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re: NIT: LSU Men hosting North Texas in Opening Round, Tuesday at 6 PM CT, SECN/ESPN+
Posted on 3/18/24 at 12:23 pm to mcmaniacinsaneasylum
Posted on 3/18/24 at 12:23 pm to mcmaniacinsaneasylum
quote:
That's not at all what I'm saying
Well that’s what I’m saying. I can’t wait to see us go out there and compete at a high level. Sorry if that offends you for some reason.
1
Posted on 3/18/24 at 12:23 pm to ShinerHorns
quote:
Yep. I’d argue it’s more of an achievement to win the NIT this year than that joke of a tournament they got going on in the so-called “big dance”.
Posted on 3/18/24 at 12:26 pm to ShinerHorns
quote:
Well that’s what I’m saying. I can’t wait to see us go out there and compete at a high level. Sorry if that offends you for some reason.
Overlooked how you said WIN the NIT... so let me adjust my answer.
Personally, I would love to win the NIT... I'm biased as an LSU fan. It's tough to say if I would rather win the NIT or get bounced in round 1 of NCAAT..
OBJECTIVELY, NCAAT means more BUT winning NIT = more games so..
Posted on 3/18/24 at 12:48 pm to Alt26
All I remember about the game that while North Texas was a tough "out", I felt like LSU was the better team. As it is, LSU is in a much better place since then. I am surprised that we are only a 2.5 point favorite at home unless North Texas improved as well or was missing someone important in that game.
ETA: From what I can see there is a 6'5" guard Rondel Walker who started playing in late December, so he was probably waiting on a waiver like Cook. Only 4.1 pts and 4.6 rebounds in 26 minutes a game off the bench doesn't look like much of a factor.
The play 3 forwards. One (6'9", 225 lbs) fouled out in 23 minutes, another (6'9", 250 lbs) had 4 fouls in 12 minutes, while the 3rd (6'7", 200lbs) only had 2 fouls in 33 minutes, but only 5 rebounds, so...
ETA: From what I can see there is a 6'5" guard Rondel Walker who started playing in late December, so he was probably waiting on a waiver like Cook. Only 4.1 pts and 4.6 rebounds in 26 minutes a game off the bench doesn't look like much of a factor.
The play 3 forwards. One (6'9", 225 lbs) fouled out in 23 minutes, another (6'9", 250 lbs) had 4 fouls in 12 minutes, while the 3rd (6'7", 200lbs) only had 2 fouls in 33 minutes, but only 5 rebounds, so...
This post was edited on 3/18/24 at 1:00 pm
Posted on 3/18/24 at 12:50 pm to bstaceyau19
quote:
Besides, do you really want to be one of those programs who turn down the NIT because they feel that their personal feces is not odiferous?
No, it's odiferous, Roses
Posted on 3/18/24 at 1:02 pm to mmcgrath
quote:Game lines are generally analytics based. UNT is around 2 points better than LSU in Kenpom rankings. Usually that would translate to UNT being a 1 or 2 point favorite on a neutral court. LSU is getting around 4 points for playing at home.
I am surprised that we are only a 2.5 point favorite at home unless North Texas improved as well or was missing someone important in that game
Posted on 3/18/24 at 1:12 pm to mmcgrath
quote:
All I remember about the game that while North Texas was a tough "out", I felt like LSU was the better team.
It was a close game throughout with NTU leading most of the second half. It was a 3 point game with 2:00 to go. LSU pulled away a bit at the end. It was one of many games this year where LSU easily outshot their opponent in terms of FG% LSU shot 50% compared to NTU's 32%. But NTU had 12 more FG attempts and made 12 pointers. LSU did not shoot it well from 3 that day. They also got beat on the glass.
On a positive note, LSU became a better 3 point shooting team as the season went along. They also got a little better at defending the 3.
quote:
I am surprised that we are only a 2.5 point favorite at home unless North Texas improved as well or was missing someone important in that game.
Looking at LSU objectively away from the prism of fanhood you see they really aren't that good of a team. The line is what it is because LSU's predictive data metrics suck. As it sits today LSU is 91st in the KenPom ratings (12th among SEC teams) NTU is nearly 20 spots higher at 73. A variation of that data is what is used to set lines. Not just some nerds sitting around subjectively thinking LSU is "better". LSU had that one really good week where they beat South Carolina and Kentucky. But before that they were 1-6 in the prior 7 games and 3-3 after the Kentucky game with all three wins coming against teams at the bottom of the SEC.
