt.
That is les miles fault. Ohio state, UT, Oregon, USC, and a lot if other teams run up the score.
Lsu and bama are the only teams i see scrubs playing. And most if the time the scrubs are netter than the other teams 1st team
That is les miles fault. Ohio state, UT, Oregon, USC, and a lot if other teams run up the score.
Lsu and bama are the only teams i see scrubs playing. And most if the time the scrubs are netter than the other teams 1st team
Posted on 9/11/11 at 4:29 am to rickgrimes
quote:
College QBs around the country regularly throw for over 300-350 yards and 3-4 touchdowns with seeming ease every week, where as LSU fans seem to be content when the QB reaches 200 yards. These days we seem to rejoice when our QBs cross the 100 yard mark in a game. How did we end up in this situation? Even during Jamarcus Russell's time, he may have thrown for over 300 yards maybe 2 or 3 times in 3 years (don't have the exact figure). Granted I have only been following LSU football since 2003. My question is - Have LSU teams always been like this for ever? Will we ever get a QB, HC, Off Co-ordinator combo where we regularly put up over 400-500 yards offense, 300-400 yards passing, 50+ points (maybe not SEC games, but non-conference games for sure)?
quote:
None of them came close to the success Colt McCoy, Sam Bradford, Tim Tebow, Matt Leinart, Mark Sanchez, (heck even Chris Leak ) had at the college level passing the ball
quote:
Tebow's Heisman season: 3,286. 32 TD's. 66.6%. Sanchez's last season at 'SC: 3,207. 34 TD's. 65.8%. Chris Leak's senior season at UF: 2,942. 29 TD's. 63.6%. Leinart's Heisman season: 3,322. 33 TD's. 65.3%. Bradford's Heisman season: 4,720. 50 TD's. 67.9%. Now, LSU's best four QB's of the decade: '06 Russell: 3,129. 28 TD's. 67.8%. '03 Mauck: 2,825. 28 TD's. 64%. '01 Davey: 3,347. 18 TD's. 59.1%. '07 Flynn: 2,407. 21 TD's. 56.3%
quote:
I think that you may have cherry picked yearly stats that suit your argument.
Let me get this straight. You make a statement and you get shown FACTS and it becomes cherry-picking. WOW!!!! The rant never seems to disappoint when it comes to stupidity
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