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re: Stephen A talking about Cp3 and the Pelicans
Posted on 5/13/17 at 4:18 pm to TigerinATL
Posted on 5/13/17 at 4:18 pm to TigerinATL
I meant in the past. Lol
1
Posted on 5/13/17 at 4:27 pm to htran90
Yeah, I reread it and edited to reflect that.
Posted on 5/13/17 at 4:37 pm to ShamelessPel
so i misquoted....i disagree with this
yes. Cleveland and GS have the best talent. they are not 3 man rosters though. what Cleveland has done filling their roster has been smart. and GS has done a good job the past 3 years finding and developing bench players
also, when we talk about Big 3s, there is not one that formed that didn't result in that in some statistical give back from at least one member of that club. you can't just pencil in 27/12 from Davis and Cousins + Paul's 18/12. how those guys get those numbers has to change b/c they can't all dominate the ball the way they are used to when playing with each other.
figuring out the best way to maximize Davis/Cousins together is much more interesting and important to me at this moment than fantasizing about Paul or George or whomever forming a super team.
this is the second or third comment in this thread dumping on Jordan's offensive impact. that is wrong IMO. yes he is not a guy you can ask to ever get you a bucket or take a shot outside the RA or often keep on the floor b/c he can't shoot FTs. that last one, especially, is a huge limit.
but denying the power of a guy happy to screen and roll hard to the rim who can elevate, catch, and finish is foolish. vertical floor stretching is impactful- teams aren't going to let Jordan stroll down the lane for a thunderous dunk; where does that help come from? that is a skill- the timing is important. and not every team has guys able or even willing to dive knowing they will probably get mugged and won't see the ball most of the time
we got to watch this action first hand w/ Tyson Chandler diving and creating open shots for West and Peja. it wasn't the same with Emeka Okafor rolling to the rim
quote:
And as much as people want to crow about having deep rosters to compete, who's gonna be in the finals? Cleveland and GSW. Who's the two teams in the league that have a legit big 3
yes. Cleveland and GS have the best talent. they are not 3 man rosters though. what Cleveland has done filling their roster has been smart. and GS has done a good job the past 3 years finding and developing bench players
also, when we talk about Big 3s, there is not one that formed that didn't result in that in some statistical give back from at least one member of that club. you can't just pencil in 27/12 from Davis and Cousins + Paul's 18/12. how those guys get those numbers has to change b/c they can't all dominate the ball the way they are used to when playing with each other.
figuring out the best way to maximize Davis/Cousins together is much more interesting and important to me at this moment than fantasizing about Paul or George or whomever forming a super team.
quote:
Jordan's full offensive game was built around Paul/Griffin creating lobs/dump offs
this is the second or third comment in this thread dumping on Jordan's offensive impact. that is wrong IMO. yes he is not a guy you can ask to ever get you a bucket or take a shot outside the RA or often keep on the floor b/c he can't shoot FTs. that last one, especially, is a huge limit.
but denying the power of a guy happy to screen and roll hard to the rim who can elevate, catch, and finish is foolish. vertical floor stretching is impactful- teams aren't going to let Jordan stroll down the lane for a thunderous dunk; where does that help come from? that is a skill- the timing is important. and not every team has guys able or even willing to dive knowing they will probably get mugged and won't see the ball most of the time
we got to watch this action first hand w/ Tyson Chandler diving and creating open shots for West and Peja. it wasn't the same with Emeka Okafor rolling to the rim
This post was edited on 5/13/17 at 4:39 pm
Posted on 5/13/17 at 10:33 pm to corndeaux
Someone's stats suffer, yes. Likely with this mixture a little of all 3. CP3 could easily lead the league in assists. Davis and Cousins may dip down to 22-25 a game with Paul chipping in 16-17. You just watch where these games are won in the last 3-4 minutes. You NEED guys who can create and finish. We'd have 3 get it and move out of the way and 3 lethal pick n roll combinations.
Stephen A Smith isn't dumb. There has to be something here talent wise for him to name drop the lowly Pelicans on TV as CP3's should be destination.
My biggest pro is CP3 being able to counter my perceived lack of Gentry being able to integrate these two to their max potential. Gentry may be many things, but he's not dumb enough to get in the way of Chris being Chris.
Stephen A Smith isn't dumb. There has to be something here talent wise for him to name drop the lowly Pelicans on TV as CP3's should be destination.
My biggest pro is CP3 being able to counter my perceived lack of Gentry being able to integrate these two to their max potential. Gentry may be many things, but he's not dumb enough to get in the way of Chris being Chris.
Posted on 5/14/17 at 10:35 am to ShamelessPel
i enjoy talking to you, but i cannot continue on here.
there are real, tangible questions to ask about Cousins/Davis right now. i'm just not interested in a hypothetical back and forth about Paul/Cousins/Davis.
there are real, tangible questions to ask about Cousins/Davis right now. i'm just not interested in a hypothetical back and forth about Paul/Cousins/Davis.
Posted on 5/14/17 at 10:53 am to corndeaux
That's fine bud
We got the Dubs vs the Pops today, a game 7 tomorrow, and the lottery Tuesday. Lots of hoops.
I just don't see the Cousins/Davis talk being very productive until the roster shakes out. Plenty of people doing a very good job of "what could be" via articles. Those 2 + Gentry's traditional coaching desires mix like oil and water. I'm hardly alone in that opinion questioning his fit. I'm hoping Gentry is reading a lot more 10 seconds or more and less 7 seconds or less this summer.
Traditional PGs are a dying breed in this league and imo watching the success of DJ and Blake in Flop City shows a blue print of how to bare bones this thing.
1 coulda been had for a Derrick Rose esque package at the deadline.
1 is a free agent.
