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re: Eboli Containment Logistics question
Posted on 10/2/14 at 11:33 am to NC_Tigah
Posted on 10/2/14 at 11:33 am to NC_Tigah
quote:
This is well beyond any matter of being "asleep at the wheel." It was as deliberate as Dr. Kermit Gosnell "snipping babies".
the only ppl asleep at the wheel were the ppl at the hospital in texas that misdiagnosed and released the guy.
2
Posted on 10/2/14 at 11:33 am to WavinWilly
quote:That's racist!
I'm not an epidemiologist but the first thing I'd do is quarantine people that come from the infected areas or just not let them in at all until they get a handle on this shite.
Signed,
Liberals
This post was edited on 10/2/14 at 11:51 am
Posted on 10/2/14 at 11:48 am to WeeWee
quote:Debatable.
the only ppl asleep at the wheel were the ppl at the hospital in texas that misdiagnosed and released the guy.
But as stated, this goes well beyond nitwit CDC Directors being asleep. The CDC certainly knew this was inevitable.
This post was edited on 3/15/15 at 5:22 am
Posted on 10/2/14 at 11:53 am to WeeWee
quote:I don't disagree with either of your replies, but I won't discount the possibilities out of hand, either.
there hasn't been a known virus yet to undergo such a drastic mutation that it changes its mode of infection. HIV is one of the most mutagenic viruses out there (one of the reasons why it is so hard to vaccinate or cure) and it hasn't become airborne.
Posted on 10/2/14 at 11:55 am to Bamadiver
quote:It's already happened. Just not human to human yet.
I won't discount the possibilities out of hand, either.
Posted on 10/2/14 at 12:00 pm to NC_Tigah
quote:I know. Was being overly kind to Dr. Feelgood as I am no expert on ebola. The more hosts available, the more opportunities to spread and mutate. You take nothing for granted with this at all.
It's already happened. Just not human to human yet.
I truly hope the troops we deployed are not there trying to treat the virus, but are there to contain it.
Posted on 10/2/14 at 12:07 pm to bamarep
Wait a sec...
So we're trusting foreign "health officials" to make the call and not checking when passengers get here?
quote:
The CDC on Wednesday sent a team to the airport in Monrovia, Liberia, where the Texas patient began his recent trip from Liberia to the United States, to make sure health officials there are screening passengers properly.
So we're trusting foreign "health officials" to make the call and not checking when passengers get here?
Posted on 10/2/14 at 12:30 pm to NC_Tigah
quote:
For your information Dr. Kildare, a strain of Ebola has already been shown to infect via airborne spread from pigs to primates in a lab setting.
That was speculated but not proven. If you look at some analysis of that indecent with the monkeys by top virologists and infectious disease specialists they aren't so sure it was airborne. Ebola affects pigs and monkeys differently for starters, and there was no proof that the exposure was not due to direct contact with saliva/perspiration.
Posted on 10/2/14 at 12:31 pm to TigerDog83
It can be spread through droplet contamination. Droplets can be airborne. It can be spread airborne. CDC is feeding us a line of shite with this.
Posted on 10/2/14 at 12:38 pm to TigerDog83
quote:
That was speculated but not proven. If you look at some analysis of that indecent with the monkeys by top virologists and infectious disease specialists they aren't so sure it was airborne.
quote:
Transmission of Ebola virus from pigs tonon-human primates
Hana M. Weingartl1,2, Carissa Embury-Hyatt1, Charles Nfon1, Anders Leung3, Greg Smith1& Gary Kobinger3,2
1National Centre for Foreign Animal Disease, Canadian Food Inspection Agency, 1015 Arlington St. Winnipeg, Manitoba, R3E3M4, Canada,2Department of Medical Microbiology, University of Manitoba, Winnipeg, Canada,3National MicrobiologyLaboratory, Public Health Agency of Canada, 1015 Arlington St., Winnipeg, Manitoba, R3E 3R2, Canada.
Ebola viruses (EBOV) cause often fatal hemorrhagic fever in several species of simian primates including human. While fruit bats are considered natural reservoir, involvement of other species in EBOV transmission is unclear. In 2009, Reston-EBOV was the first EBOV detected in swine with indicated transmission to humans. In-contact transmission of Zaire-EBOV (ZEBOV) between pigs was demonstrated experimentally. Here we show ZEBOV transmission from pigs to cynomolgus macaques without direct contact. Interestingly, transmission between macaques in similar housing conditions was never observed. Piglets inoculated oro-nasally with ZEBOV were transferred to the room housing macaques in an open inaccessible cage system. All macaques became infected. Infectious virus was detected in oro-nasal swabs of piglets, and in blood, swabs, and tissues of macaques. This is the first report of experimental interspecies virus transmission, with the macaques also used as a human surrogate. Our finding may influence prevention and control measures during EBOV outbreaks.
