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re: At what point will you say Lebron is better than Jordan was?
Posted on 4/25/17 at 11:22 am to tigerskin
Posted on 4/25/17 at 11:22 am to tigerskin
As a LeBron fan, I will say there's very little chance I'd ever put him ahead of Jordan. The only was is if he goes on some insane championship run and wins like 5 more.
That said, I already have him as #2 all time and he lessens the gap with each great season and any additional championships.
That said, I already have him as #2 all time and he lessens the gap with each great season and any additional championships.
2
Posted on 4/25/17 at 11:23 am to Starchild
quote:
As a LeBron fan, I will say there's very little chance I'd ever put him ahead of Jordan. The only was is if he goes on some insane championship run and wins like 5 more. That said, I already have him as #2 all time and he lessens the gap with each great season and any additional championships.
This
Posted on 4/25/17 at 11:23 am to Buckeye06
quote:
What did Jordan do when it was tough and he couldn't beat the Pistons?
He sat there and waited until the HOF-caliber gift that was Scottie Pippen matured and the team drafted Horace Grant. Bam, championship team.
I know, Lebron should've stuck it out with Cleveland. Maybe today we'd be talking about great Boobie Gibson looked in his 8th or 9th All-star appearance.
Posted on 4/25/17 at 11:24 am to c on z
quote:
Do we have to continuously underrate what MJ had when he began to win titles?
This. MJ had another top 25 (of all time) player for all six of his championships. The first three years with Horace Grant arguably has the greatest "big 3" ever assembled, and the personnel in the second three peat actually involved a better roster, if a weaker big three, with the additions of the 95-96 sixth man of the year Toni Kukoc and one of the greatest rebounders of all time, Dennis Rodman. And on top of all that you have the winningest NBA coach of all time running the show.
If you want to argue that the Bulls teams of the 90's were the best ever in terms of the team overall, I'd find it hard to argue against it. But MJ wasn't carrying those teams on his own. Those teams were stacked.
Posted on 4/25/17 at 11:25 am to Goldrush25
quote:
I know, Lebron should've stuck it out with Cleveland. Maybe today we'd be talking about great Boobie Gibson looked in his 8th or 9th All-star appearance.
Posted on 4/25/17 at 11:25 am to gorillacoco
quote:Lebron had Mo Williams.
This. MJ had another top 25 (of all time) player for all six of his championships
What you trying to say about Mo Williams!!!!!
Posted on 4/25/17 at 11:27 am to tigerskin
They're nowhere close now. LeBron isn't even in my top 5, barely top 10.
Jordan is probably the most complete player the game has even seen.
Jordan is probably the most complete player the game has even seen.
Posted on 4/25/17 at 11:29 am to llfshoals
Complete player? Absolutely.
Most complete the game has ever seen? I disagree.
Most complete the game has ever seen? I disagree.
Posted on 4/25/17 at 11:29 am to llfshoals
quote:Oh dear God.
LeBron isn't even in my top 5, barely top 10.
Posted on 4/25/17 at 11:29 am to llfshoals
quote:
They're nowhere close now. LeBron isn't even in my top 5, barely top 10
Who on god's green earth do you have ahead of him?
Posted on 4/25/17 at 11:30 am to Starchild
quote:
As a LeBron fan, I will say there's very little chance I'd ever put him ahead of Jordan. The only was is if he goes on some insane championship run and wins like 5 more.
That said, I already have him as #2 all time and he lessens the gap with each great season and any additional championships.
This is the most fair assessment, IMO.
Posted on 4/25/17 at 11:31 am to llfshoals
Also, think about the path Jordan had when he was a young player. He had to get through the Celtics dynasty and then the Bad Boys Pistons. Those teams roughed him up big time yet Jordan just kept bringing it.
With the flagrant foul rules in today's game, Jordan could get to the rim anytime he wanted without any fear of injury.
Even though you aren't supposed to consider college accomplishments, the fact that Jordan hit the game winning jumper to win the national championship is also a factor for me personally.
