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Posted on 2/26/24 at 12:26 pm to olddawginCa
quote:
Sometimes stealing a person's car or other personal property is in effect killing the person who owns that property since the person can no longer do the work necessary to provide for themselves.
It’s a pretty big stretch to propose that any theft is worthy of immediate death because of some theoretical implication of the theft of that particular item. Did this employee fear death because something in that case was going to get stolen?
Posted on 2/26/24 at 12:30 pm to Padme
I can see why they charged the guy - the robber took off as soon as he saw the gun, and the guy shot him as he was leaving.
That said, if I'm on the jury he's not guilty of whatever they decide to charge him with.
That said, if I'm on the jury he's not guilty of whatever they decide to charge him with.
Posted on 2/26/24 at 12:32 pm to Padme
quote:
Well the problem with that is that you are waiting for the thug to use deadly force, at which time it’s too late. If thug is bashing a case violently then how do you know he isn’t fixing to use deadly force? You don’t, therefore it’s appropriate self defense to take action.
Sure, take action. Employee could have drawn and ordered the guy to leave. Once held at gunpoint and refusing to leave, thief’s next move could then affect the justification of actually shooting. Drawing and immediately shooting because the thief was trying, and hadn’t actually yet succeeded (if that matters), in stealing anything seems a little problematic. While testing the limits of this scenario, what would you say about a thief walking into a store and smashing a gum ball dispenser on the ground trying to steal a gum ball? Should an employee be justified in shooting that thief for trying to steal a gum ball? Does the dollar value of the merchandise or the nature of the container being smashed make a difference?
Posted on 2/26/24 at 12:37 pm to Jack Bauers HnK
quote:
Sucky situation. Much as we hate crime, it’s never been morally or legally justifiable to try to kill someone for stealing. Whether punching through a barrier to steal some merchandise from a Walgreens or a glass case to steal some jewelry from a jewelry store, it’s not, in that moment, a threat of death or injury to someone. If the employee had moved to physically prevent the theft and the thief then threatened the employee, the analysis would be different.
This is dumb, and you should feel dumb. Not only back in the day, when horse thieves and cattle rustlers were summarily lynched, but today, this very moment it is morally and legally justifiable to kill someone for stealing. If you don't believe me, go rob your nearest bank and see if people with guns come after you.
Your narrative is being sold to people who are so dumb they won't question it. It is done because they don't want you protecting your life, liberty, or property by any means necessary. They want you to leave that to the government, so that they get to decide whether your life, liberty, or property are worth defending. Pro tip: None of your possessions are worth defending. But the death penalty is not out of the question if you kick your feet up on Nancy Pelosi's desk.
This post was edited on 2/26/24 at 12:42 pm
Posted on 2/26/24 at 12:37 pm to lake chuck fan
quote:
It's upside down and crazy that a criminal in the process of committing robbery somehow should be protected by the law. He put himself in that position, the employee didn't go looking for him.
the sheer violence in that clip of the perp trying to rip the counters out tells me everything i need to know about that animal. i am SURE that level of violence would NEVER EVER EVER be put to use against another human being.
put him down.
Posted on 2/26/24 at 12:42 pm to Padme
quote:
Hypothetical: thugs are stealing your car; you walk out with a nine and unload. Who goes to jail?
You go to jail.
You do not have a right to kill someone who is stealing your property or in the act of fleeing with said stolen property. In the jurisdiction I live in. Check local laws.
Caveat, If you were in said vehicle when they criminals attempted to break in and steal it you would have the right to self defense by lethal force in the jurisdiction I live in. Check local laws.
Posted on 2/26/24 at 12:48 pm to Padme
In SC it was communicated clearly that you can’t leave safety to go and engage somebody with your gun. Like it or not that’s on you as you can’t kill somebody defending property.
Now, if you go out and yell at the perp and they charge you - you would have a case of self defense. But the first question the DA is going to ask is “why did you go outside rather than call the cops”. In this case you created the situation.
I don’t like it, but that’s the law as I understand it at least in SC and I don’t want to go to jail for killing somebody trying to steal my car.
Now, if you go out and yell at the perp and they charge you - you would have a case of self defense. But the first question the DA is going to ask is “why did you go outside rather than call the cops”. In this case you created the situation.
I don’t like it, but that’s the law as I understand it at least in SC and I don’t want to go to jail for killing somebody trying to steal my car.
