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Posted on 2/22/11 at 1:07 pm to Tigerfan7218
quote:
You said "if their habits are bad and you can't break them then don't sign them" correct? How on earth do you know if you can't break the bad habits until you coach them?
He didn't start that line of reasoning. I agree with his statement. The bottom line is that the high school habit excuse does not fly. If TJ was not aware of these guys' bad habits in high school, he should be ashamed to cash his paychecks.
Posted on 2/22/11 at 1:11 pm to Jester
Ok, sorry I didn't see the first post in that line, I apologize for that. I was just saying that not signing a guy b/c of not being able to fix his bad habits isn't exactly reasonable, any respectable coach who sees talent but a few bad habits should think he can fix the bad ones. If TJ doesn't know they don't have bad habits you are correct that it is sad and he should be embarrased, but fwiw I don't think that's the case
Posted on 2/22/11 at 1:21 pm to Jester
quote:
The bottom line is that the high school habit excuse does not fly. If TJ was not aware of these guys' bad habits in high school, he should be ashamed to cash his paychecks.
I don't agree with this in general. Look at how the NBA drafts kids on upside. Anthony Randolph was not fundamentally sound when he was here, but had a huge upside. That statement isn't pro/anti trent, just saying
Posted on 2/22/11 at 1:33 pm to Jester
quote:
Were you also taught that statistics are meaningless without context? Look at the scores. Look at the records of teams that are beating us.
1966-1967 is worse, but happened 45 years ago. Trying to compare it favorably to 1997-1998 is idiotic if you're trying to prove that he's doing a good job. That team was under severe sanctions like the NCAA has rarely seen. This team has no sanctions whatsoever.
whatever jester the molester.
When you say worst in "History", there isn't a time limit. "worst in history" doesn't have asterisk defining the parameter of the judgement.
The comment wasn't worst in 45 years w/o probation.
quote:
if you're trying to prove that he's doing a good job.
i'm not. i just don't beleive he should be fired yet. i believe he should be given 4-5 years to build his program then decide if you want to keep him or not.
i'm not the one claiming he should be fired or that he is not being fired because of his skin color.
i'm making factual points supporting, regardless of his skin color, why he should not be fired AT THIS TIME.
You give daddy dale four losing seasons, john brady 10 years (finishing last 50% of the time), and fire johnson after three with an s.e.c. championship? (which is 1/2 of brady's accomplishments in 10) yeah, thats fair.
This post was edited on 2/22/11 at 1:37 pm
Posted on 2/22/11 at 1:47 pm to Tigerfan7218
quote:
ou said "if their habits are bad and you can't break them then don't sign them" correct? How on earth do you know if you can't break the bad habits until you coach them?
As a college bb coach making 1.2, I would hope he could evaluate the talent he knew he could help. The problem with these guys is, they are not very good. Ralston Turner is very good. Our guys have habits you can't coach...too slow and not very quick, you can't coach that. When guys come to LSU they should have raw talent that needs refining. When you don't have a base of good players you need to sign guys who are ready to play. He has signed a bunch of kids who are not ready to play in this league. The only kid truly ready to play is turner. The other kids are role players. You can sign kids like that if you have some good starters, we don't. All these kids will be descent their jr and sr years. That's why TJ is two years behind in his plan, If he would have signed kids like this his first or even second year here they would be Jr's and Srs., he chose not to sign anyone, bass and ludwig who are not good at all. You can't tell me he couldn't have signed players as good as stringer and dbecker his first or second year. Without a real stud coming in and I'm talking a guy who can really play, he won't be much better next year, maybe a few more wins. The problem with that is the other teams will be better also. You can beat your arse, bama, kent, flor, state, arky and georgia have some five star players coming in and more than one. He really needs to sign a stud juco player and shake his staff up or he won't be around after next year. He should cut bass and ludwig loose to free up those schollies.
Posted on 2/22/11 at 1:48 pm to dos crystal
quote:
john brady 10 years (finishing last 50% of the time), and fire johnson after three with an s.e.c. championship? (which is 1/2 of brady's accomplishments in 10) yeah, thats fair.
bullshite. Trent Johnson has dealt with ZERO sanctions since taking over. He has also taken LSU to ZERO Final Fours. I guess he's exactly 0% as successful as Brady if we use your logic.
Posted on 2/22/11 at 1:56 pm to KingHippo
don't agree with this in general. Look at how the NBA drafts kids on upside. Anthony Randolph was not fundamentally sound when he was here, but had a huge upside. That statement isn't pro/anti trent, just saying
King Hippo, come on you can't compare the NBA to college, NBA you play and practice all day everyday its your job. sure you take a kid like that in the nba he was 6'10 who could take it coast to coast, who obviously should have stayed in college another year.
King Hippo, come on you can't compare the NBA to college, NBA you play and practice all day everyday its your job. sure you take a kid like that in the nba he was 6'10 who could take it coast to coast, who obviously should have stayed in college another year.
Posted on 2/22/11 at 2:06 pm to jr33
The only problem I have with TJ is the lack of recruiting JUCOs during that first season. But since I don't know the exact APR state at LSU that could very well be the reason he didn't do that. As for recruiting freshmen that first year, to recruit in other states you really need relationships in that state, TJ came in and didn't have those in any state that LSU could recruit out of. And fwiw Louisiana talent has been lacking the last few years and the two top rated players from the state are at LSU (Ludwig and Derenbecker). You can clearly see the developement of those relationships in the fact that Turner (Alabama) and O'Bryant (Mississippi) are both coming to LSU.
