Less regulated school choice programs do better than highly regulated ones | TigerDroppings.com

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I B Freeman
Member since Oct 2009
5275 posts

Less regulated school choice programs do better than highly regulated ones


A lot of critics of vouchers have whined that the private schools accepting the vouchers do not fall under the same scrutiny as government schools do. Never mind the obvious reason for this--government bureaucrats run government schools and private schools are privately owned.

Well it seems that it is the schools with the smaller regulation that do better.

A good article in Education Next on the subject-- LINK







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CarrolltonTiger
LSU Fan
New Orleans
Member since Aug 2005
46291 posts

re: Less regulated school choice programs do better than highly regulated ones


I doubt there is a very srong correlation at all ad suspect that article is agenda driven.

Based upon results in NO, there are wide differences between what might be called the good and the really crap charters and the degree of regulation is identical.

The love of charters is largely driven by union busting, a noble endeavor IMHO, but the results are sketchy at best.






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I B Freeman
Member since Oct 2009
5275 posts

re: Less regulated school choice programs do better than highly regulated ones


quote:

Based upon results in NO, there are wide differences between what might be called the good and the really crap charters and the degree of regulation is identical.

The love of charters is largely driven by union busting, a noble endeavor IMHO, but the results are sketchy at best.



I don't know how anyone living in New Orleans can say the results are sketchy given the horrible, corrupt, pitiful system the charters replaced. But charters are much more regulated than out and out vouchers.

What is wonderful about privately owned schools is that they close if they do not perform. Government schools for the most part stay open.

I disagree the motive of voucher supporters is union busting. The motive is clear--people should have choice. There should not be party members-I mean bureaucrats-make that school board members dictating to them where they must send their kids to receive the latest social engineering and publicly funded education.



This post was edited on 2/23 at 10:29 pm


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CarrolltonTiger
LSU Fan
New Orleans
Member since Aug 2005
46291 posts

re: Less regulated school choice programs do better than highly regulated ones


quote:

I don't know how anyone living in New Orleans can say the results are sketchy given the horrible, corrupt, pitiful system the charters replaced. But charters are much more regulated than out and out vouchers.


Do you live in NO? Do you know anything bout the scholls here?


quote:

Government schools for the most part stay open.


Charter schools are government schools.

Some of the organizations that hold charters are total shite and dysfunctional or rip offs of public dollars.








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davesdawgs
Georgia Fan
Georgia
Member since Oct 2008
16471 posts

re: Less regulated school choice programs do better than highly regulated ones


Regardless of the credibility of this article, it just makes sense that less government regulation and competition in the education market would lead to a better education system as competitors shrive to improve through innovation and efficiency. We have seen this with the development of private schools in our area. Concerned parents want a good education for their children. As the public schools went downhill, private schools filled the void but of course at a cost. My wife and I went in debt to send our kids to private schools. I'm sure plenty of families in our area would love a voucher alternative especially since they are paying taxes to support shitty public/government schools. Liberals are all about choice until it conflicts with their agenda. Eliminate government schools and their early indoctrination program ends.





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CarrolltonTiger
LSU Fan
New Orleans
Member since Aug 2005
46291 posts

re: Less regulated school choice programs do better than highly regulated ones


How do you decide which kids get into a functional charter and which kids get assigned to the dysfunctional charters?

Why do you think charters have less regulation? They are still state funded schools and re accountable.







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I B Freeman
Member since Oct 2009
5275 posts

re: Less regulated school choice programs do better than highly regulated ones


quote:

Do you live in NO? Do you know anything bout the scholls here?


quote:
Government schools for the most part stay open.


Charter schools are government schools.

Some of the organizations that hold charters are total shite and dysfunctional or rip offs of public dollars.


I live on the Northshore. They close failing charter schools almost year in Orleans Parish. It would be better if it was all voucher instead of charter. Most of those charter schools are independently operated.

LINK

The pre Katrina/post Katrina changes are amazing.



Nothing speaks more than to see the parents line up trying to get into particular schools rather than having to simply take what every crappy school the previous OPSB sent them to.






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I B Freeman
Member since Oct 2009
5275 posts

re: Less regulated school choice programs do better than highly regulated ones


quote:

How do you decide which kids get into a functional charter and which kids get assigned to the dysfunctional charters?

Why do you think charters have less regulation? They are still state funded schools and re accountable.


I want all students to have voucher and let them go to any school they want.

Nobody makes a kid go to a charter school. They don't remain dysfunctional for long because they close. The operators of the schools must pay their bills from the money they get and if people don't send their kids there new operators are brought in.

What is wrong with the article? The guy is for less regulated schools and he makes his points.

All I can say to proponents of government schools operated by government is SAINT HELENA CENTRAL. If you live in St. Helena Parish your government forces you to send your kids to that government school if your children are to receive the publicly funded education you are taxed for. It has been a terrible school forever and no bureaucrat has shut it down and no teacher union has asked that it be shut down.






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CarrolltonTiger
LSU Fan
New Orleans
Member since Aug 2005
46291 posts

re: Less regulated school choice programs do better than highly regulated ones


quote:

They close failing charter schools almost year in Orleans Parish


Because they are fricked up and they reissue another charter for the same dysfunction.

quote:

The pre Katrina/post Katrina changes are amazing.


