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A Blueprint for Blowing it Up
Posted on 12/13/15 at 11:02 pm
Posted on 12/13/15 at 11:02 pm
New article from MM.
Tyreke + Asik to Brooklyn for Joe Johnson and Shane Larkin
Ryno to Orlando for Frye and a 1st
Gordon and Babbit to OKC for Morrow, McGary, Singler, Novak
LINK /
I'm not sure Orlando gives up a 1st for Ryno, but the rumored Morris trade can accomplish a slightly different version of same goal, a big familiar with Gentry's system and a 1st. I also don't think the team will finish bottom 5. These moves bring in some useable replacements that may be better fits in some instances. As bad as they've played, the Pels are still just 4.5 games out of the 8 seed with 59 games to go.
Tyreke + Asik to Brooklyn for Joe Johnson and Shane Larkin
Ryno to Orlando for Frye and a 1st
Gordon and Babbit to OKC for Morrow, McGary, Singler, Novak
LINK /
I'm not sure Orlando gives up a 1st for Ryno, but the rumored Morris trade can accomplish a slightly different version of same goal, a big familiar with Gentry's system and a 1st. I also don't think the team will finish bottom 5. These moves bring in some useable replacements that may be better fits in some instances. As bad as they've played, the Pels are still just 4.5 games out of the 8 seed with 59 games to go.
5
Posted on 12/13/15 at 11:20 pm to TigerinATL
I vote we stick with it this season and ride it out. no need to blow it up this early. If we still had Monty and we're losing terribly id say fire him and blow it up. We are just getting healthy and to start trading people away now would be incredibly stupid.
Posted on 12/13/15 at 11:42 pm to TigerinATL
Don't know how realistic any of those deals are, but if we're blowing it up, they look fine to me. Although, I'd rather make the Morris move than bring in Frye. The Frye deal was a bad one from day one, but the Orlando GM got a pass because...analytics.
The big if with Morris is obviously the FELONY charge he has pending. As Davis continues to play more center, Morris would be excellent next to him. You're not gonna get a player of that caliber, on that contract, with the cap space you create by totally blowing it up.
The cap's gonna go up and so will the contracts. People talk about the cap going up like guys will still be getting paid 2015 prices.
Blow it up or not, the 3 biggest issues right now are Anderson, Gordon, and Asik's contracts. Do they move those 2 expirings and can they possibly get someone to take Asik's deal.
The big if with Morris is obviously the FELONY charge he has pending. As Davis continues to play more center, Morris would be excellent next to him. You're not gonna get a player of that caliber, on that contract, with the cap space you create by totally blowing it up.
The cap's gonna go up and so will the contracts. People talk about the cap going up like guys will still be getting paid 2015 prices.
Blow it up or not, the 3 biggest issues right now are Anderson, Gordon, and Asik's contracts. Do they move those 2 expirings and can they possibly get someone to take Asik's deal.
Posted on 12/14/15 at 12:09 am to chesty
This season is over. Best case we finish 7th or 8th seed and lose in 5 games. And honestly the chances of that are like 5%. You know we're going to struggle and finish with 36 wins.
What's the point?
What's the point?
Posted on 12/14/15 at 6:33 am to TigerinATL
So I like the premise. If they're ready to reshuffle the deck and are going to deal Anderson, they need to unload other "core" pieces. Anderson for Morris doesn't change much in the grand scheme.
No idea why Brooklyn would do that. Of course I'd do it if I'm the Pels just to get rid of Asik.
Not sure why Orlando wants Anderson. Frye has had a decent start this year, is/will be cheaper, and they have Nicholson, Harris, and Gordon who can all play the 4.
Same thing with the Suns. Not sure Anderson makes a ton of sense with Leuer and Teletovic playing as well as they have.
For McGary alone, this is fine. He might not be very good, but he is a live body down low. The Pels desperately need to give Davis help. Morrow would be good, while Singler and Novak are cap filler at this point.
