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re: Voting on the Greenlight Plan

Posted on 11/30/16 at 2:28 pm to
Posted by lsu13lsu
Member since Jan 2008
11480 posts
Posted on 11/30/16 at 2:28 pm to
quote:

-Widen Bluebonnet btw Mall of La and Perkins Road
-New Connecting road between Hennessey and Perkins
-Widen Lee Drive between Highland and Perkins (I suspect to 3 lanes)
-Widen College between Perkins and I-10 to 6 lanes
-Improve College/I-10 Interchange
-New Frontage Road between Essen and Bluebonnet on I-10
-New Midway Blvd parallel to Bluebonnet and Essen
-Connection between Kennilworth and Burbank
-Finish widening Old Hammond all the way to O'Neal
-Widen Hooper Road in Central
-Widen Nicholson/Highway 30 from Burbank all the way to the parish line


Primarily an improvement for the City of BR but is taxing all of EBR.
Posted by LSUBoo
Knoxville, TN
Member since Mar 2006
101919 posts
Posted on 11/30/16 at 2:34 pm to
quote:

Primarily an improvement for the City of BR but is taxing all of EBR.


That's just a portion, there are projects all over the Parish.
Posted by dewster
Chicago
Member since Aug 2006
25342 posts
Posted on 11/30/16 at 2:39 pm to
quote:

Primarily an improvement for the City of BR but is taxing all of EBR.


Judging from the list that was posted....there are a lot of projects in every district including Zachary, Central, Baker, and south Baton Rouge. It's definitely parish wide.

Edit: It appears that the single most expensive projects are Pecue Lane widening in unincorporated East Baton Rouge Parish and Hooper Road widening in Central. Those are estimated at around $50 million each.
This post was edited on 11/30/16 at 2:45 pm
Posted by member12
Bob's Country Bunker
Member since May 2008
32095 posts
Posted on 11/30/16 at 2:55 pm to
quote:

Does 100% of this specific tax money go into accounts exclusively to be used for this purpose?



This is a temporary tax that is allocated specifically for the listed infrastructure improvements. There are a specific list of proposed projects all over the parish tied to the bond measure. You can see the road and intersections they want to improve on the project's website.

East Baton Rouge will borrow against the revenue generated by this tax and move the listed projects forward in the next 5-10 years instead of paying as they go over the next 50 years.

I voted against Council on Aging tax. I'm voting for this.
Posted by LSUBoo
Knoxville, TN
Member since Mar 2006
101919 posts
Posted on 11/30/16 at 2:58 pm to
quote:

I voted against Council on Aging tax.


Can't believe that shite passed.
Posted by doubleb
Baton Rouge
Member since Aug 2006
36017 posts
Posted on 11/30/16 at 3:53 pm to
quote:

If the ballot initiatives are approved, both of which are required for the plan to move forward, the new Green Light Plan would authorize a 5-mill property tax for 30 years, generating $450 million through 2046 to build 45 major road capacity improvement projects. A five mill property tax will cost a homeowner with a $200,000 home about $62.50 a year, or just over $5 a month. The program would also, at no additional cost to taxpayers, rededicate the Green Light Plan’s original half-cent sales tax to build 150 rehabilitation and community enhancement projects through 2030.


A 200K homeowner would pay just over 5 bucks a month or 60+ dollars a year, but a homeowner who owns a 325K home would pay twice that much or over 120 bucks per year. It adds up fast because the exemption applies only to the first 75K so a 200K home is only taxes at a 125K rate.

They present the numbers in a misleading way.

Second they want to rededicate the 1/2 cents sales tax for to build "150 rehabilitation and community enhancement projects".

How many ways can you spell pork barrel projects?

I'm voting no for three reasons:

1) JBE is getting ready to hammer us more
2) This plan has been put together too fast and is ill-defined
3) I think the new mayor should be behind this and if he or she is not it doesn't need to pass.

Just because we need improved streets doesn't mean this is a good plan; nor does it mean its comprehensive in that it will help fix our regional and local problems.
Posted by member12
Bob's Country Bunker
Member since May 2008
32095 posts
Posted on 11/30/16 at 4:13 pm to
quote:

As with the first if it is a dedicated tax for roads and EBR will be able to sell bonds immediately based on the projected revenue and start work now. It is the same as the first which Kip Holden put in place. Prior to that it was a temporary "pothole" tax and we were never able to leverage the money


I think the temporary boom in population after Katrina with all of the evacuees staying in hotels and and relative's homes was kind of a stress test for the road network. It showed how bad the street grid was and exposed what would become problem areas. It was not difficult getting the 2006 bond measure passed after that.

Both the original post-Katrina bond measure in 2006 and the 2016 plan is mostly the parish trying to catch up to the permanent growth that already happened 10-20 years ago. Still not a lot of forward thinking...just common sense projects that should have been done years ago.

