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re: Who was the biggest American sport icon of the 20th century?
Posted on 6/7/16 at 7:38 pm to Lester Earl
Posted on 6/7/16 at 7:38 pm to Lester Earl
quote:
. There is no argument.
You can say the same about Ruth..... There is nobody really close..... Remember what he did at the time he did it... There was NOBODY close to him... NOBODY...... His own teammate Gehrig was probably the 2nd best player during that time and HIS stats aren't close to Ruths.......
1
Posted on 6/7/16 at 7:42 pm to Lester Earl
Well then Jerry West is the most famous person ever by that definition.
Look, anybody can be famous today...with the internet and media. Certainly Jordan benefited.
That is without question, Jordan arrived at a great global time with a great marketing campaign to sell shoes.
I think more people are definitely more famous now than Babe Ruth...because we are a global society.
But in terms of "pure fame" - it's Babe Ruth.
You had the Queen of England, the President, Babe Ruth, Charlie Chaplin, Buster Keaton, Al Capone, Charles Lindbergh, Albert Einstein...
Imagine a society when one sports figure is on par with a President - back when the President or Queen of England held prestige with the public far above sports figures.
Look, anybody can be famous today...with the internet and media. Certainly Jordan benefited.
That is without question, Jordan arrived at a great global time with a great marketing campaign to sell shoes.
I think more people are definitely more famous now than Babe Ruth...because we are a global society.
But in terms of "pure fame" - it's Babe Ruth.
You had the Queen of England, the President, Babe Ruth, Charlie Chaplin, Buster Keaton, Al Capone, Charles Lindbergh, Albert Einstein...
Imagine a society when one sports figure is on par with a President - back when the President or Queen of England held prestige with the public far above sports figures.
This post was edited on 6/7/16 at 7:44 pm
Posted on 6/7/16 at 7:43 pm to supatigah
quote:How do you put Ali from 1950-1990 when he was only 7 years old in 1950?
Pre1950 Ruth 1950-1990 Ali 1990-today Jordan
He didn't have his first professional fight until 1960.
Posted on 6/7/16 at 7:45 pm to mizzoubuckeyeiowa
Again, Jordan too was more recognizable than the US President or the Queen
Posted on 6/7/16 at 7:45 pm to mizzoubuckeyeiowa
quote:
Saying Jordan was the most famous man on the planet doesn't mean shite.
We have millions of TV and the internet now, anybody can be famous.
How about...Japanese grunts 70 years ago - who never had TV or much education and of course no internet, shouting from caves on Iwo Jima and Okinowa...
"To Hell with Babe Ruth!!!!!"
Then you tell me about fame.
If Jordan ever becomes a rallying cry for a foreign country in attacking us, then we can talk genro.
I didn't think it possible but somebody changed my mind on the internet, was going to say Jordan.
Posted on 6/7/16 at 7:46 pm to genro
quote:
Again, Jordan too was more recognizable than the US President or the Queen
Agreed......... But thanks to ESPN....... And such.... Ruth was like a GOD when he played...........
Posted on 6/7/16 at 7:46 pm to mizzoubuckeyeiowa
quote:
Well then Jerry West is the most famous person ever by that definition.
you're an idiot if you think Jerry West being chosen the logo of the NBA is the same as Jordan creating a billion dollar branding on his basketball skills
quote:
Imagine a society when one sports figure is on par with a President
really? like Jordan?
Posted on 6/7/16 at 7:48 pm to dukke v
It's just not easy to compare in two eras where tech, culture, and media were so different. Jordan' status wasn't possible in Ruth's day, Ruth's status wasn't possible in Jordan's.
Posted on 6/7/16 at 7:49 pm to dukke v
I think it is Babe Ruth. He debuted in 1914, over 100 years ago, and he played 20 years, and he retired over 80 years ago, but we are still talking about him. His fame has lasted that long. And he dominated in an era when there were fewer things going on, so he had more of the spotlight to himself. Also I think baseball is the sport that is most concerned w/ history so it keeps him in the public consciousness, especially since he played for the most famous sports team in the US (and is largely responsible for it being the most famous sports team in the country).
I think Jordan is second and that is largely b/c of Nike and his clothing. He is arguably more famous now, but Ruth had 70 years of fame before anyone ever knew MJs name.
Ali is certainly up there b/c of his legacy out of the ring. Jesse Owens as well. And maybe Tiger.
But I think Babe Ruth had the biggest impact and was the most well known. Back in the day the fame was so much more concentrated.
I think Jordan is second and that is largely b/c of Nike and his clothing. He is arguably more famous now, but Ruth had 70 years of fame before anyone ever knew MJs name.
Ali is certainly up there b/c of his legacy out of the ring. Jesse Owens as well. And maybe Tiger.
But I think Babe Ruth had the biggest impact and was the most well known. Back in the day the fame was so much more concentrated.
Posted on 6/7/16 at 7:50 pm to dukke v
quote:
You can say the same about Ruth..... There is nobody really close..