I agree. But I think top 10 is now very likely. The draft is still the best place to find a 2nd banana for Davis, even in the mid to late lottery.
quote:
Tyreke + Asik to Brooklyn for Joe Johnson and Shane Larkin
No idea why Brooklyn would do that. Of course I'd do it if I'm the Pels just to get rid of Asik.
quote:
Ryno to Orlando for Frye and a 1st
Not sure why Orlando wants Anderson. Frye has had a decent start this year, is/will be cheaper, and they have Nicholson, Harris, and Gordon who can all play the 4.
Same thing with the Suns. Not sure Anderson makes a ton of sense with Leuer and Teletovic playing as well as they have.
quote:
Gordon and Babbit to OKC for Morrow, McGary, Singler, Novak
For McGary alone, this is fine. He might not be very good, but he is a live body down low. The Pels desperately need to give Davis help. Morrow would be good, while Singler and Novak are cap filler at this point.
quote:
I also don't think the team will finish bottom 5
I agree. But I think top 10 is now very likely. The draft is still the best place to find a 2nd banana for Davis, even in the mid to late lottery.
Posted on 12/14/15 at 6:58 am to corndeaux
Demps is the gm we will not participate in the draft. Probably will sell our first rounder for cash.
Posted on 12/14/15 at 7:19 am to Peliclown
I rather hitch my wagon to Tyreke than Jrue. Jrue's game is much more methodical and deliberate and I am not sure if that's the style you want in Gentry's system. Plus, Can honestly ever be sure Jrue will ever be totally healthy again?
Posted on 12/14/15 at 8:22 am to corndeaux
quote:
No idea why Brooklyn would do that.
1) Joe Johnson's contract is so big it will be hard to get anything of value for it.
2) Brooklyn doesn't own their own draft pick this year so gains no benefit from being a bottom 5 team.
3) Despite being really bad, they are still only 6 games out of the 8 seed with Jarrett Jack as the starting PG and Joe Johnson having his worst year ever by a pretty big margin.
4) Their backup center is Bargnani, so they actually might be able to use Asik and with the escalating cap, his contract isn't good, but also isn't terrible for a 3rd big. Our problem is we aren't using him as a 3rd big.
I don't think the question is why does Brooklyn do it but is there a better trade on the table to make them say no OR do the rumors that Prokhorov might want to sell the team mean they are in "For Sale" mode which always means not taking on any long term salary.
One interesting point McNamara brought up in the latest podcast is that there are no sellers on the market yet and more buyers than expected because there's so much more early parity than expected. Don't wait for the trade deadline, start the sale now, and the way this team is playing selling doesn't necessarily mean you end up with a worse team.
This post was edited on 12/14/15 at 8:29 am
Posted on 12/14/15 at 8:27 am to 504Voodoo
quote:
Can honestly ever be sure Jrue will ever be totally healthy again?
Players recover from stress fractures all the time, and when they don't they usually have more surgery like KD just did. If they had followed the doctors orders last year and given Jrue the minutes restriction and it hadn't been an issue again since last January, would you be concerned? I wouldn't, all that's happened is we've shifted our time frame for when we think it's ok to feel safe about his tibia by a year. We probably won't feel comfortable until next year, but it's possible that we've already seen the last of the pain that stress fracture will cause Jrue.
Posted on 12/14/15 at 8:40 am to TigerinATL
To boil my ideology to its simplest form:
The only way we are going to get another stud next to AD anytime soon is via the 2016 draft. It is highly unlikely that we will ever have the potential of being THIS bad again. We aren't landing any stud FA's and we don't have the assets to land a stud in a trade, so if you want the highest ceiling for this team in the future, you have to capitalize on your one chance to get a really good player in 2016
So.... blow it up and get some assets for guys who aren't long term pieces while in the process making your team bad enough to finish with a bottom 5-8 record. Hope the ping pong balls go your way on lottery night or have a great player fall into your lap wherever you pick.
