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re: Why is Mexico a failed country?
Posted on 1/25/17 at 1:34 pm to Bjorn Cyborg
Posted on 1/25/17 at 1:34 pm to Bjorn Cyborg
I guess you do not understand what I am trying to get at.
What has happened in all of the cases I listed?
Mexico is a shattered country held together loosely by Federation. It has never, to my knowledge attempted to either expand or incorporate ideals without being beaten back.
Mexico would be better served breaking up much like the Baltic States and localize power.
The only strong national leader that I am aware of in Mexican History that survived multiple decades is De Santa Anna.
What has happened in all of the cases I listed?
Mexico is a shattered country held together loosely by Federation. It has never, to my knowledge attempted to either expand or incorporate ideals without being beaten back.
Mexico would be better served breaking up much like the Baltic States and localize power.
The only strong national leader that I am aware of in Mexican History that survived multiple decades is De Santa Anna.
This post was edited on 1/25/17 at 1:35 pm
Posted on 1/25/17 at 1:37 pm to sms151t
My point is, that after a couple centuries, if your country is still a failure then your citizens probably don't care. And if they don't care, why should we?
We are a model of government that they can see. If they wanted to join the first world, there are obvious changes they can make. If they don't want to, fine. By why should we subsidize failure?
We are a model of government that they can see. If they wanted to join the first world, there are obvious changes they can make. If they don't want to, fine. By why should we subsidize failure?
Posted on 1/25/17 at 1:40 pm to Bjorn Cyborg
well in Mexico's defense, they are in the middle of a civil war currently so societal change won't be that easy
Posted on 1/25/17 at 1:41 pm to Bjorn Cyborg
Mexico is a Naro-State. Once the drug kingpins have as much money as does the State...they can buy the State Authorities. Or threaten them and family with sure death. Have you watched those Drug Cartel beheading videos, BC? You WILL NOT forget them.
Many Mexicans despise 'Gringos', for various reasons. A lot because of how they view the historical Texas/California annexation/conquest. So they abandoned morality, and winked and nodded when drugs were sold north of the Border...and money came back to their own communities. But they created a monster that they no longer can control.
Trump may just be their best chance to destroy this 'monster'. Not without suffering though.
Many Mexicans despise 'Gringos', for various reasons. A lot because of how they view the historical Texas/California annexation/conquest. So they abandoned morality, and winked and nodded when drugs were sold north of the Border...and money came back to their own communities. But they created a monster that they no longer can control.
Trump may just be their best chance to destroy this 'monster'. Not without suffering though.
Posted on 1/25/17 at 1:41 pm to Bjorn Cyborg
I am in no way saying we should subsidize their country. I was just pointing out specific times within the Mexican History that you can pinpoint to declines and falls of Mexico.
Posted on 1/25/17 at 1:44 pm to Bjorn Cyborg
quote:
Why is Mexico a failed country?
While "failed country" is a pretty broad classification, your question has merit.
To narrow it down to a single answer, though, would be absurd. It's a host of factors and issues, dating back to its formation and colonization. Internal strife, areas of vast wealth difference, etc.
But if you really want a single event, the best place to look is the presidency of Santa Anna, and in more modern times the 1982 economic crisis that obliterated their economy. Honestly, after the 1982 crisis Mexico has only been a shell of its former self.
Posted on 1/25/17 at 1:44 pm to Bjorn Cyborg
quote:
Crime and corruption are solvable.
If one wants to solve them. What happens to reformers elected at the local level in Mexico? 2 to the back of the head if they're lucky.
So, they never go higher.
quote:
Is it really the demographics?
No - Mexico is pretty diverse - there are corrupt folks in all shades of brown down there - in the Spanish tradition.
Posted on 1/25/17 at 1:44 pm to sms151t
quote:
The only strong national leader that I am aware of in Mexican History that survived multiple decades is De Santa Anna.
Mexico has a long history of their Presidents being assassinated in the 20th century dating back to 1913.
