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re: (Not Common Core)-- Why are they teaching math this way?
Posted on 2/9/15 at 1:17 pm to GeauxTigerTM
Posted on 2/9/15 at 1:17 pm to GeauxTigerTM
quote:
After last year, I gave up openly bitching about this...no bitching from me resulted in no complaining from my son. He understood it, and I was only poisoning the well.
This. It doesn't benefit anybody to bitch about the curriculum when doing homework and makes the child resent math and their teacher in some cases.
If people feel that strongly against the education, go to a PTA meeting, school board meeting, legislative meetings at the state house, etc. Not at the dinner table over homework.
Kudos to you.
3
Posted on 2/9/15 at 1:17 pm to LNCHBOX
quote:
The point is the word was not taught as a vocabulary word. The meaning was not taught in class. Are you sure of this? That doesn't make very much sense.
Yes, and I agree.
quote:
When will you ever need to solve for subtrahend outside of the first 3 grade levels? You will solve for one of the above terms even if the process calls for subtraction. When will I ever use differential equations in my profession? Answer is never. Yet somehow it was still required of me to pass that class.
There is a difference in teaching concepts which may or may not be used in the future and teaching frequently utilized concepts, through means of outdated nomenclature that will not be used in the future.
At no point have I asked why he needs to learn subtraction.
Posted on 2/9/15 at 1:18 pm to KosmoCramer
quote:
This. It doesn't benefit anybody to bitch about the curriculum when doing homework and makes the child resent math and their teacher in some cases. If people feel that strongly against the education, go to a PTA meeting, school board meeting, legislative meetings at the state house, etc. Not at the dinner table over homework. Kudos to you.
completely agree and my child is not on TD.
Posted on 2/9/15 at 1:19 pm to Hopeful Doc
quote:
I'm not much younger, and we used computer lab programs for math, reading, and language arts. They were all supplementation, though. It was an opportunity to let the upper end advance and bring the bottom end up at the same time, but it didn't replace classroom instruction, which I think is where the OP's problem exists. It's difficult to tailor a classroom like a computer program for individual attention.
It's obviously not gotten to the point where it's perfect for all children, but for someone to say that learning these new concepts and ways of doing things is hurting the upper level 2nd graders because the lower level ones just don't get this crazy, extra work visualization, left-wing math is very short sighted.
Posted on 2/9/15 at 1:20 pm to Bleeding purple
quote:
When will you ever need to solve for subtrahend outside of the first 3 grade levels?
Watch this:
12-_=5
12-x=5
Posted on 2/9/15 at 1:20 pm to Bleeding purple
quote:
completely agree and my child is not on TD.
This wasn't intended at you.
Venting is a great way to relieve stress so that you don't lose it in front of your child over this stupid math.
TD.com is great therapy actually.
Posted on 2/9/15 at 1:20 pm to GeauxTigerTM
quote:
Some seems like a waste of time and adds unnecessary steps...but again, I'm such a shitty math student I'm willing to forgo bitching about this in the hopes that this way helps prepare him for higher math later down the road.
And this is where I take a different slant. I am a math nerd, and luckily my kids are both in advanced placement courses in math. Adding redundancy and obsolete steps does not facilitate broadened learning.
quote:
Some of it, I kid you not, is actually easier than the way I remember being taught...more intuitive.
I actually agree, there are a few techniques for certain things that I think have been great. And I am all for some broadening. But again, it has swung way to far, and is being implemented by those who do not fully understand it, and as such IMO leaves a gap.
In short...if your kid is not paying attention, is not that bright, or you are already prepared to be angry about this "new" math, you'll be unhappy. Thankfully, my lack of math skills are accounted for by my smart child who pays attention in school so when he comes home with an assignment I don't have to reteach him the "new" way, only follow along, grasp the new way, and help him if he gets into jams.
After last year, I gave up openly bitching about this...no bitching from me resulted in no complaining from my son. He understood it, and I was only poisoning the well.
Posted on 2/9/15 at 1:21 pm to Bleeding purple
quote:
Bleeding purple
Makes sense.
Mine are further apart...7th and 2nd. I've yet to see the word subtrahend on any of his work, though the work he's being asked to do is what you described. I will say that if he came home with that and did not know the word (I sure as shite would not have known it if he had) I'd have looked it up and explained it to him and we'd have been done with it.
Posted on 2/9/15 at 1:22 pm to KosmoCramer
quote:
This. It doesn't benefit anybody to bitch about the curriculum when doing homework and makes the child resent math and their teacher in some cases.
Completely agree - as much as I hate some of it, I make it appear to my child, while doing the homework, that it walks on water.
Then I will introduce what I want the child to know at a later date in a later setting as to not add to the confusion.
quote:
If people feel that strongly against the education, go to a PTA meeting, school board meeting, legislative meetings at the state house, etc. Not at the dinner table over homework.
Agree again.
