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re: When did the German soldiers of WWII realize they were the 'bad guys'?
Posted on 7/18/17 at 10:17 pm to ChewyDante
Posted on 7/18/17 at 10:17 pm to ChewyDante
quote:
There were many in British foreign policy circles who felt giving the Poles the war guarantee was a bad idea since it encouraged them to be obstinate in negotiations with Germany and effectively tied Britain's fate to that of a Poland ruled by a military junta.
Good point. The Polish Government in 1939 had been in power for long enough to prove that it was like a "military junta". No wonder why some in Britain wondered why it made sense to bind Britain's fate to Poland's military government when they knew that the Polish military government thought that they could defend themselves against any German attack long enough to get help from Britain and France.
0
Posted on 7/18/17 at 11:03 pm to ChewyDante
quote:This.
The typical German soldiers didn't view themselves as bad guys at all, even after the war was over.
They were either fighting for the Fatherland or were afraid to be executed by their superiors if they refused to fight.
Most German soldiers had no idea about the Holocaust.
I'm sure many of them knew they were the aggressors of the war but their dedication to the Fatherland overrode those feelings.
Posted on 7/18/17 at 11:30 pm to Undertow
The Soviets were the bad guys.
Posted on 7/18/17 at 11:57 pm to Bestbank Tiger
quote:
They knew right from wrong. There's a picture that was posted here a few times where German POWs reacted to footage of the concentration camps.
Posted on 7/19/17 at 12:04 am to Spaceman Spiff
quote:
You have to remember the ideology that Hitler spread. He galvanized that nation like no one ever really has in such a short time. That alone distorts one's view
Underrated post
Posted on 7/19/17 at 2:38 am to Ole War Skule
quote:
bullshite! Germany is the SOLE party responsible for the war in Europe and all of the death and destruction it brought, including communist Russia by delivering Lenin to Russia to ferment revolution there.
This is not some complicated story in which the villain is not clear. German people, through their nationalist ambition, caused the deaths of tens of millions. No Germany, no WWII.
You certainly have no concept of history and are quite ignorant about WW2.
Posted on 7/19/17 at 2:48 am to 1BamaRTR
quote:
Even if they had left Britain alone, there's no way the British would stand by and let the Germans take over its neighbors like France. So war between them was inevitable if Germany wanted to expand in Europe.
There was a lull in, I think 41, where the fighting with Britain had stopped. Britain was trying to recruit us to fight Germany. But 95% of Americans were against a War with Germany. Very bad memories of WW1 were prevalent.
Roosevelt wouldn't have even been able to declare war against Germany, if they hadn't have declared war on us after Japan bombed Pearl Harbor. That was a huge stroke of luck for Churchill. Otherwise, we'd have only fight Japan until Roosevelt could find a reason.
We really didn't aggressively go after Japan at first. Roosevelt was more focused on Germany. Because beating Japan wouldn't stop Germany. But beating Germany could stop Japan (help from Allies).
Posted on 7/19/17 at 8:10 am to stelly1025
quote:
but we are not blameless when it comes to WW2 either.
I'd say France is the one that should shoulder some blame for WWII starting. They were the ones that pushed the hardest for the harshest terms in the Versailles Treaty.
Posted on 7/19/17 at 8:56 am to CCTider
quote:
That was a huge stroke of luck for Churchill. Otherwise, we'd have only fight Japan until Roosevelt could find a reason.
Yes, and ANOTHER unforced error by Hitler. Germany and Japan had a mutual defense agreement, but review of it now shows - and the understanding of it among the German command at the time was - that Japan's actions against the United States were clearly offensive and as such Germany had no treaty-derived war-obligation against the U.S. on Japan's behalf. Later interviews with German high command officers have revealed that they believed Hitler was acting impulsively and rashly by declaring war on the United States when he didn't have to.
This post was edited on 7/19/17 at 8:57 am
Posted on 7/19/17 at 9:09 am to TigerFanInSouthland
quote:
I'd say France is the one that should shoulder some blame for WWII starting.
