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re: Often unqualified affirmative action students like Kamala Harris fail the bar exam

Posted on 9/11/17 at 7:23 am to
Posted by idlewatcher
County Jail
Member since Jan 2012
79052 posts
Posted on 9/11/17 at 7:23 am to
quote:

In ca, you do not need a law degree.
You 21? Not a felon?
You take the bar.
Pass. Practice.
No pass, no practice.


In 4 states actually
Posted by StrongSafety
Member since Sep 2004
17547 posts
Posted on 9/11/17 at 7:23 am to
No I didn't. No where did I once say that. Stop projecting. All I'm saying is that there isn't only one way to test aptitude. And for some people, test taking might not be the best form.

That's all I'm saying. See my other post
Posted by member12
Bob's Country Bunker
Member since May 2008
32095 posts
Posted on 9/11/17 at 7:25 am to
quote:


LINK


Holy shite. It's even worse than I expected.

A black applicant with a 3.6 and 28 MCAT has a 86.6% chance of getting into medical school.

A hispanic applicant with the same stats has a 71% chance.

A white applicant with the same stats has a 43% chance.

An Asian applicant with the same stats has a 35% chance.
Posted by member12
Bob's Country Bunker
Member since May 2008
32095 posts
Posted on 9/11/17 at 7:27 am to
quote:

It took my cousin Vinny six times to pass, and he didn't complain.


He was a troubled ute.
Posted by StrongSafety
Member since Sep 2004
17547 posts
Posted on 9/11/17 at 7:27 am to
quote:

- Affirmative action drawing less competitive applicants into medical and law schools - Affirmative affirmative action bringing less prepared students into the bar or shelf exams.


I'd have to contend that if I have a problem with AA, then I have a problem too with legacy admissions, which make up a lot of the accepted students at top undergrad schools. I never hear disgusts for this. Is it because it tilts the demographics in a certain way?

I have to ask you this question: is the shelf and the bar the only way to measure competency and the ability to practice in those professions?

It just seems implausible that there is only one way to justify fitness or aptitude.
Posted by SlowFlowPro
Simple Solutions to Complex Probs
Member since Jan 2004
422311 posts
Posted on 9/11/17 at 7:28 am to
quote:

An Asian applicant with the same stats has a 35% chance.

THAT is the variable that i don't get

the progressive, pro-identity politics left is ONE HUNDRED PERCENT FINE with creating institutional discrimination against a minority group
Posted by SlapahoeTribe
Tiger Nation
Member since Jul 2012
12094 posts
Posted on 9/11/17 at 7:30 am to
quote:

hahahaha, go for it.

The great State of Louisiana requires a JD before they'll allow to take the exam.
Posted by StrongSafety
Member since Sep 2004
17547 posts
Posted on 9/11/17 at 7:31 am to
Asians students aren't being left out because of the 10-12 native/Hispanic/black kids they let in.

They are being screwed over by "less deserving" white applicants/ legacy students.

Any honest assessment of the stats or a deeper dive will show that.

So when the narrative changes, what Is your thought ?
Posted by member12
Bob's Country Bunker
Member since May 2008
32095 posts
Posted on 9/11/17 at 7:32 am to
quote:

the progressive, pro-identity politics left is ONE HUNDRED PERCENT FINE with creating institutional discrimination against a minority group

I guess they prefer that their yuppie larvae supplanted by blacks than Asians?
Posted by el Gaucho
He/They
Member since Dec 2010
52964 posts
Posted on 9/11/17 at 7:32 am to
How many weeks would I have to cram to pass the ca bar? If y'all pay I'm down to try so I can brag about it on here
Posted by Vacherie Saint
Member since Aug 2015
39418 posts
Posted on 9/11/17 at 7:33 am to
quote:

They are being screwed over by "less deserving" white applicants/ legacy students.


