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New House Audio Setup

Posted on 8/11/14 at 7:57 am
Posted by Sigma
Fairhope, AL
Member since Dec 2005
3643 posts
Posted on 8/11/14 at 7:57 am
I know this question has been asked in different ways on here before, but forgive me if I try to get some custom advice in this thread. Part of my problem is I'm not quite sure what I want to do, partly because I'm not sure what's possible.

Lake house under construction. Would like to have a central receiver that sends audio throughout the living room area (where the main TV will be), onto two balconies, and possibly out to a dock. The Onkyo we have has two zones, A and B. I don't need the TV audio or DVD audio to be sent anywhere but into the living room. I would like to get FM radio, internet radio, and music (mp3s mostly) to play on the balconies and the dock, if possible.

Would it be a good idea to run speaker wire to all the speakers in the house and use the zones, then use a wireless speaker for the dock (dock is about 200 ft from house)? Or Airport expresses and run everything possible through the wireless network? Or use something like a powerline adapter to do something similar?

Sorry if these are a little random. Maybe you guys can help me think through this a little.

TIA
Posted by seawolf06
NH
Member since Oct 2007
8159 posts
Posted on 8/11/14 at 10:38 am to
Sounds like you have a typical 7.1 receiver. It is intended to have just 7 speakers and a sub with 5.1 in one area and two more speakers in a second area.

I'm not sure if you could, or would even want to attempt to connect 6+ speakers to just two output. I guess you could use the B side for the living room with just two speakers, and the A side with 5 speakers and a sub out on the deck and patios.

I would recommend getting a new receiver with a zone 2 output. Put that in your living room with 5.1 sound there. Then you can use the preouts to your current receiver and run all your outside speakers to that one. You could even use the B side for the dock and not run those all the time.

New receivers will have Wifi capability and it can all be controlled by the one receiver.

Someone may correct me if I'm wrong, though.
Posted by VABuckeye
Naples, FL
Member since Dec 2007
35558 posts
Posted on 8/11/14 at 10:45 am to
200 ft and wireless is not going to be a winning proposition. Run speaker wire in conduit to that location.
Posted by VetteGuy
Member since Feb 2008
28188 posts
Posted on 8/11/14 at 10:52 am to
quote:

200 ft and wireless is not going to be a winning proposition


Agreed.

VAB, what do you think about Control4?
Posted by VABuckeye
Naples, FL
Member since Dec 2007
35558 posts
Posted on 8/11/14 at 11:02 am to
Control4 is nice but it is limited. It does not have the best integration with iOS for music control. That said, it's still doable. I oversaw a C4 install in Ohio this spring and was pleased with the results. The iPhone/iPad app is solid.
Posted by VetteGuy
Member since Feb 2008
28188 posts
Posted on 8/11/14 at 11:15 am to
That's been pretty much my experience.

I am working on a plan to solve the "lighted doorbell" issue.

We have been fortunate to have an outstanding installer.
Posted by aaronb023
TeamBunt CEO
Member since Feb 2005
11774 posts
Posted on 8/11/14 at 11:16 am to
Do you have power at the dock?
Posted by Sigma
Fairhope, AL
Member since Dec 2005
3643 posts
Posted on 8/11/14 at 11:26 am to
quote:

Do you have power at the dock?


Yes.
Posted by TigerRob20
Baton Rouge
Member since Nov 2008
3732 posts
Posted on 8/11/14 at 12:52 pm to
Sonos and Airport Express combination would work, if you want to shell out some cash.

You could get sonos connect w/amp for each set of speakers in a zone. Then get a sonos connect w/o amp for the receiver, with an airport express plugged into it. You can control everything from iOS device, and play music throughout the zones. You can also tap into the Airport Express to airplay audio to all or some zones. Sonos devices plug into the wall, and speaker wire has to be run to them from each speaker. However, they work on a separate wireless network, so it doesn't interfere with your internet.

I would look on ebay if you want to go that route. Some sonos components can be had for $100-$150 cheaper.

What is really awesome about it, is with the connect w/amp devices, they are always on. So you can literally be on a balcony and turn on audio via iOS. I did this at my house, and it is really nice being able to control everything from my phone.
This post was edited on 8/11/14 at 12:57 pm
Posted by Sigma
Fairhope, AL
Member since Dec 2005
3643 posts
Posted on 8/11/14 at 1:10 pm to
Thanks. I saw some articles about the sonos-iOS setup. Let me think about it and I'll be back with questions.
Posted by TigerRob20
Baton Rouge
Member since Nov 2008
3732 posts
Posted on 8/11/14 at 1:45 pm to
I have a sonos connect w/amp for my outside speakers. They are not connected into my receiver at all. Then I have a Sonos connect w/o amp that acts as a connection to my receiver to power my surround sound with music. That has the Airport Express plugged into it, which allows all sonos speakers to play the input from that device. I am also in the process of buying some stand alone sonos speakers, so I don't have to buy more connect devices. Those would also be good to buy, if you decide to go with sonos. You can move them wherever you want (with a power source) and change/add to your zones.

It is an awesome product, and from what i have heard, works much better than a lot of the wifi enabled receivers. It basically allows you the flexibility of more zones around your house.

The only thing i need to figure out for this fall is how to play the TV audio to the outside speakers. I think it would come in handy for football games, but haven't sat down to figure out exactly how the connections should work yet.