The next 2 closest things to those 2 are two of the top 4 players in the MVP race (Harden and James). I'm talking ball handlers able to get to spots on floor, run PNR and make people better. So 4 guys I count and 2 are untouchable and 1 balled out post ASB to "do we have assets"?
That is why this subject intrigues me. We are talking Davis/Cousins and what to do with them in my mind. Unfortunately for us, our best shot at maximizing with Gentry around is landing a miracle.
ETA: when the dust settles on FA, I'm sure we'll discuss plenty how to deploy. I will say for me, Solomon Hill's sole job is to set off ball screens for Davis and Cousins. No more standing around waiting to chuck threes. Use that 240 lb frame to make life easier.
We got the Dubs vs the Pops today, a game 7 tomorrow, and the lottery Tuesday. Lots of hoops.
I just don't see the Cousins/Davis talk being very productive until the roster shakes out. Plenty of people doing a very good job of "what could be" via articles. Those 2 + Gentry's traditional coaching desires mix like oil and water. I'm hardly alone in that opinion questioning his fit. I'm hoping Gentry is reading a lot more 10 seconds or more and less 7 seconds or less this summer.
Traditional PGs are a dying breed in this league and imo watching the success of DJ and Blake in Flop City shows a blue print of how to bare bones this thing.
1 coulda been had for a Derrick Rose esque package at the deadline.
1 is a free agent.
The next 2 closest things to those 2 are two of the top 4 players in the MVP race (Harden and James). I'm talking ball handlers able to get to spots on floor, run PNR and make people better. So 4 guys I count and 2 are untouchable and 1 balled out post ASB to "do we have assets"?
That is why this subject intrigues me. We are talking Davis/Cousins and what to do with them in my mind. Unfortunately for us, our best shot at maximizing with Gentry around is landing a miracle.
ETA: when the dust settles on FA, I'm sure we'll discuss plenty how to deploy. I will say for me, Solomon Hill's sole job is to set off ball screens for Davis and Cousins. No more standing around waiting to chuck threes. Use that 240 lb frame to make life easier.
This post was edited on 5/14/17 at 11:12 am
Posted on 5/14/17 at 5:02 pm to ShamelessPel
quote:
I will say for me, Solomon Hill's sole job is to set off ball screens for Davis and Cousins. No more standing around waiting to chuck threes. Use that 240 lb frame to make life easier.
That's a good suggestion.
While we're on the topic of Hill, does anyone here think he can do whatever Dante did last offseason and become a 38%+ 3-point shooter?
Posted on 5/14/17 at 6:16 pm to ShamelessPel
quote:
I'm hoping Gentry is reading a lot more 10 seconds or more and less 7 seconds or less this summer.
He said as much in the recent Woj interview. Gentry seems to believe in ball movement and spacing more than pace, even though he does care about pace. And regarding pace, I think Cousins pushes the ball up court quicker off a rebound than any guard he's had to pass it to. Gentry may not be a solution but I really don't think he's a problem either. MM is right, as much as we argue about coaches and GMs and Holiday and trading for a PG, this team will go as far as AD/DC take it. When they were at their best last season it was all about those 2 coming up big either individually or together. They made Jordan Crawford look like prime Jamal Crawford.
Posted on 5/14/17 at 7:45 pm to Number 31
quote:
While we're on the topic of Hill, does anyone here think he can do whatever Dante did last offseason and become a 38%+ 3-point shooter
No, unfortunately. Dante's percentage was bolstered by being able to hit the corner 3. Hill's 3s come from the wings, which traditionally are much lower percentage shots. I don't think you can teach being comfortable at hitting that corner 3 in one season either. At least not to a natural shooter like Hill. For Dante, it was simply doing the obvious and stepping back 2 feet instead of taking stupid long 2s.
Posted on 5/14/17 at 7:50 pm to htran90
quote:
Wasn't there a rumor that said that it was lavine+Rubio for jrue+asik
There was certainly a Rose for Rubio swap being heavily discussed at the deadline last year. Shows what Thibs thought of Rubio at the time and how little it could have taken. No doubt in my mind Jrue would have netted Rubio + Ajinca dump.
ETA: the Wolves were also trying to make the push for 8 for those thinking they wouldn't do that for a rental. They weren't far back either and thought they could net that spot.
This post was edited on 5/14/17 at 7:52 pm
Posted on 5/15/17 at 5:32 am to ShamelessPel
quote:
I just don't see the Cousins/Davis talk being very productive until the roster shakes out.
not sure how you can adjust the roster if you don't know what you want Davis/Cousins to be doing.
as you're pointing out, a ball handler/creator is a priority. but how you plan on using Cousins/Davis alters what you may want out of that spot. if Davis/Cousins are such good creators, why not just use them to deal out of high post a la Denver? why feel the need to add a ball dominant pg to take the ball out of their hands?
it's not always about the most talent possible. fit matters. egos matter. it's chemistry, not algebra.
quote:
Those 2 + Gentry's traditional coaching desires mix like oil and water
dont think it's as bad as that. certainly, they need to crash the offensive glass more. and they have to throttle the green light for guards jacking up first available jumpers early in the shot clock.
but pushing the ball up quickly and playing with tempo in the half court (ball + man movement) is not incompatible w/ those two bigs. i do not at all buy the "put Cousins/Davis on the block and grind it out" prescription.
now, the question is- can Gentry get guys to do that? quite right to be skeptical there
Re: Hill- he took too many above the break 3s, but he did take about 35% from the corners (96 attempts...Cunningham was at 128). and hit those at 38.5% (42% from the left, 33% from the right- Cunningham was the opposite 34% left, 45% right for 39.8% overall). not saying to expect miracles, but there may be something there to work with.
Posted on 5/15/17 at 10:18 am to NOSHAU
My biggest wish would be for the team to be moved to the Eastern Conference
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