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re: For those that played baseball, help me out with this statement
Posted on 6/19/13 at 4:27 pm to PurpleAndGold86
Posted on 6/19/13 at 4:27 pm to PurpleAndGold86
quote:
The ball that Katz hit was a mistake the pitcher made and brought down to about Katz' waist. He was able to get his hands of top of the baseball and drive it hard. Pitches higher than that still look enticing, but are extremely difficult to get your hands on top of.
This. Belt high pitches were not the problem. The problem was the pitches at the letters that we simply could not lay off of.
0
Posted on 6/19/13 at 4:27 pm to OldManRiver
I think a possible reason why the hitters were so unable to adjust in the game is that perhaps they didn't practice adjusting throughout the season.
What I mean is, for example, Bertman used to talk about adjustments at the plate all the time (in each & every game) depending on the pitcher or the park or even the weather. For example, "lay off the arm side high fastball that this lefty is likely to throw" or "we're playing at UNO & the wind is blowing in off the lake...adjust your swing."
These adjustment scenarios were practiced during BP drills through the year (Fall & Spring). E.g. there were targets put on the field and you trained yourself to hit them on a line.
I don't know for certain, but if CPM just started talking about & practicing laying off the chest high, 88mph meatball then that would explain the inability to adjust. If adjustments is a routine part of the game prep, then they should have been able to adjust more in the aggregate.
What I mean is, for example, Bertman used to talk about adjustments at the plate all the time (in each & every game) depending on the pitcher or the park or even the weather. For example, "lay off the arm side high fastball that this lefty is likely to throw" or "we're playing at UNO & the wind is blowing in off the lake...adjust your swing."
These adjustment scenarios were practiced during BP drills through the year (Fall & Spring). E.g. there were targets put on the field and you trained yourself to hit them on a line.
I don't know for certain, but if CPM just started talking about & practicing laying off the chest high, 88mph meatball then that would explain the inability to adjust. If adjustments is a routine part of the game prep, then they should have been able to adjust more in the aggregate.
Posted on 6/19/13 at 4:30 pm to burke985
The balls that didnt leave the park against UCLA were not hit squarely and they got under them just enough, a couple mm on where you strike the ball can make a big difference in how far it travels. Or the guys hitting the ball are not capable of hitting it far enough to get it out of a big park like that. But I dont think that was the case with Ibarra I just think he got under them just enough to screw him
This post was edited on 6/19/13 at 4:31 pm
Posted on 6/19/13 at 4:34 pm to OldManRiver
Too aggressive and the pitch up high like that looks great from the pitchers release point.......
Posted on 6/19/13 at 4:50 pm to OldManRiver
I never understood this line of questioning. It's always the head coach's responsibility to have his team ready to play. That could be physically or mentally. If some players can't handle the big stage then it's the coach's job to deal with this. How he deals with it is up to him.
Posted on 6/19/13 at 4:51 pm to peopleschamp
quote:
I never understood this line of questioning. It's always the head coach's responsibility to have his team ready to play. That could be physically or mentally. If some players can't handle the big stage then it's the coach's job to deal with this. How he deals with it is up to him.
Thanks Knute.
Posted on 6/19/13 at 4:59 pm to OldManRiver
Belt high fastballs are meant to be crushed. They are mistake pitches. Why anyone would try and teach laying off of them is mind boggling. Letter high fastballs are tough to hit, and I can see trying to teach laying off of them. Manieri was right about one thing, the teaching was ineffective.
If LSU has expectations of going to Omaha frequently, then maybe it would be beneficial to tailor the team toward playing baseball that uses TD Ameritrade more to its advantage. It wouldn't be hard to reconfigure Alex Box to make it more like TD Ameritrade. And assembling a team of contact hitters with speed and good gloves shouldn't be too hard. LSU already knows how to find the right mix of pitchers. Maybe this would address the problems with pop ups and fly outs that LSU had in Omaha.
