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re: NBA Fans... Difference between today's game and 10+ years ago
Posted on 2/27/16 at 5:12 pm to VerlanderBEAST
Posted on 2/27/16 at 5:12 pm to VerlanderBEAST
quote:
lol Yeah maybe in another 5 years but right now he's not even clearly better than Cousins or Blake.
AD in a down year has a 25+ PER
blake griffin has 0 seasons of 25+ PER
cousins has 2 (the same as AD)
last year, AD had a 30+ PER
quote:
They are the evolution of Celtics KG. They aren't anything even remotely close to prime KG.
AD is
KAT will be
they took the rangy, long, jump-shooting/passing style of KG and improved upon everything, basically
in KGs prime he was throwing up PERs circling 20
0
Posted on 2/27/16 at 5:14 pm to VerlanderBEAST
quote:
Nothing in the rules changed since Pau and Kobe dominated the NBA with low post scoring
t's not an instantaneous reaction to the rules changes. Thibs didn't appear with his overload schemes until 07/08- and when teams copied him, offenses had to adjust too. We're seeing every team now on the same page, unlike before. There's a reason it's called MoreyBall- they started a trend.
quote:
teams stated winning with no low post offense.
Well the Heatles won 2 titles with LeBron in the post as their engine.
You should read this
Zach Lowe on the Rebirth of the Post Game
quote:
Smart post passing is a necessity now that defenses can bait post-up threats with all kinds of tricky help coverages. Fifteen years ago, Charles Barkley could back his man down and know the defense really had only two options: leave him in single coverage or send a hard double-team.
When the league scrapped the old illegal-defense rules, it freed coaches to get funky. Players can hover in open spaces; pretend they are going to help; swipe at the ball, and then recover back out to shooters; and emerge unannounced from almost anywhere.
Post-up scorers have to see two and three rotations ahead to create the most productive shots. If they go into a scoring move, they have to keep their head up, ready to improvise a pass if the defense sends help from an unexpected place. Post scorers who can’t think on their feet don’t present the same threat level they once did.
Posted on 2/27/16 at 5:16 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
is that why ben wallace got abused in international play?
anytime he had to leave the rim area he was abused
he was the primary reason we were embarrassed in the 2002 FIBA world championships
Go watch the Pistons vs Bucks and Nets in 04 they both tried to pull Big Ben away from the rim and he still dominated. Either way both Ben and Zo played away from the rim defensively a lot more than Kareem.
Posted on 2/27/16 at 5:20 pm to VerlanderBEAST
kareem moved better and was more intelligent all around
he's also 7-2 while both zo/wallace were under 6-11
an mobile, skilled 7-2 guy translates into any era
a limited, explosive, unskilled 6-9 guy? not so much
he's also 7-2 while both zo/wallace were under 6-11
an mobile, skilled 7-2 guy translates into any era
a limited, explosive, unskilled 6-9 guy? not so much
Posted on 2/27/16 at 5:23 pm to corndeaux
quote:yeah and Lakers owned the NBA with low post scoring from 08-10? Spontaneous double teams are not a problem for great post scorers on great teams
t's not an instantaneous reaction to the rules changes. Thibs didn't appear with his overload schemes until 07/08- and when teams copied him, offenses had to adjust too. We're seeing every team now on the same page, unlike before. There's a reason it's called MoreyBall- they started a trend.
Posted on 2/27/16 at 5:26 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:You are talking about defense right? Both Zo and Ben were better more skilled, more mobile and smarter than prime Kareem and by the 80s Kareem(along with 99% of the NBA) stopped playing D altogether
kareem moved better and was more intelligent all around
he's also 7-2 while both zo/wallace were under 6-11
an mobile, skilled 7-2 guy translates into any era
a limited, explosive, unskilled 6-9 guy? not so much
This post was edited on 2/27/16 at 5:27 pm
Posted on 2/27/16 at 5:26 pm to VerlanderBEAST
quote:
Spontaneous double teams are not a problem for great post scorers on great teams
No shite. Lowe says that. The problem is most bigs aren't Pau Gasol- a world class scorer and passer from the post.
