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Message
How to leverage new job offer for raise/benefits at current job?
Posted on 4/3/17 at 5:28 pm
Posted on 4/3/17 at 5:28 pm
Wife was asked to apply for a job by someone she has gotten to know through her work. Sounds like the president of the organization was impressed with her resume, and she's pretty good friends with the person who manages the position (it's who asked her to apply). So we have a feeling she'll get an offer. It's a really cool place to work, but it sounds like it'd be a ~5k pay cut.
She's recently had issues with her current role. Nothing major, just things that make her want to look elsewhere. She's up for a review that should come with a small raise. Although I'd love for her to take the new job if it made her happier, I think she's in a position at her current employer to get a big raise and fix some issues (expecting too much from her with no future laid out). So she could be giving up more than 5k to take the new job.
How do you bring up that you've been offered a new job (if it happens), but not come off badly? How do you basically say, I'm going to need xyz or I'm outta here? And at the same time, she's friends with the other manager. It's not intended to use error as a bargaining chip, but when we found out the pay was less, it made it a much harder decision. She certainly doesn't want to tarnish that relationship. What are the ethical boundaries in a scenario like this?
She's recently had issues with her current role. Nothing major, just things that make her want to look elsewhere. She's up for a review that should come with a small raise. Although I'd love for her to take the new job if it made her happier, I think she's in a position at her current employer to get a big raise and fix some issues (expecting too much from her with no future laid out). So she could be giving up more than 5k to take the new job.
How do you bring up that you've been offered a new job (if it happens), but not come off badly? How do you basically say, I'm going to need xyz or I'm outta here? And at the same time, she's friends with the other manager. It's not intended to use error as a bargaining chip, but when we found out the pay was less, it made it a much harder decision. She certainly doesn't want to tarnish that relationship. What are the ethical boundaries in a scenario like this?
7
Posted on 4/3/17 at 5:32 pm to KG6
quote:Unless she's willing to to walk, don't do it.
It's a really cool place to work, but it sounds like it'd be a ~5k pay cut.
Posted on 4/3/17 at 5:52 pm to castorinho
We are both willing for her to walk. No doubt about that. As things are she'd probably take the job for 5k less due to work environment and the big name of the place she'd work.
But she's probably guaranteed 2k raise after her review, and can maybe push that to 5k+ (she's already voiced concerns about her pay and management agreed, but said they couldn't do anything until her yearly review...which they are now slow playing). So now we are talking possibly a 10k loss to walk away and that's harder.
But she's probably guaranteed 2k raise after her review, and can maybe push that to 5k+ (she's already voiced concerns about her pay and management agreed, but said they couldn't do anything until her yearly review...which they are now slow playing). So now we are talking possibly a 10k loss to walk away and that's harder.
This post was edited on 4/3/17 at 6:17 pm
Posted on 4/3/17 at 6:28 pm to KG6
I've never been a fan of going to your current employer with another offer in hand as a way to negotiate a better salary package. Especially if there are other underlying issues. Those issues may not go away with a higher salary, depending on those issues.
I think she just needs to decide if she wants the other job, turn in notice, and let them counter if they want to. Then make a final decision.
I think she just needs to decide if she wants the other job, turn in notice, and let them counter if they want to. Then make a final decision.
Posted on 4/3/17 at 6:40 pm to The Spleen
Somewhat agree. Just wanted to get feelers to see. Would hate to find out later that they were willing to do more for her where she currently is, but since she didn't initiate it, nothing happened. Have no personal experience dealing with stuff like this.
This post was edited on 4/4/17 at 7:57 am
Posted on 4/3/17 at 7:04 pm to KG6
quote:
How to leverage new job offer for raise/benefits at current job?
1. lie to your current employer
2. wait and see if they call your bluff
3. ???
4. profit
I only half kid. I've told current employers about other job offers as a physician and basically said I like the current practice/hospital/clinic but have an offer that would make more sense for my family and ask if current employer is willing to match certain aspects of the new offer. I've been told no to some things and yes to others. I just feel like it ain't gonna hurt to ask. Just don't be a jerk about it, gotta stroke the boss's ego while you do it.
Posted on 4/3/17 at 8:10 pm to KG6
Why not just see if you can get more out of the new company? Tell them that you aren't in a situation to take a pay cut, but you are very interested in the opportunity that they are offering.