As bad as the local road network is now, it used to be so much worse 15 years ago.
Posted by member12
Bob's Country Bunker
Member since May 2008
32095 posts
Posted on 11/30/16 at 4:16 pm to
quote:

Second they want to rededicate the 1/2 cents sales tax for to build "150 rehabilitation and community enhancement projects


A portion of is going to sidewalks and street lights. It's outlined on the website, but it could/should be more specific. I suspect that's how they are getting north Baton Rouge to support it. There was a lot of criticism initially with the proposal because very little of it went into that area even though the traffic problems were mostly not there. Most of the road improvements are in the growing parts of the parish which makes sense.

As far as the state taxes, I'm furious over the medicaid expansion and what that will do our budget. I do not trust them to use the gas tax to address the backlog. They'll rob that to pay for some other bullshite as they often do. It's honestly hard to blame people in Louisiana for being skeptical of the state government.
This post was edited on 11/30/16 at 4:29 pm
Posted by doubleb
Baton Rouge
Member since Aug 2006
36017 posts
Posted on 11/30/16 at 4:31 pm to
quote:

A portion of is going to sidewalks and street lights. It's outlined on the website, but it could/should be more specific. I suspect that's how they are getting north Baton Rouge to support it. There was a lot of criticism initially with the proposal because very little of it went into that area even though the traffic problems were mostly not there. Most of the road improvements are in the growing parts of the parish which makes sense.


The entire plan was hastily proposed, and put forward by a lame duck mayor in his last days.

I think the new mayor will have to administrate the plan so the new mayor should be the one pushing it forward.

And it still sounds like a big pork barrel deal.

FWIW,NBR proper has an excellent grid system of four lane thoroughfares paid for by the citizens of the entire parish back in the 70s I believe. The sister plan to help the SBR was voted down.
Posted by kingbob
Sorrento, LA
Member since Nov 2010
67078 posts
Posted on 11/30/16 at 4:31 pm to
Those projects cover parts of the entire parish outside of slaughter.

Hooper Road runs through Scotlandville and Central.

30, Old Hammon, and O'Neil are all in St. George.

The improvemets around Essen and Bluebonnet help everyone by making the major ER hospitals more easily accessible.

One could argue that North Baton Rouge isn't helped by this plan, but frankly, they don't need the help. North Baton Rouge has a very solid grid with plenty of 4-lane highways and connector roads. It was developed 30 years ago and has not grown since. The South side was not developed. It lacks the street connectivity and 4 lane arteries the North enjoys. The traffic in the North is rarely an issue. I know because I commute through there most every day.

The only reason anyone would object to this plan is because they simply don't trust the government to use the money to complete them. These are all extremely worthwhile projects which would address major choke points within the city.
This post was edited on 11/30/16 at 4:40 pm
Posted by doubleb
Baton Rouge
Member since Aug 2006
36017 posts
Posted on 11/30/16 at 4:38 pm to
EBR Parish is hardly growing in population due to white flight.
Census POPULATION % Increase
1980 366,191 28.4%
1990 380,105 3.8%
2000 412,852 8.6%
2010 440,171 6.6%
Est. 2015 446,753 1.5%

Much of our problems are regional in nature, and can not be addressed by citizens of EBR alone.
Posted by member12
Bob's Country Bunker
Member since May 2008
32095 posts
Posted on 11/30/16 at 4:42 pm to
quote:

The entire plan was hastily proposed, and put forward by a lame duck mayor in his last days.


True, but that doesn't mean the improvements proposed won't have a positive impact on taxpayers. I would like them to be more specific on what they mean by "capacity improvements". Does that mean a new lane? A center turn lane?

quote:

And it still sounds like a big pork barrel deal.



I disagree. The project descriptions could offer more details, but the projects listed are definitely problem areas much like the bond measure they passed 10-11 years back.

I see this as a far cry from CATS, ALIVE, the downtown library monstrosity, the Council on Aging nonsense....or BREC's large budget for that matter.

quote:

I think the new mayor will have to administrate the plan so the new mayor should be the one pushing it forward.


I agree, but my concerns here are remedied by the fact that this bond measure is tied to specific projects and not to some general fund.
Posted by member12
Bob's Country Bunker
Member since May 2008
32095 posts
Posted on 11/30/16 at 4:44 pm to
quote:

One could argue that North Baton Rouge isn't helped by this plan, but frankly, they don't need the help.


North Baton Rouge is emptying out. Most of the growth is unfortunately where the infrastructure is inadequate - south Baton Rouge, Central, Zachary, etc.
Posted by c on z
Zamunda
Member since Mar 2009
127398 posts
Posted on 11/30/16 at 4:48 pm to
quote:

but frankly, they don't need the help.