Sigma, feel free to email me at <<<@gmail.com if you have more questions. I'll try to be on the lookout for updates to this thread though.
This post was edited on 8/11/14 at 1:46 pm
Posted by Sigma
Fairhope, AL
Member since Dec 2005
3643 posts
Posted on 8/11/14 at 3:49 pm to
I already have a decent set of front (pair), center, rear (pair), and sub. Would it be a good idea to just buy a connect for the living room, then use play1's for everything else? In this case I would run speaker wire from the living room speakers to the receiver (in the living room) and set this to one zone, then use the play1's on their own zones for the balconies?

ETA: Could you explain when a bridge would be appropriate, and when I would need a Connect or a Connect+Amp?
This post was edited on 8/11/14 at 5:36 pm
Posted by TigerRob20
Baton Rouge
Member since Nov 2008
3732 posts
Posted on 8/11/14 at 7:33 pm to
Yeah you could do exactly what you described. You wouldn't need a bridge as the connect device or a sonos speaker acts as a bridge. Keep in mind, that these are not outdoor speakers, so they can be some place where they could get wet.

Basically, the bridge that they sell connects via Ethernet to your router. You have to have one sonos device connected in that way (ie the connect) once that is done, then all of the speakers can connect to your existing sonos network.

It depends on where your router is. If it is near the receiver, then you can use the connect. If it is in a room that you want speakers in, you can use the Play 1. And if it is in a room that you do not want speakers in, you would need a bridge.

I hope that's clear, if not, let me know.

Eta: You would need a connect w/o amp when hooking it up to an existing receiver. You need a connect with amp for speakers that have no receiver hooked up to them.
This post was edited on 8/11/14 at 7:37 pm
Posted by Sigma
Fairhope, AL
Member since Dec 2005
3643 posts
Posted on 8/11/14 at 9:02 pm to
Thanks, that helps a lot.
Posted by TigerTaco
Baton Rouge
Member since Jan 2011
373 posts
Posted on 8/11/14 at 10:13 pm to
Setting up a Sonos Connect is easy. I have a Connect plugged into my receiver, the router is plugged into the Connect and the indoor and outdoor speakers are wired to the reciever. As long as I have a wifi signal, I can control the volume and music source/selection from the yard using my phone. The only drawbacks are my wifi signal only reaches half the yard and I can't change the zone selection (I could if I had Sonos wireless speakers). No need to go inside. The sound quality streaming from Spotify is better than I expected. Zero complaints in that regard.
Posted by VABuckeye
Naples, FL
Member since Dec 2007
35558 posts
Posted on 8/12/14 at 6:50 am to
quote:

As long as I have a wifi signal


As I said earlier the 200' to the dock is going to be an issue with this.
Posted by TigerRob20
Baton Rouge
Member since Nov 2008
3732 posts
Posted on 8/12/14 at 7:19 am to
You're right, wifi at the dock could be an issue. But there would be issues with a wireless speaker setup out there anyway. You could always run speaker wire or Ethernet to the dock underground, but I'd buy one or two of these, or something similar to boost the signal across the yard.

LINK

I've never used this brand or type, but the reviews seem mostly positive. Depending on the size or the type of antenna, it may cover most of the back yard. It sounds like you would need to do something to get any type of signal to the dock since nothing is out there now. I for one would not want to dig a 200' trench across the yard when a better wireless factor is available. I'm sure it would be nice to have Internet at the dock anyway, for music or streaming video.

As an aside, I also helped set up sonos for a friend with a similar issue. He already had wired speakers at a dock, tied into speakers in a patio area. These were all controlled by the same receiver. So we purchased a connect w/o amp, which was hooked to the receiver and powers all speakers mentioned. The only problem he runs into now is that he can lose Internet connection at his dock. So if he is playing something from him phone, the music drops out. If he is playing pandora, or a music service through the sonos app, the music keeps playing, but he loses the ability to change music, volume, etc until he moved back into range of wifi. I'll probably suggest to him to buy a new antenna at some point.
This post was edited on 8/12/14 at 7:29 am
Posted by VABuckeye
Naples, FL
Member since Dec 2007
35558 posts
Posted on 8/12/14 at 7:30 am to
It's a guessing game with wifi and outdoors. That signal dissipates quickly. The antenna you indicated may work. To be sure it works I'd run an ethernet cable out there and mount a WAP close to the speaker location. Nothing worse than music that comes and goes because of signal loss.

It WILL be an issue if he doesn't take measures to address it. No ifs, ands or buts there.
This post was edited on 8/12/14 at 7:31 am
Posted by The Eric
Louisiana
Member since Sep 2008
20990 posts
Posted on 8/12/14 at 8:23 am to
TigerRob...

Is there any way you can draw up a rudimentary diagram of how you have your system set up?
Posted by GeeOH
Louisiana
Member since Dec 2013
13376 posts
Posted on 8/12/14 at 11:13 am to
quote:

t's a guessing game with wifi and outdoors. That signal dissipates quickly. The antenna you indicated may work. To be sure it works I'd run an ethernet cable out there and mount a WAP close to the speaker location. Nothing worse than music that comes and goes because of signal loss.

It WILL be an issue if he doesn't take measures to address it. No ifs, ands or buts there.


This, especially if you ever have thoughts of having a TV on the dock. I'm just thinking of later possibilities outside of just music.

How long is the dock? Should be easy running the cable that distance, the only issue would be getting to to the dock....I say this not knowing the makeup of your 200'.
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