It's not a lock. No path is. But that path has the highest ceiling IMO
The only way we are going to get another stud next to AD anytime soon is via the 2016 draft. It is highly unlikely that we will ever have the potential of being THIS bad again. We aren't landing any stud FA's and we don't have the assets to land a stud in a trade, so if you want the highest ceiling for this team in the future, you have to capitalize on your one chance to get a really good player in 2016
So.... blow it up and get some assets for guys who aren't long term pieces while in the process making your team bad enough to finish with a bottom 5-8 record. Hope the ping pong balls go your way on lottery night or have a great player fall into your lap wherever you pick.
It's not a lock. No path is. But that path has the highest ceiling IMO
This post was edited on 12/14/15 at 8:42 am
Posted on 12/14/15 at 8:58 am to SirWinston
quote:
This season is over. Best case we finish 7th or 8th seed and lose in 5 games. And honestly the chances of that are like 5%. You know we're going to struggle and finish with 36 wins.
What's the point?
Yea let's just do what the 76ers are doing, that's fun.
Look, no one is beating Golden State....So in essence whats the point for anyone to continue? Should everyone blow it up?
This post was edited on 12/14/15 at 8:59 am
Posted on 12/14/15 at 9:24 am to TigerinATL
quote:
Don't wait for the trade deadline, start the sale now, and the way this team is playing selling doesn't necessarily mean you end up with a worse team.
I think we would be a better team with all of those trades.
Only problem is that we'd have no center, not that we have one now.
Anything to get rid of Asik would satisfy me. And we've hung on to EG for this long, i'd like the cap space, unless we get something of reasonable value back.
Posted on 12/14/15 at 9:28 am to Rico Tubbs
This system was supposed to unleash the roster, it clearly hasn't, so you have to start questioning how good the roster actually is. If it's not as good as you thought, maybe it's time to go a different direction. Even a different coach would have lead to roster change. Supposedly one of the reasons Gentry won over JVG is JVG didn't like the roster that much. It's not time to go into rebuild mode, but I think we've seen enough to justify changing a good chunk of the roster.
Posted on 12/14/15 at 9:32 am to TeddyPadillac
quote:
we've hung on to EG for this long, i'd like the cap space,
You don't get his cap space back though. You have to lose EG, Cole and Ryno to get about $18 million in cap space. If you replace Ryno with Morris you only have about $10 in cap space.
Posted on 12/14/15 at 9:54 am to TigerinATL
quote:
You don't get his cap space back though. You have to lose EG, Cole and Ryno to get about $18 million in cap space. If you replace Ryno with Morris you only have about $10 in cap space.
and that's why signing Asik was stupid.
Posted on 12/14/15 at 9:55 am to TigerinATL
(no message)
Posted on 12/14/15 at 10:00 am to TigerinATL
quote:
there are no sellers on the market yet and more buyers than expected
i think the "buyers/sellers" dynamic may be more nuanced this year than usual. there are plenty of teams that you could make a case for not being entirely happy with their roster, and thus willing to make a move
Posted on 12/14/15 at 10:02 am to cgrand
right after i posted that, this:
quote:
Brian Geltzeiler ?@hoopscritic 6m6 minutes ago League source also tells me that John Hollinger is also on extremely thin ice as well with the Grizzlies.
Brian Geltzeiler ?@hoopscritic 8m8 minutes ago League source tells me that Dave Joerger is extremely close to being fired. Depending upon tonight's game, could happen as soon as tomorrow
Posted on 12/14/15 at 10:19 am to SirWinston
quote:
This season is over. Best case we finish 7th or 8th seed and lose in 5 games. And honestly the chances of that are like 5%. You know we're going to struggle and finish with 36 wins. What's the point?
Still to worthless Trump praise on the poli board.
Posted on 12/14/15 at 10:26 am to TigerinATL
Don't trust Jrue to ever be healthy. Also, he lacks a killer instinct come closing time, and there are tons of PGs out there, and more coming up through the ranks.
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