And on a side note, I'm not saying you are one of these people but I'd really like to know the reason for people wanting TJ gone after this season... IMHO that would set the program back another 2 years at the least.
And on a side note, I'm not saying you are one of these people but I'd really like to know the reason for people wanting TJ gone after this season... IMHO that would set the program back another 2 years at the least.
Posted on 2/22/11 at 2:17 pm to Jester
quote:
bullshite. Trent Johnson has dealt with ZERO sanctions since taking over. He has also taken LSU to ZERO Final Fours. I guess he's exactly 0% as successful as Brady if we use your logic.
you referencing logic? you would have fired brady before he got his final four. it took him 9 years! of course, you don't understand apr or the 5 and 3 rule. he has had to deal with this.
the 5 and 3 rule means if you sign 5 players one year you can't sign more than 3 the next. Johnson came in against this. it's why he couldn't sign more players his first two seasons.
brady signed Garrett Green, Anthony Randolph, Bo Spencer, Marcus Thornton, and q thornton in 2007.
then Delwan graham, Dennis Harris, and Storm warren in 2008. (Anthony Randolph was gone the year before johnson. he had m.t. for one additional year, juco guy 2 to play 2)
yep, johnson came into a great situation. just look at those 8 players, which he only had 6 to work with for more than one year.
the program was in great shape! That brady, he was set up for another final four run!
Posted on 2/22/11 at 2:36 pm to dos crystal
quote:
you referencing logic? you would have fired brady before he got his final four. it took him 9 years!
Nope, I supported Brady until his final year when it was his time to go. He had that whole probation thing to deal with.
quote:
of course, you don't understand apr or the 5 and 3 rule. he has had to deal with this.
the 5 and 3 rule means if you sign 5 players one year you can't sign more than 3 the next. Johnson came in against this. it's why he couldn't sign more players his first two seasons.
brady signed Garrett Green, Anthony Randolph, Bo Spencer, Marcus Thornton, and q thornton in 2007.
then Delwan graham, Dennis Harris, and Storm warren in 2008. (Anthony Randolph was gone the year before johnson. he had m.t. for one additional year, juco guy 2 to play 2)
Every coach in america has to deal with those things. Great excuse: "I have to compete on a level playing field."
Taking your argument, we could sign:
2007 - 5
2008 - 3
2009 - 5 (We got 2, Ludwig and Dotson. 2 duds)
2010 - 5 (we got 4, Stinger, Turner, DBeck, and Courtney. 1 good, 1 solid, 1 dud, 1 no action)
2011 - 4 (We have 2.)
So where exactly was he limited by the 5+3 rule?
quote:
the program was in great shape! That brady, he was set up for another final four run!
Um, they did make it to the Sweet Sixteen and some claim they should have gone farther. Way to argue with yourself.
I do realize I left out the transfer. I like to imagine LSU without White.
This post was edited on 2/22/11 at 2:40 pm
Posted on 2/22/11 at 3:06 pm to Jester
quote:
Um, they did make it to the Sweet Sixteen
fail. move along, now. your talking about something you know nothing about.
they didn't make it to the sweet sixteen.
This post was edited on 2/22/11 at 3:07 pm
Posted on 2/22/11 at 3:09 pm to dos crystal
quote:
fail. move along, now. your talking about something you know nothing about.
they didn't make it to the sweet sixteen.
lulz
I had some guy tell me that LSU isn't even going to get into the SEC tournament the other day
Posted on 2/22/11 at 3:10 pm to KingHippo
Why is this thread still alive?
Posted on 2/22/11 at 3:13 pm to dos crystal
quote:
fail. move along, now. your talking about something you know nothing about.
they didn't make it to the sweet sixteen.
My bad. So, his tenure is even worse than I was giving him credit for.
Posted on 2/22/11 at 3:15 pm to c on z
quote:
Why is this thread still alive?
Because there are three posters on this board that have made it their personal agenda to defend everything that is Trent Johnson.
Posted on 2/22/11 at 3:16 pm to Raparooot
I consider this a legit question.
I think either way a coach (black, white, purple, green) that has done what Johnson has done would deserve one more year. If they aren't at least an NIT team next year, he's out for sure.
I think either way a coach (black, white, purple, green) that has done what Johnson has done would deserve one more year. If they aren't at least an NIT team next year, he's out for sure.
Posted on 2/22/11 at 3:17 pm to KingHippo
quote:
I don't agree with this in general. Look at how the NBA drafts kids on upside. Anthony Randolph was not fundamentally sound when he was here, but had a huge upside. That statement isn't pro/anti trent, just saying
But they went into it knowing that Randolph had downsides, as well. That is my point. An NBA team doing something stupid doesn't make it a brilliant move in college.
Posted on 2/22/11 at 3:18 pm to Jester
quote:
My bad
your right. you are bad at making or defending your point!
p.s. how many players can any one b.b. team have on scholarship in a given year?
above you have 18 in four leaving out a transfer. hmmmm.
Posted on 2/22/11 at 3:20 pm to KingHippo
quote:
I had some guy tell me that LSU isn't even going to get into the SEC tournament the other day
:Hitchcock:
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