No they aren't and your graphic does not support that, most of the better schools are run by the school board. And some of the changes are because of shifts in the demographic, ie Fortier - Lusher.

quote:

Nothing speaks more than to see the parents line up trying to get into particular schools rather than having to simply take what every crappy school the previous OPSB sent them to.


Until this year it has been a cluster frick with each charter acting independent. Now there is some organization. But I asked above who determies who gets in a good charter and what kids get screwed? And most schools still suck.

The money we are spending on charters is also unsustainable,






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I B Freeman
Member since Oct 2009
5275 posts

re: Less regulated school choice programs do better than highly regulated ones


quote:

The pre Katrina/post Katrina changes are amazing.


No they aren't and your graphic does not support that, most of the better schools are run by the school board. And some of the changes are because of shifts in the demographic, ie Fortier - Lusher.


You look at that chart and say the changes are not extraordinary??

What would the drop out rate be now if the OPSB had continued as it was being run? The schools with the 20s would be where now?? and they would all still be open.

I don't know what motivates you to deny the progress there even if you are still not satisfied with the schools.

Why is it important to you who decides who gets in what charter if you prefer a public system where nobody but some bureaucrats gets a say?? Who decided who went to Douglass in 2004?






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davesdawgs
Georgia Fan
Georgia
Member since Oct 2008
16471 posts

re: Less regulated school choice programs do better than highly regulated ones


quote:

How do you decide which kids get into a functional charter and which kids get assigned to the dysfunctional charters?

Why do you think charters have less regulation? They are still state funded schools and re accountable.



I didn't realize the discussion was restricted to charter schools and honestly I don't know much about charter schools. Are all private schools charter schools? I can only speak relative to the private schools in our area. To answer your question, the only restriction is who can and/or is willing to pay for their kids to attend private schools. Most of the students probably have a higher level of aptitude otherwise some parents probably wouldn't see it as worth the investment/sacrifice. We went in debt to send both our kids to private schools. We crossed the "is it worth it" bridge with my son, who was an ADD child.

My son refused to attend the deisgnated public HS when he was 17. We put him in a private school for about a year but his attitude was poor and he wasn't applying himself so eventually he quit there also. We tried one more private school but he left home so we basically said frick it, you're on your own. But not really because we are still helping him financially to this day; he's now 28 years old. My daughter on the other hand graduated from a private HS with honors, made A's and B's and got a college degree at a local community college and is now a producer for a local TV station. Moral of the story: you can lead a horse to water but you can't make him drink and it's a waste of money on expensive private schools if your horse won't drink.






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CarrolltonTiger
LSU Fan
New Orleans
Member since Aug 2005
46291 posts

re: Less regulated school choice programs do better than highly regulated ones


quote:

You look at that chart and say the changes are not extraordinary??


Yes, I can. If you wnat to address individual schools and what changes have occured i would be glad to do that.

quote:

What would the drop out rate be now if the OPSB had continued as it was being run?


If we would not have had the population loss, probably about the same, charters did not get rid of tens of thousands of dysfunctionals.

quote:

I don't know what motivates you to deny the progress there even if you are still not satisfied with the schools.


I don't believe in lies.

quote:

Why is it important to you who decides who gets in what charter


It is very important to the parents who you claim to be supporting. Many charters suck.

quote:

if you prefer a public system where nobody but some bureaucrats gets a say??


Charters are visicous little bureaucrcies, they are suing one another and in disputes regularly.

quote:

Who decided who went to Douglass in 2004?


Pretty much the parents, just like with the charters today. Some care some don't. Do you know what Douglass is today?

Why aren't you praising the School Board schools form your graphic they are clearly the most superior schools in the city.






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INFIDEL
LSU Fan
The couch
Member since Aug 2006
14093 posts

re: Less regulated school choice programs do better than highly regulated ones


The success of private schools have much less to do with how they are run and a lot more to do with the students in the classrooms. It's not that hard to understand. If the parents care enough to send their children to private schools, then they are going to care enough to help them succeed. More responsible parents=better students=better schools.





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I B Freeman
Member since Oct 2009
5275 posts

re: Less regulated school choice programs do better than highly regulated ones


quote:

More responsible parents=better students=better schools.


We should, of course, give responsible parents the choices they deserve to see that their children get the education they deserve.

This idea that we should stay with the current government school system where bureaucrats select the schools kids go to based on arbitrary maps is Soviet kind of thinking.

I am tired of hearing that schools are bad because parents are bad. It just proves we have lowered the standards in government schools to accommodate irresponsible behavior. It is time to start kicking kids out of school who do not measure up academically. There is no reason to hold good students and students of concerned parents back to accommodate those who treat schools as baby sitting services. Teach the material and if they fail--fail them.

Public school advocates seem to to saying, as in Infidel's post, maintain the status quo because parents are the cause. BS. Not holding parents accountable may be contributing to the cause and that in itself is a reason for choice. Who wants to send their kids to schools that do not expect a certain level of acceptability?






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