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re: Gruden's comment on MNF about offensive talent at LSU

Posted on 12/24/14 at 7:29 pm to
Posted by chilge1
Baton Rouge
Member since Jan 2009
12137 posts
Posted on 12/24/14 at 7:29 pm to
quote:

upperclass leadership and talent like Mett, OBJ, Landry, and Hill on their teams.


Senior
True Junior
True Junior
Redshirt Sophomore
Posted by SHOCKTIDE
KEYS of FLORIDA
Member since Jul 2014
282 posts
Posted on 12/24/14 at 7:31 pm to
quote:

Won with Dungy's players


And Gruden had his Raiders of the past year playing in the Super Bowl also. Explain that away. You can't.
Posted by boxcar willie
kenner
Member since Mar 2011
16035 posts
Posted on 12/24/14 at 7:38 pm to
quote:

Senior True Junior True Junior Redshirt Sophomore


all NFL starters the following year. All had been around for 3 years.
Posted by boxcar willie
kenner
Member since Mar 2011
16035 posts
Posted on 12/24/14 at 7:45 pm to
quote:

If you don’t see we implement these aspects in our offense then something is wrong


we did in the Texas A&M game as well as throw on 1st and 2nd down. Prior to that game we didn't do much of the above.

quote:

When your inexperienced skilled players can't execute the plays using those aspects mentioned above then you have to do something to try to get some type of production from the offense. The offense didn't show enough consistency at QB & WR to open up the offense.


You need to open up your offense when you have inexperienced and less talented players in order to get any type of production out of them. Hard to get production when you only pass when the defense knows you have to and constantly run into stacked boxes. Every other team in college ball manages to do it. That's how you build confidence in your young players and develop some kind of a rhythm on offense and in the pass game.
This post was edited on 12/24/14 at 7:47 pm
Posted by chilge1
Baton Rouge
Member since Jan 2009
12137 posts
Posted on 12/24/14 at 7:57 pm to
Hill was not with the program in 2011… not sure about the details, but his scholarship was revoked pending his legal complications.

As far as being MORE experienced than those that finished ranked above them,

Alabama
QB: Senior - AJ McCarron
RB: Junior - TJ Yeldon; Junior - Kenyan Drake
WR: Junior - Amari Cooper; Senior - Christion Jones; Junior - DeAndrew White

We will NEVER have a higher ranked offense than Auburn or aTm. And I'm okay with that.
Posted by BigBrod81
Houma
Member since Sep 2010
18962 posts
Posted on 12/24/14 at 7:59 pm to
quote:

Prior to that game we didn't do much of the above.


All the games this season can be found on YouTube. Maybe you need to go back & watch them again. Take notes especially with the early games. You will be surprised in variety of formations that were used. When the players struggled with the execution, is when the play calling got more conservative.


quote:

That's how you build confidence in your young players and develop some kind of a rhythm on offense and in the pass game.


No, that's how you rack up turnovers that ends up getting you blown the frick out with a young offense. Does the majority of the Mississippi St. & entire Auburn game ring a bell?
Posted by boxcar willie
kenner
Member since Mar 2011
16035 posts
Posted on 12/24/14 at 8:02 pm to
quote:

We will NEVER have a higher ranked offense than Auburn or aTm. And I'm okay with that.


Why are you satisfied with that. Not even in yards per play, the stat that your bud thinks is everything? I think we should shoot for having the best offense we possibly can. Same goes for defense.
Posted by GA Tiger
Woodstock
Member since Aug 2005
2962 posts
Posted on 12/24/14 at 8:10 pm to
quote:

Am I the only one who saw it as a not so tangential swipe at CLM and his lack of production on offense. Gruden mentioned Hill, Beckham, Landry and Mett and said something to the effect of wanting to coach at lsu because of all that talent. Felt he could do better. Never named Miles, but you got the idea.


He's right.. He could do better.
Posted by chilge1
Baton Rouge
Member since Jan 2009
12137 posts
Posted on 12/24/14 at 8:11 pm to
Pay close attention to Auburn's defense this coming year. Muschamp is widely regarded as one of the best defensive minds in the game. Even at Florida, they were among the nation's best.

Maybe he will prove me wrong at Auburn, but I firmly believe the offensive style that they run there, and the style run at aTm, are counterproductive to fielding competitive defensive teams. Even in the year that Auburn won the NC with Cam Newton they had a terrible defensive unit.

Give me a very good offense which complements an elite defense over an elite offense that undermines a very good defense any day.
Posted by boxcar willie
kenner
Member since Mar 2011
16035 posts
Posted on 12/24/14 at 8:12 pm to
quote:

QB: Senior - AJ McCarron RB: Junior - TJ Yeldon; Junior - Kenyan Drake WR: Junior - Amari Cooper; Senior - Christion Jones; Junior - DeAndrew White


you were right about McCarron, but Cooper was a sophomore, as was Yeldon, Drake, and Derrick Henry, Amari Cooper was a Jr
Posted by boxcar willie
kenner
Member since Mar 2011
16035 posts
Posted on 12/24/14 at 8:15 pm to
quote:

Give me a very good offense which complements an elite defense over an elite offense that undermines a very good defense any day.