That's not to say this year doesn't represent progress from last season, nor that LSU can't beat NTU. It's just that the line is what it is because, frankly, LSU's just not that good.
Posted on 3/18/24 at 2:24 pm to Alt26
I would rather go to the NCAA tournament but if the question is would I rather win the NIT or lose the first round of NCAA that is a no brainer. Win the NIT. Duh. To go through a tournament experience like that and end up winning the championship game can do wonders for your players coming back and your program recruiting not to mention the tournament experience that would help you if you make the NCAA the next year. There are plenty of teams who are just good enough to be in the NCAA but don't get in.
Posted on 3/18/24 at 2:43 pm to mcspufftiger7
quote:
I would rather go to the NCAA tournament but if the question is would I rather win the NIT or lose the first round of NCAA that is a no brainer. Win the NIT. Duh. To go through a tournament experience like that and end up winning the championship game can do wonders for your players coming back and your program recruiting not to mention the tournament experience that would help you if you make the NCAA the next year. There are plenty of teams who are just good enough to be in the NCAA but don't get in.
I don't know how much of a correlation there really is now because rosters often change so much in the offseason.
Xavier won it two years ago with an interim HC. They they then had a really good season the following year with a new HC. But was that because of the NIT expereince? Or just a new HC? Probably a bit of both. This year Xavier has losing record (but ironically back in the NIT).
Vanderbilt made a run to the quarterfinals of the NIT two years ago. They did the same last year and seemed to have the pieces in place for a better season this year...until several of those pieces left in the offseason.
The you have A&M who made it to the championship game 2 years ago. They've reached the NCAA Tournament in the next two seasons. But they lost 6 players from that NIT team.
I'll NEVER say winning the NIT is better than making the NCAA Tournament (I'd venture to guess very few LSU fans knew North Texas won it last year). But if LSU can retain guys like Ward, Reed, Williams, a nice run go could give you something to build upon. If not, the run will be a "one off" and McMahon will be starting fresh again even more than he already is next season with (seemingly) at least 6 new players
Posted on 3/18/24 at 3:13 pm to Alt26
Will respectfully disagree. Losing a game in the 1st round of the NCAA cannot compare with winning 5 games and a championship in the NIT. From a player, coach and fan standpoint. And true basketball fans, not just LSU fans, know who wins both tournaments because they watch. I knew who won the NIT last year because I watched it.
Posted on 3/18/24 at 3:18 pm to mcspufftiger7
quote:
true basketball fans, not just LSU fans, know who wins both tournaments because they watch. I knew who won the NIT last year because I watched it
That's why I was pleased we were going to Charleston.. lots of good teams even though name value wise to casuals it wouldn't appear that way. I was beyond thrilled when we beat North Texas. From that moment I knew we would be an NIT team bare minimum.
Posted on 3/18/24 at 3:32 pm to mcspufftiger7
quote:
Will respectfully disagree. Losing a game in the 1st round of the NCAA cannot compare with winning 5 games and a championship in the NIT. From a player, coach and fan standpoint. And true basketball fans, not just LSU fans, know who wins both tournaments because they watch. I knew who won the NIT last year because I watched it.
But you aren't going to grow the program just getting the attention of "true basketball fans". You have to get the people who generally wouldn't pay too much attention to the program to show up. And a game vs. North Texas in a tournament that isn't gaining any headlines isn't going to do that. Casual college basketball fans know about the NCAA Tournament (just go to any office this week where someone is starting a pool). Only one other person in my office even knew LSU was in the NIT...let alone what the NIT is. Do you think all of those people showing up to the women's basketball games are "true women's basketball fans"? Of course not. They got caught up in loving a winner.
Casual fans will tune in and get excited about the NCAA Tournament. They won't about the NIT. LSU basketball already has you and me. They don't need to do anything else to get us. It's the vast majority of casual fans out there they have to reach. And the best way to do it is by reaching the NCAA Tournament...even if you lose in game 1.