Barry Bonds was a better baseball player than Ruth
Willie Mays has a case .
quote:
There was NOBODY close to him... NOBODY.....
Ty Cobb
Rogers Hornsby
Gehrig
Walter Johnson
are all top 15-20 players EVER.
GET A CLUE
Posted on 6/7/16 at 7:51 pm to supatigah
quote:
Pre1950 Ruth
He died in 1948, so pre 1950 Ruth is your only option
Posted on 6/7/16 at 7:51 pm to Lester Earl
quote:
ou're an idiot if you think Jerry West being chosen the logo of the NBA is the same as Jordan creating a billion dollar branding on his basketball skills
Nah man...just saying that because you brought up logos..
I know the story of the artist in picking West and how he saw a picture and drew the logo.
But he's still the logo...Jump Man doesn't make Jordan famous, he has to be Jordan...Logos aren't really part of fame as a person, they morph into just brands.
Selling shoes doesn't quantify sports fame. It means corporate viability.
This post was edited on 6/7/16 at 7:53 pm
Posted on 6/7/16 at 7:52 pm to Lester Earl
quote:I mean all time great players played in Wilt's era but no one could come close to doing what he could do
Ty Cobb
Rogers Hornsby
Gehrig
Walter Johnson
are all top 15-20 players EVER.
GET A CLUE
Posted on 6/7/16 at 7:55 pm to dukke v
MJ only had meaningful basketball games in maybe 2 or 3 countries outside the US.
Ali fought in Japan Indonesia Malaysia Congo Germany UK Ireland Switzerland Puerto Rico, Philippines, Bahamas + the Olympics in Italy. Ali's fame dwarfs Jordan's. In addition to having performed in far more places, boxing in Ali's day was just far far far far more popular sport than Basketball has ever been.
Ali fought in Japan Indonesia Malaysia Congo Germany UK Ireland Switzerland Puerto Rico, Philippines, Bahamas + the Olympics in Italy. Ali's fame dwarfs Jordan's. In addition to having performed in far more places, boxing in Ali's day was just far far far far more popular sport than Basketball has ever been.
This post was edited on 6/7/16 at 7:59 pm
Posted on 6/7/16 at 7:56 pm to Lester Earl
I think it is Ali.
Ali just like Jordan and Babe can make about as equal a claim to being the GOAT as any of those guys in their sports.
However he also transcended his sport and became something far greater. A figure with radical ideas and beliefs that were used to inspire current and future generations. A figure head for real change in America.
The world loved Babe and Jordan...half of America hated Ali.
Ali even while battling Parkinson's and shaking uncontrollably gave one of the most iconic sports images in his old age holding the Olympic torch.
I would have to go with Ali due to degree of difficulty and overall lasting impact on the world.
Ali just like Jordan and Babe can make about as equal a claim to being the GOAT as any of those guys in their sports.
However he also transcended his sport and became something far greater. A figure with radical ideas and beliefs that were used to inspire current and future generations. A figure head for real change in America.
The world loved Babe and Jordan...half of America hated Ali.
Ali even while battling Parkinson's and shaking uncontrollably gave one of the most iconic sports images in his old age holding the Olympic torch.
I would have to go with Ali due to degree of difficulty and overall lasting impact on the world.
Posted on 6/7/16 at 7:58 pm to mizzoubuckeyeiowa
quote:
..Logos aren't really part of fame as a person,
Every company or brand has a logo. But it doesn't mean they are iconic. Jordan brand is iconic. The profit backs the worldwide popularity.
quote:
Selling shoes doesn't quantify sports fame. It means corporate viability.
again, read the topic. You want to know the biggest icon, and that is 100% a part of it.
Posted on 6/7/16 at 8:01 pm to genro
quote:
I mean all time great players played in Wilt's era but no one could come close to doing what he could do
look up Walter Johnson's numbers and tell me what pitchers were doing what he was doing in the early 1900s
Posted on 6/7/16 at 8:03 pm to Lester Earl
So I should add Walter to my list of Most Dominant against their Peers, along with Ruth and Wilt? That wasn't really my point...
Posted on 6/7/16 at 8:08 pm to Lester Earl
quote:
again, read the topic. You want to know the biggest icon, and that is 100% a part of it.
That's a part of it. not 100% of it and not even remotely close.
People buy shoes regardless...People were going to buy Nike Shoes regardless.
I bought a tennis shoe in the 80's - when I was a kid, because they said this is a good tennis shoe...
I had no damn clue who Stan Smith was at the time.
But damn, his shoe was everywhere...talked to girls, they had had idea who he was. But everyone was wearing the Stan Smith shoe!!!!!
So don't don't tell me fame equals selling corporate products.
Fame is word of mouth...is this person on the tip of your tongue? Like Babe Ruth.
This post was edited on 6/7/16 at 8:09 pm
Posted on 6/7/16 at 8:08 pm to genro
you dont really have a point. Remember, you're piggybacking off of PJ and that is never good .
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