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Started By
Message
re: Casualty in the War on Drugs
Posted on 7/31/14 at 4:17 pm to ManBearTiger
Posted on 7/31/14 at 4:17 pm to ManBearTiger
quote:
forced sterilization is unacceptable
Yep. I'm also against mandatory drug testing for welfare recipients. I'd rather end welfare for able bodied people.
2
Posted on 7/31/14 at 4:19 pm to junkfunky
quote:
So, no one deserves healthcare?
Semantically no. I do not feel healthcare is a right.
This discussion in pertaining directly to substance use though. Certainly, there are many forms of self abuse that have varying degrees of outcomes on health. The sports mentioned by Roger for instance has both positive and negative health outcomes. There is no reason you or I or any person who works for a living should be paying for the healthcare of 30 yr old on his 4th admission for meth overdose and cellulitis, or cocaine use and MI, or alcohol abuse and acute pancreatitis, or 1 pk a day smoking and recurrent copd admissions.
Posted on 7/31/14 at 4:23 pm to Bleeding purple
quote:
1. If there was an addendum to EMTALA excluding drug related illness that extended to protect medical facilities and providers from fiscally responsible refusals of care based on continued substance related (including alcohol and tobacco)medical non compliance.
I more or less agree with the spirit of this, but I think it's probably not very feasible. It seems like it opens the door to more bureaucratic inefficiency. It would probably end up costing more money than you saved by refusing to treat drug users. Just a tangential thought, but you do also refuse healthcare to people who partake in any activity that can be deemed detrimental to health? Where do you draw the line?
quote:
2. If CPS cases involving child endangerment/abuse that involved drugs resulted in mandatory sterilization of the parent.
This seems like it would be used as a ruse to take more power from the public. Forced sterilization is a scary thing and a tool of oppression. It reminds me of Hitler and fascism.
quote:
3. If all motor vehicle accidents involving a driver under the influence of a drug including alcohol resulted in permanent removal of drivers license and those resulting in death of another driver or passenger were mandatory capital punishment.
Penalties are often not enforced, and many people get off too lightly. I agree with the principal of this sentiment but not to the letter of how you write it out.
quote:
4. If enrollment and recertification for all healthcare funded by tax dollars was dependent upon a negative history of substance related diagnosis and negative blood and urine tests including screening for tobacco at the time of application and throughout enrollment unless actively enrolled in substance abuse rehab program
Pretty much the same issues as point number 1.
Posted on 7/31/14 at 4:25 pm to Bleeding purple
quote:
Semantically no. I do not feel healthcare is a right.
Same. I think a provider or facility has the right to refuse who they choose as well.
Posted on 7/31/14 at 4:29 pm to tiderider
I didn't think it negatively affected your driving, coke that is, just based on what I remember of my use. I could be wrong, you ever tried it?
Posted on 7/31/14 at 4:31 pm to ManBearTiger
quote:
If you don't understand how forced sterilization is unacceptable
It is not forced. It is contingent.
Choose to use drugs and do horrific things to your child, you are then prevented from having more children which you can terrorize.
If you think this is a radical view, go spend some time in ER's, L&D units, and pediatric hospitals and you will find many well educated people who devote their lives to caring for and empowering individuals not utilitarian governmental bodies that hold the same beliefs.
Posted on 7/31/14 at 4:48 pm to RogerTheShrubber
quote:
I'd rather end welfare for able bodied people.
Dumbest shite I've seen today
Posted on 7/31/14 at 5:06 pm to Peazey
quote:
I more or less agree with the spirit of this, but I think it's probably not very feasible. It seems like it opens the door to more bureaucratic inefficiency.
universally available healthcare records are key. We are basically there now. We can pull the pharmacy records of any patient at any time now.
Adding a tag for Medical non compliance do to substance X in a universal location and requiring that this be documented as yes or no for each visit tied to reimbursement would streamline the issue.
quote:
Just a tangential thought, but you do also refuse healthcare to people who partake in any activity that can be deemed detrimental to health? Where do you draw the line?
I agree there is always a "where do you draw the line" question. What many fail to realize is that choosing to not make a decision is in effect deciding that the best management of limited resources is intentional even distribution of access leading to the eventual bias toward those that overuse and abuse the system.
Posted on 7/31/14 at 5:12 pm to Gladius Veritas
I side with OP and will add a story.