And Bynum was only playing 20MPG on those Lakers teams in the playoffs- it wasn't anything like Gasol/Z-Bo twin towers. And even then, the Lakers were relying on a stretch/playmaking 4 in Lamar Odom. But thanks for playing.
Posted on 2/27/16 at 5:28 pm to tduecen
Four of the Warriors starters are making more than 40% from 3. No zone defense and multiple positions shooting the 3 with aplomb would cause difficulty for ANY team of any era. They have size, depth, and play unselfish team ball. They play good defense. For anyone to pretend the Warriors aren't worthy of comparison with any other team is simply silly, ignorant, or closed-minded.
Posted on 2/27/16 at 5:29 pm to corndeaux
yeah gasol and odom are the type of tall, skilled, and mobile big men that translate
patrick ewing is the one guy from that 80s/90s era who would have probably been even better today with how he played
the one i'm most curious about would be barkley
patrick ewing is the one guy from that 80s/90s era who would have probably been even better today with how he played
the one i'm most curious about would be barkley
Posted on 2/27/16 at 5:31 pm to VerlanderBEAST
quote:
Both Zo and Ben were better more skilled, more mobile and smarter than prime Kareem
I disagree here... For a 7'2 guy Jabbar was pretty mobile plus there are two shots that Zo and Ben could not stop.. The skyhook and Hakeems fade away jumper......
Posted on 2/27/16 at 5:32 pm to corndeaux
quote:
No shite. Lowe says that. The problem is most bigs aren't Pau Gasol- a world class scorer and passer from the post.
And Bynum was only playing 20MPG on those Lakers teams in the playoffs- it wasn't anything like Gasol/Z-Bo twin towers. And even then, the Lakers were relying on a stretch/playmaking 4 in Lamar Odom. But thanks for playing.
10-20-30 years ago there were always several bigs as good or better than Pau.
Pau and Kobe dominated with post scoring. It was not until Phil retired and they fell off that it opened up for the spread pick and roll crap we see now.
Posted on 2/27/16 at 5:34 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
patrick ewing is the one guy from that 80s/90s era who would have probably been even better today with how he played
Hakeem would DOMINATE in todays game... Ewing as well......
Posted on 2/27/16 at 5:34 pm to VerlanderBEAST
quote:
the spread pick and roll crap we see now.
yes ball movement, passing, shooting, and off-ball movement are terrible things to watch
Posted on 2/27/16 at 5:38 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:So wait Ewing the worst passer of all the great bigs would be even better
patrick ewing is the one guy from that 80s/90s era who would have probably been even better today with how he played
the one i'm most curious about would be barkley
Posted on 2/27/16 at 5:40 pm to VerlanderBEAST
he was criticized in his day for shooting. people, esp the NY media when they'd flip out, would criticize him for not posting up
Posted on 2/27/16 at 5:40 pm to mattz1122
quote:
Old codgers with petrified brains vs. people who lack the attention span to remember two years ago.
Posted on 2/27/16 at 5:44 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
yes ball movement, passing, shooting, and off-ball movement are terrible things to watch
Ball movement when it ends up in a 3 is repetitive
Posted on 2/27/16 at 5:45 pm to VerlanderBEAST
well that's just math
a 3 is a more valuable shot by a significant margin (50%)
hating teams relying on the 3 pointer is hating people who understand science and statistics
a 3 is a more valuable shot by a significant margin (50%)
hating teams relying on the 3 pointer is hating people who understand science and statistics
Posted on 2/27/16 at 5:46 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
kareem moved better and was more intelligent all around he's also 7-2 while both zo/wallace were under 6-11
This is true. Alcindor/Jabbar was an incredibly smooth, graceful athlete.
Posted on 2/27/16 at 5:46 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
patrick ewing is the one guy from that 80s/90s era who would have probably been even better today with how he played
I think so. Robinson is another one that I think would fit pretty well too as a unicorn 5
quote:
the one i'm most curious about would be barkley
Yeah. He would be interesting. I dont know if his passing/decision making was good enough and I dont think he would have been able to play as he got older and more and more out of shape.
I see griffin as a modern Barkley type. Curious to see how his game ages too
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