Posted on 2/9/15 at 1:23 pm to igoringa
quote:
Almost as dumb as setting up directions at the lowest common denominator to make sure everyone feels happy.
quote:
lowest common denominator
This post was edited on 2/9/15 at 1:24 pm
Posted on 2/9/15 at 1:24 pm to junkfunky
Posted on 2/9/15 at 1:25 pm to igoringa
quote:
I am a math nerd
quote:
it has swung way to far
Whew
Posted on 2/9/15 at 1:26 pm to High C
Don't worry though, he teaches his kids the "right" way later
Posted on 2/9/15 at 1:26 pm to brgfather129
quote:
Watch this:
12-_=5
12-x=5
Posted on 2/9/15 at 1:26 pm to brgfather129
quote:
Watch this: 12-_=5 12-x=5
brilliant now what do you call x?
a variable like 90% of the math world?
maybe a value?
maybe a number?
I have never in my entirety of 20+ years of education been asked to "find the subtrahend"
Posted on 2/9/15 at 1:27 pm to KosmoCramer
quote:
It's obviously not gotten to the point where it's perfect for all children, but for someone to say that learning these new concepts and ways of doing things is hurting the upper level 2nd graders because the lower level ones just don't get this crazy, extra work visualization, left-wing math is very short sighted.
I think this has taken what I said a bit the the extreme. My point was that taking time to hammer the concept into the heads of the kids, both the ones who got it and the ones who didn't, is probably the better thing for a lecture series to do. It's just really annoying for the kids who do get it (the top). Having extra instruction during computer lab supplementation or the like only furthers the argument for letting the class lull on to hammer in dull concepts, I believe. Posted on 2/9/15 at 1:28 pm to igoringa
quote:
So when yours was given questions like Q1 in the first post of this thread, what do his teacher mean by 'double facts'?
It meant this...
quote:
They simply use doubles as an easy frame of reference, as most people intuitively do memorize those. At no point was he ever asked to memorize doubles.
quote:
Both of mine were given complete units on visualizing but then completely memorizing double facts, 5 facts, and 10 facts. Then, as you say, those memorized facts become the framework for double -1 etc...
Mine were not...which was my point. Everyone is/was not being taught to memorize these.
He learned to count by 5's and 10, but I wouldn't call it memorization.
This is actually one of those things which makes sense intuitively to me. If you already, likely, know that 8+8=16 than quickly pulling that 8+9=17 because 8+8=16+1=17 makes perfect sense. Doesn't it? Or are you advocating memorizing every addition fact from 1+1 to...I'm not sure what?
Posted on 2/9/15 at 1:32 pm to Bleeding purple
quote:
I have never in my entirety of 20+ years of education been asked to "find the subtrahend"
That's great...it is elementary level math vocabulary and certainly nothing new. What's next, "I've never heard of dividend, divisor, quotient"?
Posted on 2/9/15 at 1:36 pm to KosmoCramer
quote:
This. It doesn't benefit anybody to bitch about the curriculum when doing homework and makes the child resent math and their teacher in some cases.
If people feel that strongly against the education, go to a PTA meeting, school board meeting, legislative meetings at the state house, etc. Not at the dinner table over homework.
Kudos to you.
I'll say it again...because I think it bares repeating...I'm as shitty a math student as you'd ever hope to find. So...I understand that I'm in no position to really form a coherent opinion on whether or not this system works long term. I do not know enough math to decide on my own if the concepts being taught will be of benefit further down the road in courses I was never in a position to take.
What I will say is that from the research I have done, all those who seem to not ALREADY have an issue with CC do to some political issue have no issues with the way math is being taught. Further, those with far more understanding of higher math seem to grasp these concepts and seem to believe that it's more beneficial than "the old way."
So...because it's different from what I remember being taught in 1978 is not a good enough reason for me to lose my shite over this.
Posted on 2/9/15 at 1:36 pm to GeauxTigerTM
quote:
Mine were not...which was my point. Everyone is/was not being taught to memorize these.
Were they ever asked to solve a problem using their 'double facts'? If so how did they do that? Not arguing, just curious
quote:
He learned to count by 5's and 10, but I wouldn't call it memorization.
How is that not memorization? Again just curious.
quote:
This is actually one of those things which makes sense intuitively to me. If you already, likely, know that 8+8=16 than quickly pulling that 8+9=17 because 8+8=16+1=17 makes perfect sense.
Sure it does. But you are beginning with a memorized fact (8+8=16) or if you don't like the word memorized, then assumed fact. That is my point. Instead of memorizing or assuming the whole population of amounts, they focus on certain starting blocks - but those still require memorization. You have to 'know your doubles' to use the double fact. If you have to number line or tally to get your double fact, then it is of little value beyond just using the number line period for 8+9.
quote:
Doesn't it? Or are you advocating memorizing every addition fact from 1+1 to...I'm not sure what?
I am advocating a balance between conceptual and memorization. 1-99 is what I would like but that is completely arbitrary I acknowledge.
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