With the flagrant foul rules in today's game, Jordan could get to the rim anytime he wanted without any fear of injury.
Even though you aren't supposed to consider college accomplishments, the fact that Jordan hit the game winning jumper to win the national championship is also a factor for me personally.
Posted on 4/25/17 at 11:34 am to litenin
quote:Canceled out by the illegal defense rules that allow teams to shade 3 guys towards Lebron when he has the ball. Whereas MJ was in a legit 1 on 1 situation every time he had the ball unless there was a hard double. I'd say that's a MUCH bigger factor than flagrant foul rules.
With the flagrant foul rules in today's game, Jordan could get to the rim anytime he wanted without any fear of injury.
Posted on 4/25/17 at 11:37 am to shel311
quote:
the illegal defense rules that allow teams to shade 3 guys towards Lebron when he has the ball. Whereas MJ was in a legit 1 on 1 situation every time he had the ball unless there was a hard double.
Why do people forget about this. It was so much easier for a transcendent player to get to the rack in Jordan's era.
Posted on 4/25/17 at 11:39 am to shel311
I've always considered the hand-check era and the zone defense era as a wash, but that's probably bro science bullshite that I made up
One thing I'm certain of - Wilt's eye-popping numbers wouldn't happen in the 90s or beyond.
One thing I'm certain of - Wilt's eye-popping numbers wouldn't happen in the 90s or beyond.
Posted on 4/25/17 at 11:41 am to Winston Cup
quote:
When he plays 82 games in a season. Something he has never done in 14 seasons that Jordan did 9/15 seasons.
11/15 over 80 games
He has already played more minutes and averages more minutes a game. And he did it without a suspension err.... retirement.
Posted on 4/25/17 at 11:45 am to TbirdSpur2010
Lebron is closer than people want to believe. I thought 2 years ago when he put his team on his back against GS and went up 2-1 without 2 all-stars was enough for me. Last year put him right there.
The only thing that keeps me reluctant is his free-throw shooting and his low-percentage outside 13-20 feet. As a passer he is better; as an all-around defender he is better; as a complete dominant force he is just as good if not better. If he shot a higher-percentage from the line and outside it would be a no-brainer.
And in terms of athleticism, both were extremely athletic in their early years, but Lebron was 6'9 pushing 250 in his early years and every bit as athletic as Jordan.
Let him beat Golden State this year and this discussion is OVER.
The only thing that keeps me reluctant is his free-throw shooting and his low-percentage outside 13-20 feet. As a passer he is better; as an all-around defender he is better; as a complete dominant force he is just as good if not better. If he shot a higher-percentage from the line and outside it would be a no-brainer.
And in terms of athleticism, both were extremely athletic in their early years, but Lebron was 6'9 pushing 250 in his early years and every bit as athletic as Jordan.
Let him beat Golden State this year and this discussion is OVER.
Posted on 4/25/17 at 11:45 am to c on z
quote:
Do we have to continuously underrate what MJ had when he began to win titles?
You mean a coach that neither of the two modern day players Lebron is compared ever could win without?
Posted on 4/25/17 at 11:56 am to Winston Cup
quote:
When he plays 82 games in a season. Something he has never done in 14 seasons that Jordan did 9/15 seasons.
Yeahhhhh, as already asked, how do you count those three years Jordan took off?
Posted on 4/25/17 at 11:58 am to shel311
quote:
I've officially heard it all on Lebron with this take. Lebron averaged 39/8/8 in that series
The owner of the team he played for said he quit. You're a lebron fanboy so nothing he does wrong can be put in front of you for you to admit he did something wrong.
quote:
LeBron left the team that drafted him and had behind closed door conversations to create a "super" team.
Quite literally has no bearing on how good of a player he is.
It does when you are deciding if someone is the GOAT, and I am saying he isn't because he created a team to win, as opposed to taking the team he was on and winning.
Will you say he didn't quit against the Celtics in 2010 too?
LINK
This post was edited on 4/25/17 at 12:01 pm
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