This post was edited on 2/26/24 at 12:50 pm
Posted on 2/26/24 at 12:51 pm to Jack Bauers HnK
quote:
Much as we hate crime, it’s never been morally or legally justifiable to try to kill someone for stealing
Thieves are subhuman scum who should be shot on sight.
Posted on 2/26/24 at 1:15 pm to tokenBoiler
quote:Pretty sure this is Chicago. Asian store owner shoots black guy? In the current environment, in that city, the Asian store owner is probably fricked.
That said, if I'm on the jury he's not guilty of whatever they decide to charge him with.
Posted on 2/26/24 at 1:36 pm to Jack Bauers HnK
I don't answer ridiculous questions.
Apparently you have never had your car stolen or some other significant personal property that made it extremely difficult for you to survive and support yourself or your family.
Apparently you have never had your car stolen or some other significant personal property that made it extremely difficult for you to survive and support yourself or your family.
Posted on 2/26/24 at 1:42 pm to Jack Bauers HnK
quote:
what would you say about a thief walking into a store and smashing a gum ball dispenser on the ground trying to steal a gum ball?
What a ridiculous scenario that would never happen.
Posted on 2/26/24 at 1:44 pm to Padme
Both were released with no charges.
quote:
CHICAGO (WLS) -- Two suspects were released without charges in connection to an attempted robbery at a downtown Chicago jewelry store.
The attempted robbery and shooting happened Saturday just before 11 a.m. in the 0-100-block of North Wabash Avenue in the Loop, Chicago police said.
The offender entered a Loop business and unsuccessfully attempted to take property, police said. Another person with a FOID card and a Concealed-Carry License drew their firearm and shot the offender.
The attempted robbery suspect fled the scene, but was located by police nearby and arrested. They were taken to a hospital where they were initially reported to be stable with a gunshot wound, police said.
Posted on 2/26/24 at 1:44 pm to Jack Bauers HnK
quote:
It’s a pretty big stretch to propose that any theft is worthy of immediate death
Nope.
Property is amassed over time thru labor.
Time that one can never reclaim.
Anyone who STEALS from another and is killed during the course of that crime is not worthy of sympathy.
Posted on 2/26/24 at 1:46 pm to Jack Bauers HnK
Never is a long time. To steal a horse was a hanging offense because depriving a man of his transportation could kill him. Today’s equivalent is a car.
Posted on 2/26/24 at 1:47 pm to Jack Bauers HnK
quote:
Much as we hate crime, it’s never been morally or legally justifiable to try to kill someone for stealing
My property earns income that puts food on the table. If someone is a threat to that, then what choice do I have?
Posted on 2/26/24 at 1:55 pm to olddawginCa
quote:
I don't answer ridiculous questions. Apparently you have never had your car stolen or some other significant personal property that made it extremely difficult for you to survive and support yourself or your family.
quote:
what would you say about a thief walking into a store and smashing a gum ball dispenser on the ground trying to steal a gum ball?
quote:
What a ridiculous scenario that would never happen.
So the options are petty theft that would never happen, or the other end of the spectrum, a theft of property upon which the very lives of the owner and his dependents rely.
Where along that spectrum does the justification to kill for theft begin or end, and upon what authority do you base that justification? Sure, theft represents a taking of the value of time, of which God has given us only a limited amount. How much of that time does it take to justify the immediate execution of the thief?
Posted on 2/26/24 at 2:14 pm to Jack Bauers HnK
If the thief is trying to steal something that will ruin your life and cause you or your family to suffer greatly as a result then it's a split second decision that has to be made by the victim.
If the victim chooses to shoot the thief and the thief dies as a result then the thief's choice to willfully commit the crime in the first place is responsible for any negative repercussions to the thief for willfully making that choice.
If the victim chooses to shoot the thief and the thief dies as a result then the thief's choice to willfully commit the crime in the first place is responsible for any negative repercussions to the thief for willfully making that choice.
Posted on 2/26/24 at 2:34 pm to Jack Bauers HnK
How stupid are you?
Posted on 2/26/24 at 3:03 pm to Jack Bauers HnK
quote:looters used to get shot.
Where along that spectrum does the justification to kill for theft begin or end,
glad you feel its morally ok for someone to rob someone else, but morally WRONG to shoot that same person.
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