re: Homebrewing: In-Process Thread

I will brew the beer this weekend, so I should be good to go in that time frame I suppose. Will have to build up my bugs before pitching though. May even just go the commercial route.

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So basically you can make a starter when you start your brew day and pitch it when your wort is ready (for me usually 4+ hours later)

the results of the experiment were that there was no noticeable difference. I think this would allow you a couple different options. One, you can have a spontaneous brew day without worrying about not having a starter ready. Second, I would think that you can make a starter out of your pre-boil wort rather than using DME

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But what happens to your cell count? Healthy yeast is very important, but you also need the correct quantity of cells to ferment out the way you want? I make my starters the day before brew day, when using Gigayeast. For traditional sometimes i make my starters 2 days before brew day.

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Also, did some google searching and on the beeradvocate forums, they recommend decanting and cold crashing off of their starter. Why and how would you do this?

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Cold crash in fridge day of brew and pour off liquid on top of white yeast on bottom.

Probably not necessary though. Do what works for you.

And finally, i've been tasting my latest IPA. If you recall i made an IPA using 2-row and pilsen as my base and Vienna and Honey as my darker malt. The hop bill was mostly el dorado, with some motueka and azacca.

It was first ready for consumption about a week ago, and i did not enjoy it. Couldn't get a taste of anything. Overly carbonated.
I tried another 3 days later. More flavor was coming out, still highly carbonated.
Tried one yesterday and flavor is more pronounced, though i do still find it a little high on carbonation. It's an ok IPA right now. It's 6.6% and 100 IBU's. Not a fan of the El Dorado hops. It's very bubble gum-ish flavor. Hopefully another week or 2 and more of the flavors of this brew come out. But I think this beer has finally weened me off of using experimental and new hops until they are well established.

I've also learned a few things while listening to some podcasts. When i develop IPA recipes, i pick hops with flavors i want it to impart. I think i try to be too fancy, because in my head i tell myself this for example, "well i want it to be tropical/flowery so i'll add some cascade, but with some citrus (amarillo) and piney (simcoe) notes in the background. And well maybe i want a little spice so i'll add chinook." I think i tend to muddle my IPA's too much with contrasting hop flavors. I think my best hop forward beer was probably my all Galaxy XPA, but i was experimenting with grain bills, so next time i'll simplify that too.
Also i've been trying to find ways to accentuate hop fruitiness by using honey malt, and i don't think i'll try that again. I like a straight 2 row, vienna, and some acidulated malt for PH for a malt bill. Or go traditional with 2 row, some crystal malt or munich.

I guess, in short, I need to simplify my recipes and stop trying to be fancy and create an IPA using ingredients no one has ever used before. Also, if i'm using new hops, experiment with pale ales with using only that hop. Or a bittering hop, and late additions of the new hop.

I've created a handful of recipes to brew, and i think i'm not going to brew an IPA or Pale Ale for a little while now. The following is up next on my "to brew" list.

28 - Blueberry German Hefeweizen - First time brewing a german hefe. Brewing Friday.
29 - Oktoberfest - First lager
30 - Night Owl Coffee Stout - This one came out excellent last year. This iteration i'm switching black patent malt for roasted barley and slightly upping the chocolate malt. Debating whether or not to use Cocoa Nibs.

Recipes created but not assigned a brew order:
My first Sour - Debating on using my french benefits recipe for this, or using a Jester King Clone of Noble King, i created.
Simcoe Pale Ale - using all simcoe hops. About 52 IBU's
Citrarilla IPA - IPA using only Citra and Amarillo. I realized i never made an IPA that focused exclusively on these hops.
Zombie Dust Clone - Similar to the above recipe, but all Citra
Robust Porter
Pliny the Elder Clone - Using the clone from Zymurgy. That recipe has an insane IBU count. 202.7 i think. It's a 90 minute boil and calls for 3.5 oz. of CTZ at the front end. This recipe doesn't seem right, anyone try it?
3 C's IPA - Traditional IPA using cascade centennial and columbus hops
Grassy IPA - IPA using spicy/Grassy-ish hops.
Jester King Black Metal Stout Clone - Clone using the recipe from the brewery. Haven't had this version using their saison yeast strain which supposedly is a french yeast strain. I did have it when it used a British Ale strain and it was fantastic.

As you can see, i have a backlog of brews to make my way through. Plus i'm sure i'll find a style i've never brewed before and add that in there. Have been interested in making a biere de garde, but don't know of any good examples to try before deciding if i want to do that. I also want to brew some traditional belgian "monk" ales. May throw one of those in there around Christmas.

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But what happens to your cell count? Healthy yeast is very important, but you also need the correct quantity of cells to ferment out the way you want? I make my starters the day before brew day, when using Gigayeast. For traditional sometimes i make my starters 2 days before brew day.

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Well, that's the whole point of the experiment, to see if cell count mattered. Turns out, with this batch, it didn't.

As for decanting, you wouldn't decant the starter. I typically do now, but I make my starter a few days ahead of time.

I don't think I will change my typical procedure based on this experiment but I think it's good to know if I want to brew but haven't made the starter already, it's still ok

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One would advocate that the reason to decant the starter liquid is that most likely your starter wort was nothing like the beer you are pitching into. If you make a 1 L starter and pitch it into 5 gallons of wort (roughly 19 L) thats 5% of your wort that is a new beer.

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Got ya. I typically use Light DME or Wheat DME for my starters.

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Also, if i'm using new hops, experiment with pale ales with using only that hop

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Yeah,

I've got 4 oz. of Jarrylo and 4 oz. of Azacca coming in the mail soon that I need to figure out what to do with.

What were you hoping for out of the Azacca?

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What were you hoping for out of the Azacca?

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Don't know. Some floral citrus flavors i think? I might have just saw those were new at LA Homebrew and picked them up.

My IPA is el dorado heavy, so i don't really pick anything else up. Off of smell though, i did get some hints of spice. Isn't Little Sumpin Sumpin made with Azacca?

ETA: Just read the descriptor of pineapple, mango, etc... That is what i was shooting for.

I think my beer just needs a little more time. I have plenty if any wants some. I can either meet up with some of you, or drop some off at LA Homebrew if they have fridge space if anyone wants to try it. I'm giving it another week of bottle conditioning though.

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If THIS is the recipe you are talking about, Vinnie wrote the article so that's about as good a source as you can get.

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Yeah, that's the one.

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I've never brewed that recipe, but Vinnie has stated a number of times that Russian River uses hop extract for bittering in PTE and PTY.

When this was written in 2009 hop extract wasn't readily available to homebrewers. NB may have introduced the hopshot, but it would have been brand new and the only source. I would imagine he just did the IBU conversion using a hop that was relatively easy to get for the article.

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So how much hopshot would you translate into that. Are they using the extract as the first addition instead of those hops.

What is the carb volume for a German Hefeweizen? The BJCP style guide says 2.5-2.8. Another source says 3.0-5.1. That seems high.