Posted on 4/3/17 at 8:18 pm to The Spleen
I got another offer once before and was offered a big bump to stay...should have taken the other one. The money made me forget why I was looking the first place.
Posted on 4/3/17 at 8:25 pm to KG6
Based on the things you're saying, she should negotiate her new offer.
Posted on 4/3/17 at 9:27 pm to KG6
5K is not life changing.
Does the new position offer growth and promotion opportunities?
Does the new position offer growth and promotion opportunities?
Posted on 4/4/17 at 5:30 am to makersmark1
Current job is larger, but she's recently been passed over for a position. One that is really right up her alley. She has a stellar reputation there and experience along with an MBA that has a concentration in that specific field. Not sure when they'd be willing to seriously consider her.
New job is smaller and the opportunity is unknown. But it is a place that would be very well known in all of Houston, if not all of Texas and the surrounding states. Might be good experience for advancement outside of that job.
Girl who asked her to apply used to work with her and said the work is much better at new place. So again, we are willing to lose out on 5k for that better work environment. Just would like to see what can be squeezed out of old job. It is for a local government, so it's not like they'll throw out tons. But they know she's underpaid, so I expect some uptick at her review and if that coincides with a 2 week notice, it might be a sweeter deal. He'll, the position she applied for internally is still open as the other guy turned it down....maybe they freak and offer it to her
. Not serious about that, but I do think a few of her managers will melt. I've met them and they seriously rely on her.
New job is smaller and the opportunity is unknown. But it is a place that would be very well known in all of Houston, if not all of Texas and the surrounding states. Might be good experience for advancement outside of that job.
Girl who asked her to apply used to work with her and said the work is much better at new place. So again, we are willing to lose out on 5k for that better work environment. Just would like to see what can be squeezed out of old job. It is for a local government, so it's not like they'll throw out tons. But they know she's underpaid, so I expect some uptick at her review and if that coincides with a 2 week notice, it might be a sweeter deal. He'll, the position she applied for internally is still open as the other guy turned it down....maybe they freak and offer it to her
. Not serious about that, but I do think a few of her managers will melt. I've met them and they seriously rely on her. Posted on 4/4/17 at 7:28 am to KG6
I've had a similar experience I can share in my career.
I knew I was underpaid so I talked to my manager about it. He wasn't sure if he could do anything so I ended up having to talk to my manager's manager. He, in a round about way, said he thought I was being paid fair for my experience. I disagreed based on research of the local market and told him he's basically putting me in a position where I can't be paid fair unless I get leverage. He agreed, I said ok and went back to work. A month later I walked in to his office with a letter for about $10k more than I asked him for earlier. He then beat that by $5k to keep me.
The important thing is not to talk about what's fair. Just have a conversation about facts irregardless of what is fair. My story was 8 years ago. I'm a manager myself now days. I know from personal experience now that it's hard for most managers to get any kind of money for their employees post original negotiation. I think it was less about him thinking I was being paid fair and more about the fact that going get more money for an existing employee is a real pain in the arse in our organization.
She really should look at the long term effects of going in to that new role. If it's a very respected place then working 2-5 years there might boost her in to an even bigger position at a third company for the following role. I've seen people go back to a larger role in the company they originally left. Point is think about how that new experience will contribute to the next role. If it's not a resume building position I'd look for a different one.
This last bit about the open position she applied for still being open. To me that's a bit strange. I'd leave that job on principle alone in that case. I've never worked in government though. What I've heard about government work is you don't get paid worth a flip and it's not what you know it's who you know.
I knew I was underpaid so I talked to my manager about it. He wasn't sure if he could do anything so I ended up having to talk to my manager's manager. He, in a round about way, said he thought I was being paid fair for my experience. I disagreed based on research of the local market and told him he's basically putting me in a position where I can't be paid fair unless I get leverage. He agreed, I said ok and went back to work. A month later I walked in to his office with a letter for about $10k more than I asked him for earlier. He then beat that by $5k to keep me.
The important thing is not to talk about what's fair. Just have a conversation about facts irregardless of what is fair. My story was 8 years ago. I'm a manager myself now days. I know from personal experience now that it's hard for most managers to get any kind of money for their employees post original negotiation. I think it was less about him thinking I was being paid fair and more about the fact that going get more money for an existing employee is a real pain in the arse in our organization.