Hell, the last time LSU was in the NIT was a bit of a perfect storm to draw interest. Home game vs. In-state rival coming off of a bad two season led by a FORMER coach. It was also a game where the two coaches were bickering before the game. Even with all of that LSU barely filled half of the PMAC (attendance was appx. 6,800)
If the players are happy and excited, I'm happy and excited for them. But the NIT just doesn't draw interest.
Posted on 3/18/24 at 3:43 pm to Alt26
I can assure you if LSU was to make the final 4 in the NIT the casual fan would be watching. Yes it doesn't get as much exposure as the NCAA or as much as it did before NCAA enlarged the number to 64 teams. Pretty much lost a lot of its luster after 1995. But I'm not purely talking from a fan standpoint. The grind of going through a tournament and winning a championship will benefit any coach, player or program. And that excitement and confidence can lead to players staying with the expectation that they can replicate that at the next level with a coach that has led them there already. I would be surprised if anyone left the team after winning the NIT championship unless they didn't have a part in winning it.
Posted on 3/18/24 at 3:55 pm to mcspufftiger7
The reality is college basketball isn't super popular outside of NCAAT time... barring certain regions/states. Midwest for example.
I agree with Alt that the NIT doesn't draw much interest.
But I also agree with mcspuff that making the NIT is only good for the program (and I don't think Alt disagrees, his only contention is that it won't attract casual fans).
If we win the whole NIT I'd love for LSU to hang a banner... but I'm a diehard. I can see how most casuals wouldn't like it. But winning the NIT isn't easy. There are teams in it that are better than some teams in the NCAAT. But like Alt said most casual fans won't recognize that.
I agree with Alt that the NIT doesn't draw much interest.
But I also agree with mcspuff that making the NIT is only good for the program (and I don't think Alt disagrees, his only contention is that it won't attract casual fans).
If we win the whole NIT I'd love for LSU to hang a banner... but I'm a diehard. I can see how most casuals wouldn't like it. But winning the NIT isn't easy. There are teams in it that are better than some teams in the NCAAT. But like Alt said most casual fans won't recognize that.
Posted on 3/18/24 at 4:05 pm to rds dc
quote:
NET 94 vs. NET 79
North Texas(16-14 AAC):
0-6 in Q1
2-4 in Q2
14-4 in Q3/Q4
97 SOS
LSU (17-15 SEC):
4-8 in Q1
1-6 in Q2
12-1 in Q3/Q4
82 SOS
You'd never guess who is 15 spots higher in the NET... Total joke but McMahon seriously needs to figure out how to cheat it next year
Posted on 3/18/24 at 4:09 pm to JackD7
quote:
otal joke but McMahon seriously needs to figure out how to cheat it next year
Yes, one of the area's where I think he can get better is efficient scheduling, our OOC did not do us any favors. We need to hunt down some mid to decent mid majors and get them in the Pmac.
Posted on 3/18/24 at 4:15 pm to Pnels08
First round exit in a knock off tournament at home. Book it
Posted on 3/18/24 at 4:18 pm to mcspufftiger7
quote:
Don't be the idiot that compares the 1st season of each coach. Apples and oranges. Point is Wade went to NIT after terrible seasons under Jones. Mcmahon is going to NIT his second year but his first year was a cluster f**k due to the Wade situation before. That is a fact. And Wade went to the NIT with future NBA players on his team when he got there. Doe that make him a bad coach that year? It would if his name was Mcmahon. These people seriously need to get some therapy. Constantly bringing up Wade whether the news is good or bad for LSU basketball shows just how mentally unstable these people are. I will be there supporting LSU basketball and hope this helps springboard the team to a better outcome next year. I will judge Mcmahon on his own merits and not on Will Wade. He has done a great job with the exit of Cook. Not easy to lose your leading scorer and starting PG on this team and continue to have wins in big games against ranked opponents
You misinterpreted what I was saying and I can only assume you did not read the post I responded to.
quote:
Anyone who doesn't agree with that is just a moron and loser in life.
> Posted on 3/18/24 at 4:59 pm to mcspufftiger7
quote:
I guess McMahon taking the same route as Wade is somehow failure now.
For a MacFan you spend a lot of time with "Wade" on your mind.
Can't say that I blame you, we all need a little sunshine in our life.
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