re: Which country wins a World Cup next...USA or England?

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Nope - My premise is not well stated. I am assuming that the athletic potential seen in today's NFL/NBA grew up playing soccer as opposed to Lebron suiting up for the USMNT for the next cycle.

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you do know that the touch of a ´donkey´ as many say on this board, cannot be overcome, don´t you?

Some have it, or they don´t (touch).

This country will prosper based on more numbers going through a proper training at an earlier age, and sticking with it, if they´ve got ´it´.

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Why are most pro athletes multi sport stars in high school? Because they are the best athletes.
The best athletes are not playing soccer. Until they do we will be mediocre.
You can say "this shite again" all you want and pretend a soccer player is some sort of special athlete compared to other sports.
Doesn't mean we plug Shaq or Vince Wolfork into the lineup.

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The best athletes are not playing soccer. Until they do we will be mediocre.

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we every bit as athletic or more athletic than our opponents.

You know who also super athletic???? England.

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You can say "this shite again" all you want and pretend a soccer player is some sort of special athlete compared to other sports.

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Yes I can say it and I will say it.

Things like vision and touch on a soccer field can not be taught. It is completely natural.

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Yes I can say it and I will say it.

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Things like vision and touch on a soccer field can not be taught. It is completely natural.

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I agree. And most athletes have it. Soccer players are not unique. People like Chris Paul, John Stockton, OBJ, Michael Vick etc. etc. etc. have it.

Someone like Messi could have been a great point guard if that is what he started out doing. It goes both ways.

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People like Chris Paul, John Stockton, OBJ, Michael Vick etc. etc. etc. have it.

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not soccer touch and vision being able to play a 40 yard ball on the dime isn't the same as making a basketball pass or running a route.

You have to be born with it. I played soccer at a high level for 10 years when star athletes from other sports tried their hand at it , most the time it was embarrassing. Being football coordinated and soccer coordinated are two totally different worlds.

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I played soccer at a high level for 10 years when star athletes from other sports tried their hand at it ,

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I'm not talking about star athletes from other sports. Of course they won't be able to play soccer at even a horrible level if they start later in life.

I'm talking about the best athletes starting at age 4.

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They're not even a top 20 team on paper.

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Agree to disagree.

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Well...let's slow down a bit here. Vision and touch may not be able to be taught, but they can certainly be learned through practice. Coming out of the womb in Spain or Brazil doesn't give you any better chance at developing vision and touch as coming out of the womb in America. The difference is our 4 year olds are playing tee-ball. Touch isn't "natural" anymore than being able to hit a fast ball is natural. It has to do with coordination and body control, but you aren't going to find a 12 year old that can hit a 95 mph fastball or volley a 40 yard ball into the back of the net from 15 yards out. The ability to develop touch and vision is natural...just like the ability to be able to hit a baseball is natural. Being born in Cuba doesn't make you a great hitter, but the ones that are blessed with the natural ability grow up hitting pebbles with broom sticks every day, so they nurture and groom that natural ability.

Soccer isn't unique in that aspect. Athletic individuals with great body control and coordination will usually succeed in sports. If they pick 1 sport at the age of 4 and stick to it, they'll get pretty fricking good at it. That is a fact of Athletics, it isn't particular to any sport. The whole concept of it being "natural" is a little bogus though. That implies a natural can hop out there at 15 and be as skilled as a great player that's played since he could walk. Like its inherited or something. I don't think that's the case at all

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Very well said. I agree with you on pretty much all of that, but you're not going to get much love around here with that opinion. It seems pretty obvious to me that if our country gave a shite about soccer and devoted the best of our sporting resources towards it, like the rest of the world does, things would be different. World football has never seen anything like the athletes we have here. Our best athletes and coaches are in football and basketball, and to an extent baseball. This is a fact. Not to mention all the other things that really make the difference like player youth development, a top tier league, a nationwide culture invested in soccer, and most importantly $$$. We're not there yet. But it does seem to be getting a lot better much quicker than I ever thought it would.

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World football has never seen anything like the athletes we have here.

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I agree with a lot of the points made about development from young ages but it's this precise bias that I think really turns people off. It honestly seems to be little more than unexamined conjecture.

Are American athletes really that much more impressive than Brazilian or Colombian or French African etc etc?


Is it just based on them being better at traditionally American sports (well, except when tiny islands like Cuba or Dominican Republic start playing those sports)?


Is it that US athletes do well in the Olympics (even if that success is likely not nearly in proportion to the funds for training the USA pours into it)?

I mean, Jamaica does pretty well in sprinting with their meager population and their guys don't look any less "athletic" than 5-star USA football and basketball recruits.


Brazil has amazing athletes yet it's still just as often that the Countinhos are among their top players (and one could well argue that their current NT's malaise is rooted in the increased focus on more athletic "pace and power" players to market to Europe).


I'm not arguing that the USA doesn't generally have a much "more athletic" populace than, say, Italy but I think the level of USA athletes gets pretty exaggerated in comparison to many other parts of the world.


What the USA does have is a huge population so I'm sure we have countless 5'5" guys that had more "coordination" than elite NBA or NFL superstars as youngsters but wound up being accountants or electricians because they were 5'5" when one may have won a Balon d'Or if they grew up in Argentina or Italy.