She really should look at the long term effects of going in to that new role. If it's a very respected place then working 2-5 years there might boost her in to an even bigger position at a third company for the following role. I've seen people go back to a larger role in the company they originally left. Point is think about how that new experience will contribute to the next role. If it's not a resume building position I'd look for a different one.
This last bit about the open position she applied for still being open. To me that's a bit strange. I'd leave that job on principle alone in that case. I've never worked in government though. What I've heard about government work is you don't get paid worth a flip and it's not what you know it's who you know.
Posted on 4/4/17 at 7:38 am to BeerMoney
Every boss is different, you have to know what works for your boss. I rarely think it's best to use the pay me this or I'm leaving bc they may pay you this time but don't be surprised if they are looking to replace you shortly after. They would be scared you may do that again.
You also have to know how much you are worth to the company. Could someone else there do your job if you left?
You also have to know how much you are worth to the company. Could someone else there do your job if you left?
Posted on 4/4/17 at 7:46 am to KG6
Never stay in a job that is not valuing you appropriately. Basically, we all work for ourselves. Is the compensation package worth the grind?
I look for other opportunities at least once a year. Just to see what the market is.
I look for other opportunities at least once a year. Just to see what the market is.
Posted on 4/4/17 at 8:09 am to BeerMoney
quote:
This last bit about the open position she applied for still being open. To me that's a bit strange. I'd leave that job on principle alone in that case.
Several underlying issues here. She originally applied and was hired for a role she is probably very overqualified for (she handles social media). She was a stay at home mom for 6 months, but wanted to go back to work, and this was the first thing she found. Now I think it hampers her that she is just "the facebook girl". Even though they are constantly pulling her into higher level marketing and community relations projects and she actually held the exact title she was passed over for when she was in LA. In addition, the main boss has a reputation for hiring 30 something girls. Wife overheard HR say "maybe we can get them to actually hire a man for once". So I think a 31 year old blonde is not what they had in mind when they created the position. So I agree....I think she should tell them to get fricked. But if they started freaking about her leaving and offered a 10k raise or something, it's hard to leave that. If that other position came back into play, it'd be 20k+ raise.
This post was edited on 4/4/17 at 8:18 am
Posted on 4/4/17 at 10:51 am to KG6
Just use leverage. Figure out what job she wants most, and bring some kind of hard figures to both to see what kind of salary she can justify she deserves.
The idea that someone shouldn't ask for a raise and a company would hate an employee that does is outrageous, if a manager and employer does not want an employee to justify a raise occasionally then they are both a terrible employer and I say screw them.
We are no longer in the 20 and a pension era. You work for yourself to make the most that you can in the best environment. You work for your current paycheck, very little more.
The idea that someone shouldn't ask for a raise and a company would hate an employee that does is outrageous, if a manager and employer does not want an employee to justify a raise occasionally then they are both a terrible employer and I say screw them.
We are no longer in the 20 and a pension era. You work for yourself to make the most that you can in the best environment. You work for your current paycheck, very little more.
Posted on 4/4/17 at 11:51 am to KG6
There's a Wall Street Journal statistic out there that 93% of people who accept counter offers are gone within 18 months. You can Google that and figure out that maybe it's not a great idea to consider taking a counter. Of the 7% remaining some percent of that are still always looking. Which is true of me, I always keep an eye open for that big break.
At some point you might just need to consider that her current company is just a bad culture situation and she'll never really flourish there.
At some point you might just need to consider that her current company is just a bad culture situation and she'll never really flourish there.
Posted on 4/4/17 at 1:39 pm to The Spleen
quote:
I've never been a fan of going to your current employer with another offer in hand as a way to negotiate a better salary package. Especially if there are other underlying issues. Those issues may not go away with a higher salary, depending on those issues.
its worked for me twice, but I think its company and boss dependent.
Don't do it unless you are going to walk, and also realize that soft issues will likely never be resolved. You can adjust pay but work atmosphere isn't going to change.
Posted on 4/4/17 at 3:00 pm to KG6
Let me know how this goes, I am in a similar position but with a pay bump. Reason I am not ditching right away is because ive not stayed here for a year (nor did i for my previous position)
Posted on 4/4/17 at 4:29 pm to baldona
" if they want to leave because of money, they are not the kind of person we want working for us anyway"
is an exact quote I've heard on more than one occasion....
is an exact quote I've heard on more than one occasion....
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