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re: Visa getting roughed up today?
Posted on 8/10/13 at 10:27 am to ThaBigFella
Posted on 8/10/13 at 10:27 am to ThaBigFella
quote:
On the other hand if it expires you profit $269 on an $18,000 investment in 7 days which is 1.49%/week....now do that for 52 weeks in a row and you'll be a rich rich man haha
That's the real trick, though, isn't it. I see the value in it - I'm just trying to cram risk into a manageable box.
quote:
I do it by the week
Alright - I get that. You pocket the cash sale on the put. I got that. My brokerage says 100% cash secured put. I got that. So, I wait for a down day and sell a put I'm comfortable at long (in this case, $190). I got that.
Okay, so how do I get out, short of actually waiting for the expiration or put? Or is that the actual plan - just churn the stock over, assuming you're up the target 0.5 to 1.5% (or better)?
I'm getting there on the mechanics of options - now I'm trying to see how you actually do it. I get that you like the weekly plays, and occasionally you have to eat a put for while until you go green. But what is the routine play?
(Sorry for picking your brain, but you seem to have the hang for parts of this I really didn't understand - I've been an index/buy and hold guy for a long time. You've encouraged me to "diversify" by, ironically, buying individual stocks.)
Posted on 8/10/13 at 10:36 am to Ace Midnight
quote:
Alright - I get that. You pocket the cash sale on the put. I got that. My brokerage says 100% cash secured put. I got that. So, I wait for a down day and sell a put I'm comfortable at long (in this case, $190). I got that.
Okay, so how do I get out, short of actually waiting for the expiration or put? Or is that the actual plan - just churn the stock over, assuming you're up the target 0.5 to 1.5% (or better)?
I wouldn't sell the $190 on a weekly basis from here bc the odds of it going from $179 to $190 in a week are slim. If you want to sell the $190, sell the september 21 for $12.40 which means you'll profit $1240 either way and either not get shares or get them for $177.60. That is 6.5% ROI in 1 month. FWIW september scares me bc of the potential tapering, but visa will fare better than most in the event of tapering bc 1) it already got whacked to below market values and 2) its not a big dividend payer so retirees won't be panic selling.
For the weekly puts, I've learned to sell them at or below the current price. The $175 is $4.75 off the current price so that one will go up in value quicker even if it drops to say $177 bc it's still ahead of its expiration.Actually I sold some $175 on friday and monday morning they will be worth more bc of the time decay as long as the shares stay in the $179-180 range. The $180 will obviously make you more money, also if you sell the $180 while the share is $179.70 and the share goes up to $180.25 say monday morning, the premium will go from $2.69 to say $2.20 and you can sell right there and profit $.49/share x 100 shares minus the $7.99 option fee but I wouldn't close out early unless I've made 50%+ of what the premium was at the least. I'd rather take delivery on $180 - $2.69 and just wait for the shares to rise in a few days and then sell them
Put it this way, whatever share price you sell the put at, as the share price increases, the put loses value and you make money with the end goal being a put going from what you paid $2.69 to $0.00 at expiration. The $175 is nice bc you're $4.70 ahead of expiration but the $180 is 30 cents behind, but thats why you make more money on it.
So if you don't mind owning it at $180 I'd sell that one and make that extra $159
This post was edited on 8/10/13 at 10:51 am
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