You do realize that an elite offense doesn't undermine a good defense? Running more plays, controlling the ball, gaining yards, getting first downs, and even yards per play, helps the defense.
Posted by chilge1
Baton Rouge
Member since Jan 2009
12137 posts
Posted on 12/24/14 at 8:19 pm to
Somebody should notify 247 that the 2013 Roster is inaccurate. I concede your point about experience, though would like to point out that Kevin Norwood was a Senior.

Posted by chilge1
Baton Rouge
Member since Jan 2009
12137 posts
Posted on 12/24/14 at 8:28 pm to
It's not an absolute, but with certain offenses, I think it's applicable.

quote:

Running more plays, controlling the ball, gaining yards, getting first downs, and even yards per play, helps the defense.


Time of Possession helps the defense. The rest of those metrics serve to that end.

In 2013, aTm was ranked 5th in Total Offense, 110th in Total Defense, and 118th in TOP
In 2014, aTm was ranked 39th in Total Offense, 113th in Total Defense, and 127th in TOP

In 2013, Auburn was ranked 13th in Total Offense, 99th in Total Defense, and 61st in TOP
In 2014, Auburn was ranked 10th in Total Offense, 68th in Total Defense, and 58th in TOP

In 2013, LSU was ranked 40th in Total Offense, 20th in Total Defense, and 48th in TOP
In 2014, LSU was ranked 89th in Total Offense, 9th in Total Defense, and 5th in TOP
This post was edited on 12/24/14 at 8:32 pm
Posted by JaxTiger10
Murfreesboro,TN
Member since Aug 2014
3893 posts
Posted on 12/24/14 at 8:36 pm to
quote:

you can't see the difference between Cam Cameroons LSU's offense and Lane Kiffens Bama offense I don't know what to tell you


Right because ill take your opinion over what the coaches say they run.
quote:

Ours looks like smash mouth 60's era Packers or Bears that no one else runs these days. 


Once again, you repeatedly saying that doesnt make it so. We run a modern pro style offense. Its clear you cant see it.
quote:

IN terminology many teams in college football and some in pros are 'pro style' but the differences in the way it is applied at LSU is night and day from the way the rest of football applies it. 

No its not. Why am i even arguing with you over football? You didnt even know an offset I formation even existed. Lsu runs a modern prostyle scheme. If you want to say we are vanilla in playcalling too much, then fine. But stop saying we run a 1960 offense, because when you say that in a discussion / thread it makes posters just dismiss all your other points.
Posted by chilge1
Baton Rouge
Member since Jan 2009
12137 posts
Posted on 12/24/14 at 8:38 pm to
In 2011, LSU was ranked 70th in Total Offense, 36th in Yards per Play, 2nd in Total Defense, and 21st in TOP

This most closely resembles the production I'd like to see on an Annual basis… no coincidence that it resulted in a NC appearance.
Posted by boxcar willie
kenner
Member since Mar 2011
16035 posts
Posted on 12/24/14 at 8:38 pm to
Well we don't need to run a hurry up offense and no one on here is saying we do. But a good defense goes a long way in TOP also. You can open up your offense with out going hurry up you know. You can even open up your offense and do a lot of things that we don't do that other schools do with a 'pro style'.
Posted by SHOCKTIDE
KEYS of FLORIDA
Member since Jul 2014
282 posts
Posted on 12/24/14 at 8:40 pm to
quote:

on with Dungy's players


Just like Les won with Nick's Players. Right!
Posted by LSU GrandDad
houston, texas
Member since Jun 2009
21564 posts
Posted on 12/24/14 at 8:40 pm to
quote:

Objectively, Gruden's reputation far exceeds the production of his offenses


Gruden is damn smart to leave the NFL before the truth came out. the truth being he was a mediocre coach. people love him because he didn't stick around long enough to find out his true talent level. I think gruden would be the worst hire LSU could make,
Posted by chilge1
Baton Rouge
Member since Jan 2009
12137 posts
Posted on 12/24/14 at 8:40 pm to
quote:

Just like Les won with Nick's Players. Right!


That's the joke.
Posted by chilge1
Baton Rouge
Member since Jan 2009
12137 posts
Posted on 12/24/14 at 8:47 pm to
quote:

Well we don't need to run a hurry up offense and no one on here is saying we do.


And Auburn and aTm will ALWAYS rank higher in offensive categories than LSU for that reason. Malzhan and Sumlin have unique concepts to running an offense that are more effective than the majority of the CFB landscape, but I don't foresee either maintaining prolonged success. In 2010, Malzhan had the advantage of Cam Newton to offset any liabilities caused by his offense.

A competent defense can stifle these attacks. We're 4-0 in such games. Unfortunately our defense hadn't found its rhythm prior to playing them this year.

quote:

You can even open up your offense and do a lot of things that we don't do that other schools do with a 'pro style'.


Not with a true sophomore QB in his first year as starter throwing to true freshman WRs.
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