It seems the most dangerous job in Mexico.
Posted on 1/25/17 at 1:46 pm to RCDfan1950
quote:
Mexico is a Naro-State. Once the drug kingpins have as much money as does the State...they can buy the State Authorities. Or threaten them and family with sure death.
Our country had our issues with similar problems during prohibition and with the mafia and other organized crime and we overcame.
What I am sensing is that people think this is a problem with the Mexican people, but they don't want to say it for fear of sounding racist.
Posted on 1/25/17 at 1:49 pm to Bjorn Cyborg
It isn't. Also, the cartels are created and maintained to keep the flow of drugs into the U.S. So, you could just as easily ask, Why has America screwed up Mexico so much?
Posted on 1/25/17 at 1:52 pm to TBoy
quote:
It isn't. Also, the cartels are created and maintained to keep the flow of drugs into the U.S. So, you could just as easily ask, Why has America screwed up Mexico so much?
If the number one source of income in your country is remittances from citizens who have left, then your country is a failure.
If America has a hand in their failure, then perhaps we need to stop. I assume you are pro-wall by your response.
Posted on 1/25/17 at 1:58 pm to Bjorn Cyborg
Read "Civiliaztion "by Niall Ferguson
Posted on 1/25/17 at 2:00 pm to Bjorn Cyborg
It's not really a failed state in the traditional sense of the term. It's in that bucket of large middle-ish income countries with places like Russia and Argentina and Iran that have some economic power and productivity but are just crippled by corruption. Northern Mexico and parts of western Mexico are out of control, but the whole country isn't like that. They also have some serious class mobility issues (like pretty much everywhere else in Latin America) that are pretty much absent in the United States.
Posted on 1/25/17 at 2:01 pm to Bjorn Cyborg
I was thinking today that perhaps a better way to keep people from wanting to illegally cross the border is to actually invest in their country. Essentially building a wall is a band-aid, and doesn't fix the actual problem. Instead of spending billions on a wall, would there be ways to invest that money into building industry in Mexico that they could then use with us for trade purposes? We've already seen some manufacturing jobs move to Mexico, would there be anything else that could be directly done without just giving funds to corrupt officials?
Posted on 1/25/17 at 2:10 pm to Bmath
Yes, Mexico should be given an ultimatum: Here is a blueprint to turn your country around. Here is a timetable to implement these changes. Do this, or we are done supporting your bad habits.
Posted on 1/25/17 at 2:14 pm to Bjorn Cyborg
They do not have the rule of law.
A country which doesn't adhere to the rule of law will not be a great country.
A country which doesn't adhere to the rule of law will not be a great country.
Posted on 1/25/17 at 2:15 pm to Bjorn Cyborg
The rich people take care of themselves and their ilk. Instead of the govt making it an equal playing field for all, they decided to keep the power and resources for themselves instead of giving it to the people. Pancho villa tried, and he was the last one to really make a difference.
Posted on 1/25/17 at 2:18 pm to Bjorn Cyborg
quote:
Their economy is based on shipping their citizens to the US and having them work and send money back home. That's a crappy business model.
That is not even remotely true
On the whole, quality of life in Mexico is not as good as quality of life in the US, but as a Latin American nation, I'd say you could do much worse.
Posted on 1/25/17 at 2:22 pm to BulldogXero
quote:
not even remotely true
It's more than remotely true. Foreign remittances accounted for 3% of the Mexican GDP and in 2015 overtook oil as the single largest sector of the Mexican economy.
Posted on 1/25/17 at 2:26 pm to Masterag
quote:
The rich people take care of themselves and their ilk. Instead of the govt making it an equal playing field for all, they decided to keep the power and resources for themselves instead of giving it to the people.
All of which is fine. If that's how they choose to govern, then I have no problem with it. But don't get pissed off if we govern the way we want to govern. Don't get pissed off and cry racism, when we build a wall, curtail immigration, tax remittances, etc.
Don't govern how you want to govern, and then get mad when other countries do the same.
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