LINK
Posted on 10/2/14 at 12:40 pm to theunknownknight
I'm not saying I necessarily believe it, but these outbreak scenarios make me put my tin foil hat close by just in case.
Posted on 10/2/14 at 12:47 pm to NC_Tigah
quote:
Under conditions of the current study, transmission of ZEBOVcould have occurred either by inhalation (of aerosol or larger drop-lets), and/or droplet inoculation of eyes and mucosal surfaces and/orby fomites due to droplets generated during the cleaning of the room.Infection of all four macaques in an environment, preventing directcontact between the two species and between the macaques them-selves, supports the concept of airborne transmission.
From the study- where they acknowledge the monkeys could have encountered droplets from cages being cleaned and/or a fomite source. I guess we will have to watch and see how the virus behaves the longer the outbreak continues. There is also the likelihood that going airborne will reduce the severity of the illness.
Posted on 10/2/14 at 12:50 pm to theunknownknight
quote:
At what point do the higher ups realize Eboli will not be contained?
I have said numerous times that the telltale will be tertiary cases.
Not more cases coming out, and NOT the number of people being watched for symptoms.
When you see people coming ill "unexpectedly" who had no direct contact with the American Patient Zero, that is when you have lost containment.
Posted on 10/2/14 at 12:55 pm to WeeWee
quote:
there hasn't been a known virus yet to undergo such a drastic mutation that it changes its mode of infection. HIV is one of the most mutagenic viruses out there (one of the reasons why it is so hard to vaccinate or cure) and it hasn't become airborne.
Vaccinate, yes.
Treat long term, yes.
Cure.....
The biggest problem with curing HIV is that before you become symptomatic, it writes itself in the DNA of cells in bone marrow. Even if you kill every virus in your body, you will still produce virus shortly due to the viral DNA in your own cells.
It's why the cure cases always involves a bone marrow transplant.
This doesn't change your point, just FYI.
This post was edited on 10/2/14 at 12:56 pm
Posted on 10/2/14 at 12:57 pm to TigerDog83
quote:
There is also the likelihood that going airborne will reduce the severity of the illness.
The initial lethality of Reston was actually due to co-infection with another virus.
When they infected monkeys with just Reston later the mortality was less than 50% compared to literally every monkey dropping dead within days in the original outbreak.
And you are 100% correct.....a truely airborne Ebola will likely have dramatically lower lethality.
This post was edited on 10/2/14 at 12:59 pm
Posted on 10/2/14 at 1:07 pm to Volvagia
quote:Indeed.
When you see people coming ill "unexpectedly" who had no direct contact with the American Patient Zero, that is when you have lost containment.
Fortunately, even after losing containment, Ebola's epidemiology would prove more forgiving. It would probably allow us to play catch up.
Posted on 10/2/14 at 1:11 pm to WeeWee
quote:This. Somehow they are scapegoating the admitting nurse who took his information when he entered the hospital for not literally slapping the heads of the doctors who treated him by pointing out the "visited Africa" answer.
the only ppl asleep at the wheel were the ppl at the hospital in texas that misdiagnosed and released the guy.
Whenever I have been in an emergency room you get asked the same questions over and over by everyone who sees you. "Have you traveled recently" seems to be a very standard question for anyone with flu like symptoms, even when there isn't a well known Ebola outbreak.
This post was edited on 10/2/14 at 1:12 pm
Posted on 10/2/14 at 1:12 pm to NC_Tigah
If one or two slips through the cracks....yes.
More than that, and you have surpassed the reasonable ability to regain immediate containment.
If more than 5 do it, I am putting my name in for all of my accrued vacation time ASAP. (I live in Dallas.)
More than that, and you have surpassed the reasonable ability to regain immediate containment.
If more than 5 do it, I am putting my name in for all of my accrued vacation time ASAP. (I live in Dallas.)
This post was edited on 10/2/14 at 1:15 pm
Posted on 10/2/14 at 1:14 pm to Volvagia
quote:Absolutely. I was worried that he might not have been patient zero, but I was actually happy (and dumbfounded) to learn that it was very clear how he got infected.
When you see people coming ill "unexpectedly" who had no direct contact with the American Patient Zero, that is when you have lost containment.
Posted on 10/2/14 at 1:51 pm to mmcgrath
quote:Agree totally. Unclear as to how the scenario went down. For example, it's possible the nurse actually erred in his/her documentation, and passed along erroneous info. Assuming that not to be the case though, any error made is absolutely responsibility of the Doctor.
Somehow they are scapegoating the admitting nurse who took his information when he entered the hospital for not literally slapping the heads of the doctors who treated him by pointing out the "visited Africa" answer.
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