Met a dude right after college working out at the gym. We eventually got to be great friends, one of my best friends ever. Dude was a finance major and worked as an analyst a year and a half before I met him. Very smart, very good at his job.
He got busted with a lot of pot in his trunk that year or so before I met him. Was set up by a former friend. He was selling it. Anyway, he got a couple of weeks in jail and a year of house arrest. That wasnt the problem though. He got a felony distribution charge. Ruined his career and ever since all he has just had to sell cars and other stuff, bounce at clubs, etc.
Now talk all you want about the selling pot, but I have no problem with it. Dude was performing a service and meeting a demand of something that never should have been illegal in the first place. Arbitrary dumbshit law ruined his future as far as I'm concerned. Story gets worse as well, and his life is totally fricked now, but you get the point.
Met a dude right after college working out at the gym. We eventually got to be great friends, one of my best friends ever. Dude was a finance major and worked as an analyst a year and a half before I met him. Very smart, very good at his job.
He got busted with a lot of pot in his trunk that year or so before I met him. Was set up by a former friend. He was selling it. Anyway, he got a couple of weeks in jail and a year of house arrest. That wasnt the problem though. He got a felony distribution charge. Ruined his career and ever since all he has just had to sell cars and other stuff, bounce at clubs, etc.
Now talk all you want about the selling pot, but I have no problem with it. Dude was performing a service and meeting a demand of something that never should have been illegal in the first place. Arbitrary dumbshit law ruined his future as far as I'm concerned. Story gets worse as well, and his life is totally fricked now, but you get the point.
Posted on 7/31/14 at 5:15 pm to Tiger n Miami AU83
quote:
Was set up by a former friend
Reads like a bad prison movie
What you in here for?
I didn't do it, I got set up.
Posted on 7/31/14 at 5:17 pm to Gladius Veritas
quote:
I'd rather end welfare for able bodied people.
Dumbest shite I've seen today
Sorry you need welfare, bro.
Posted on 7/31/14 at 5:28 pm to Bleeding purple
quote:
clearly you have a limited scope of our healthcare system
I meant abuse our bodies
Posted on 7/31/14 at 5:30 pm to Bleeding purple
quote:
Getting behind the wheel of a vehicle while under the influence of a substance is a choice not an accident.
It is legal to get impaired...impaired people don't always make the best decisions. They are still accidents.
Posted on 7/31/14 at 5:42 pm to ManBearTiger
quote:
Max 5 years.
I know of a guy. Three drug felonies. Last two for Coke. He never did more than 180 days. And he got that for failing a drug test.
1st charge. - reduced to misdemeanor for completing pre-trial intervention.
2nd charge - 2 years active probation
3rd charge - 6 years active probation, 2 years drug court
He probably wouldn't have got much time unless he had weight.
(we have a three strike system, but there are some balls in there too)
This post was edited on 7/31/14 at 5:43 pm
Posted on 7/31/14 at 5:44 pm to RogerTheShrubber
quote:
I'd rather end welfare for able bodied people.
Strict rule for able bodies people. No more than one year on welfare.
Posted on 7/31/14 at 6:39 pm to Napoleon
They're trying to build a prison
They're trying to build a prison
They're trying to build a prison
For you and me to live in
They're trying to build a prison
They're trying to build a prison
For you and me to live in
This post was edited on 7/31/14 at 6:40 pm
Posted on 7/31/14 at 6:48 pm to Napoleon
quote:
Strict rule for able bodies people. No more than one year on welfare.
An able body is not going to help many of these people in an economy that values intellectual horsepower above all else.
Posted on 7/31/14 at 7:39 pm to Napoleon
Dose he post here?
Posted on 7/31/14 at 8:06 pm to The Third Leg
quote:
An able body is not going to help many of these people in an economy that values intellectual horsepower above all else.
Depends on your location. Blue collar workers can easily make 6 figs here. In fact, skilled labor can make more money than the average college grad. They're hiring them out of the halfway house locally. Can't find enough skilled labor
This post was edited on 7/31/14 at 8:07 pm
Posted on 8/1/14 at 12:35 am to Topwater Trout
quote:
It is legal to get impaired...impaired people don't always make the best decisions. They are still accidents.
I don't often quote people for the sole reason off capturing the shear stupidity but your comments on substance abuse induced motor vehicle collisions and resulting deaths were inspiring.
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