Jesus
Posted by StrongSafety
Member since Sep 2004
17547 posts
Posted on 9/11/17 at 7:34 am to
At Ivy League undergrads, Asian students get royally fricked but the hundreds of lesser qualified white students who mostly gain admissions because of a legacy or some grandiose donation.

A circumstance that has nothing to do with the accepted applicants ability and everything to do with their luck.

Why is here not a uproar about legacy admits? Because it keeps the demographic tilted to what it's "supposed" to be?
Posted by rebeloke
Member since Nov 2012
16083 posts
Posted on 9/11/17 at 7:36 am to
Okay, let them social promote and fast forward. They don't get a job. Okay hire them, they don't get clients, then they don't win cases. The bar saves them from this harsh reality.
Posted by SlapahoeTribe
Tiger Nation
Member since Jul 2012
12094 posts
Posted on 9/11/17 at 7:36 am to
quote:

took my cousin Vinny six times to pass, and he didn't complain

There's a politician from Baton Rouge that took 11 tries to finally pass.
Posted by AlceeFortier
Member since Dec 2016
1795 posts
Posted on 9/11/17 at 7:37 am to
Correct.
Posted by SlowFlowPro
Simple Solutions to Complex Probs
Member since Jan 2004
422311 posts
Posted on 9/11/17 at 7:37 am to
quote:

They are being screwed over by "less deserving" white applicants/ legacy students.

even assuming this is true, it doesn't work with the statistical data posted (again, assuming THAT is true, too)

if that low of a % of Asians are accepted with that score and a huge % of hispanic/AA applicants are accepted, that means those "real minority" students are taking spots from another asian group who is out-scoring them. i do not disagree that white people are doing this too, but the question is why we're OK with institutional discrimination against one minority group to help other minority groups? that is legitimate institutional racism that you're defending

if this is about pure scores, then asians are being screwed. however, it's not, b/c of the white/"real minority" rates

if this is about minority representation, then asians are being screwed, b/c of the "real minority" rates

so either you're creating gradients of the authenticity of minority groups or you're saying asians are not minorities
Posted by SlapahoeTribe
Tiger Nation
Member since Jul 2012
12094 posts
Posted on 9/11/17 at 7:38 am to
quote:

How many weeks would I have to cram to pass the ca bar? If y'all pay I'm down to try so I can brag about it on here

I think you're required to have worked as a legal aid for three years (or something like that). I don't think they let you just sign up for the exam, pass, and start practicing law.
Posted by StrongSafety
Member since Sep 2004
17547 posts
Posted on 9/11/17 at 7:39 am to
Tell me again, if Asian students did take the spots of the very small % of black/Latino/native students, would admissions still be "equal" even though they grossly outperform white students?

What historical edge woukd white students have over them that gives them an extra bump in admissions if they can't compete with Asians students (based off raw stats. I personally think there is more to a student than his or her raw stats. Goes for all students)
This post was edited on 9/11/17 at 7:40 am
Posted by RogerTheShrubber
Juneau, AK
Member since Jan 2009
260225 posts
Posted on 9/11/17 at 7:39 am to
quote:

More govt when it serves your aims huh?

Shouldn't the market just figure it out?


Sure. Why have licensing for doctors, lawyers or engineers?
Posted by SlowFlowPro
Simple Solutions to Complex Probs
Member since Jan 2004
422311 posts
Posted on 9/11/17 at 7:41 am to
quote:

How many weeks would I have to cram to pass the ca bar?

if you've never been to law school, a 110-120 IQ person could probably study for 3-4 months with the barbri materials and other sources (i'm assuming you have access to all summaries/guides + the internet as your sources)

i'm talking solid studying like it was a job

CA has a notoriously difficult bar exam...so maybe 5-6 months. you certainly don't need 3 years of law school

now a regular bar state that does MBE? 1-3 months i'd imagine (again, with barbri + sources)

LA has a very hard bar exam but the material wasn't hard. it was more time management and stamina for the week
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