It would be nice if they ever decided to extend Foster Rd to Mickens, and extend N. Sherwood to Joor.
Posted by kingbob
Sorrento, LA
Member since Nov 2010
67078 posts
Posted on 11/30/16 at 4:49 pm to
While this is true, the worst of the chokepoints are in EBR, and the citizens of EBR have to deal with the traffic whether the suburbs cause it or not.

The suburbs have their own problems as well. The traffic issues in the capital region are the results of decades of compounding failures at the local, state, and federal level. It will take work and money from all three levels to fix it. Rather than squabbling about who's fault it is and who should shoulder the cost, like we've been doing for 20 years, it's time we just say f$&k it and pay to fix it ourselves. Damn this whole "it's not my job" attitude. It's about time we just go ahead and get this stuff done.

It took over 30 years to get a left turn signal on Nicholson @ Brightside. 30 YEARS!!! This plan will 4 lane Nicholson to the Parish Line. Ascension is planning to 4-lane nicholson between I-10 and the parish line with Iberville. Iberville woll likely 4-lane their stretch as well if both other parishes do the same. By EBR taking leadership, the other parishes will follow and do their part.
Posted by member12
Bob's Country Bunker
Member since May 2008
32095 posts
Posted on 11/30/16 at 4:49 pm to
quote:

1980 366,191 28.4%
1990 380,105 3.8%
2000 412,852 8.6%
2010 440,171 6.6%
Est. 2015 446,753 1.5%


That's a positive growth trend despite north Baton Rouge declining. It's not difficult to notice how bad the road network is for current needs, much less future growth in the outlying areas. It's an easier argument to me as a regular user of this parish's terrible road network than, say, the CATS tax.

Are you saying we don't have problems with traffic in EBR? Because we definitely do.

Some of these projects should have been done in the 1980s when there were 75,000 fewer people living here.
Posted by doubleb
Baton Rouge
Member since Aug 2006
36017 posts
Posted on 11/30/16 at 4:51 pm to
quote:

Hooper Road runs through Scotlandville and Central.


Hooper begins at Plank Road on the East side of the Airport and continues East to CEntral and beyond.

quote:

30, Old Hammon, and O'Neil are all in St. George.


30 begins at LSU nad moves South through BR into what would be St. George. It's a state Hwy. heavily used by commuters from Ascension and Iberville Parishes.

Old Hammond Highway runs from Towne Center East past S Forrest Blvd. where it becomes two lanes near Jones Creek Bridge. That's inside the city limits. It finishes up on florida blvd. East of O'neal lane which would be in St. George.

O'neal is almost finished from It's southern end at George O'neal North to its finish where it connects to the Central Thruway. Portions of O'neal make up the proposed border between BR and St. George.

quote:

The only reason anyone would object to this plan is because they simply don't trust the government to use the money to complete them. These are all extremely worthwhile projects which would address major choke points within the


Do you trust the new mayor to follow KIp's hastily put together plan?

And I see all the projects as worthwhile, and more important than building a new library downtown or one off Bluebonnet; and therein lies a lot of our troubles. Too many projects get built that aren't as important as other projects.

With tax dollars at a premium due to the recession here in La. and sluggish national economy; we need to be smarter with our tax dollars and right now we are seeing way too many tax increases.

I'm voting no and I voted for Green Light 1.
Posted by member12
Bob's Country Bunker
Member since May 2008
32095 posts
Posted on 11/30/16 at 4:51 pm to
quote:

It would be nice if they ever decided to extend Foster Rd to Mickens, and extend N. Sherwood to Joor.



And extend Hooper across the river to Watson, but EBR taxpayers should NOT pay for that although I think it's reasonable to plan for it.
Posted by doubleb
Baton Rouge
Member since Aug 2006
36017 posts
Posted on 11/30/16 at 4:56 pm to
quote:

True, but that doesn't mean the improvements proposed won't have a positive impact on taxpayers.


You'd have to be an idiot to say the projects listed won't have a positive impact. I never said they would not.
quote:

I would like them to be more specific on what they mean by "capacity improvements".


Yes and what are enhancements, and such? That screams of pork.

quote:

The project descriptions could offer more details, but the projects listed are definitely problem areas much like the bond measure they passed 10-11 years back.


Yes, and that's why I said it was hastily put together as if they wanted to shove this through before a new mayor came in. Why??? Why not let the new mayor do it? Maybe the new mayor has other ideas? Why take her/him out of the equation with this 11th hour deal?

quote:

I see this as a far cry from CATS, ALIVE, the downtown library monstrosity, the Council on Aging nonsense....or BREC's large budget for that matter.

I'm with you here because I think key road projects are more necessary than Knock Knock Museum, a new downtown library or a new water lagoon somewhere.

quote:

I agree, but my concerns here are remedied by the fact that this bond measure is tied to specific projects and not to some general fund.


The enhancement deal stinks.
Posted by LSUDAN1
Member since Oct 2010
8962 posts
Posted on 11/30/16 at 4:59 pm to
You mean the red light plan.
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