For sure. France stubbornly disregarded everyone else begging that the burden on Germany not be so onerous. Hitler's movement was largely a reaction to the economic ruin that the treaty in large part contributed to and secondarily was a reaction to the very popular theory of the "stab in the back", which was the majority opinion (though false) that since the German army was in France when the German home government signed the armistice, they therefore must have been WINNING at the time, and as such, the subsequent embarrassment and financial ruin was all due to Weimar government having betrayed the then-winning army. The early Nazi party fought the Communists NOT because they had differences on economics - they were both socialist movements - but rather because each was vying with the other to be THE socialist party going forward. The only difference between them was that one was internationalist and backed by the bolsheviks and trying to be like them, while the other (the Nazis) were German nationalists.
Posted on 7/19/17 at 9:23 am to Cooter Davenport
quote:
Later interviews with German high command officers have revealed that they believed Hitler was acting impulsively and rashly by declaring war on the United States when he didn't have to.
He absolutely was. Personally, I believe that decision was worse than invading the USSR. Hitler misjudged the difficulties FDR would have getting the U.S. into the European conflict.
Posted on 7/19/17 at 9:29 am to ChewyDante
Posted on 7/19/17 at 9:30 am to Undertow
quote:
their leaders were evil
This isn't true. They just had differing views. It is all subjective.
Posted on 7/19/17 at 10:24 am to Royal
That was one feat of the Nazis. Germany literally imploded at the end of WWI. Soldiers and sailors mutinied, factory workers refused to work, country was literally starving to death. The blockade devastated the country and millions of soldiers were killed.
The Germans fought all the way until the end of WWII. They didn't quit, didn't collapse, they were just plain beaten into submission.
The Germans fought all the way until the end of WWII. They didn't quit, didn't collapse, they were just plain beaten into submission.
Posted on 7/19/17 at 10:29 am to prplhze2000
Arguably they wouldn't have been so tenacious if not for the Russians bent on revenge. Another indication that the average German soldier knew what had been going on in the East and knew there would be no quarter given.
Posted on 7/19/17 at 11:08 am to Jim Rockford
Studying WWI, the Germans kicked the Russians arse quite a few times. Killed millions of troops. Russians would shrug off losses that would cripple any other army, and then call up millions more.
Posted on 7/19/17 at 11:38 am to prplhze2000
quote:
That was one feat of the Nazis. Germany literally imploded at the end of WWI. Soldiers and sailors mutinied, factory workers refused to work, country was literally starving to death. The blockade devastated the country and millions of soldiers were killed.
The Germans fought all the way until the end of WWII. They didn't quit, didn't collapse, they were just plain beaten into submission.
Many people don't realize the extent to which the German experience in WWI shaped Hitler's thinking and policy decisions. He was hell bent to ensure that Germany could never be starved into submission again and this concern was a central factor in his determination to seize Eastern lands that could permit Germany to feed herself even in the instance of enemy blockades.
It also contributed to his convictions that Jews and others that were deemed potential subversives had to be rounded up and isolated to prevent destabilization of the home front. Hitler was obsessed with the concept of "will" and was convinced that Germany's defeat in WWI was merely a product of the national will being broken internally. This contributed to the never capitulate attitude the Germans took even in the final days of WWII. This attitude was hammered into the German psyche from 1933 onwards and only intensified with Nazi wartime propaganda.
Posted on 7/19/17 at 12:38 pm to ChewyDante
I know lots of Austrians young and old and have visited about 50 times. It's a nice place, with nice people, and a nice standard of living. Somewhat hard to reconcile with videos of them welcoming Hitler with a parade in Vienna.
Posted on 7/19/17 at 12:41 pm to kfaulk03
I've also heard direct stories of a friend's grandmother and great grandmother wiping shite on themselves to dissuade allied troops from raping them. The thought of your wife wiping shite in herself back home to keep from being raped combined with propaganda and information control would drive a man to do lots of things.
Posted on 7/19/17 at 12:42 pm to prplhze2000
quote:
Germany literally imploded at the
Sigh. No they didn't. And in a thread about Nazis.. not grammar Nazis, but still
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