If LSU has expectations of going to Omaha frequently, then maybe it would be beneficial to tailor the team toward playing baseball that uses TD Ameritrade more to its advantage. It wouldn't be hard to reconfigure Alex Box to make it more like TD Ameritrade. And assembling a team of contact hitters with speed and good gloves shouldn't be too hard. LSU already knows how to find the right mix of pitchers. Maybe this would address the problems with pop ups and fly outs that LSU had in Omaha.
Posted on 6/19/13 at 5:25 pm to The Mick
quote:
means we kept hacking at high heat and popping the ball up... and couldnt stop doing it batter after batter.
This.... It's the mental part of the game and it's the toughest part as a former player.
Posted on 6/19/13 at 5:50 pm to OldManRiver
These kids are so good of hitters they have grown up being able to hit the high fastball. When you have had success doing that all your career its hard to stop in one or two practices. I learned early I could not hit a high fastball and learned not to swing at it.
Posted on 6/19/13 at 6:01 pm to High C
quote:why don't you try 35_ years of h.s. coaching... that's the LINK!
as an athelete, the mental aspect is just as important as the physical preperation... these Tigers weren't mentally into it, for whatever reason
Oh, dear God. Link?
Posted on 6/19/13 at 6:12 pm to LSUQB66676811
I played baseball until 8th grade then went with football. When I was in my twenties someone took me to a batting cage you could set at 70-100mph.
Now when I was in 8th grade I was one of better players. But this - Holy Crap. At 90 mph I would have to start swinging before the ball dropped in the machine - and then I just heard the thud behind me and I had no idea if I was ahead behind above below. No idea. At football I was All State WR so I have hand / eye. But this is different.
So I understand kind of what you baseball players are talking about - but know there is so much the we non players don't realize is even going on in the chess match.
I agree we couldn't lay off the high heat.
But we were still always in the game. I would never name a Tiger competitor because this team was a pleasure to watch all year - but if one of several guys just gets 1 hit in the gap. We are on our way.
I think it can be as simple as slumps at the wrong time.
Wanted to jump in thread and congratulate and thank the players for an outstanding year. Many a hair raising moment this year. Congrats on Omaha and Good Luck to 2014 Tigers as well as those moving on.
Now when I was in 8th grade I was one of better players. But this - Holy Crap. At 90 mph I would have to start swinging before the ball dropped in the machine - and then I just heard the thud behind me and I had no idea if I was ahead behind above below. No idea. At football I was All State WR so I have hand / eye. But this is different.
So I understand kind of what you baseball players are talking about - but know there is so much the we non players don't realize is even going on in the chess match.
I agree we couldn't lay off the high heat.
But we were still always in the game. I would never name a Tiger competitor because this team was a pleasure to watch all year - but if one of several guys just gets 1 hit in the gap. We are on our way.
I think it can be as simple as slumps at the wrong time.
Wanted to jump in thread and congratulate and thank the players for an outstanding year. Many a hair raising moment this year. Congrats on Omaha and Good Luck to 2014 Tigers as well as those moving on.
This post was edited on 6/19/13 at 6:14 pm
Posted on 6/19/13 at 6:14 pm to ramchallenge
Manieri's statement, to anyone who knows anything about baseball, is an admission that his hitters have not been properly trained. This, from a basic hitting instruction manual:
Notice, the high heat is the number one strike out pitch in amateur baseball. It's not in the pros because you don't last in the pros if you can't lay off the high heat. Pro pitchers will eat you alive.
Teaching LSU's hitters to lay off the high heat should be one of the fundamentals that the staff stresses from the first day of practice every year. However, Manieri's post game comments show that they are not teaching that fundamental batting skill day in and day out and tried to do it at the last minute.
They also are clearly not teaching bunting, another fundamental skill. So, you end up with very talented athletes who are still playing like amateurs. They are skilled enough to hit well against college pitchers who will never see the pros, but when they face a good pitcher, their fundamental deficiencies are exposed. That happened when they faced Stanek, Gray and both pitchers in the CWS.
Also, I'm sure that the opposing coaches had LSU scouted well and had pitchers with the skill to exploit LSU's weaknesses.
quote:
Avoid the high heat. The fast ball, high in the zone, looks like a meatball coming to the plate. The problem is that it is nearly impossible to hit. The number one strike out pitch in amateur baseball is the high fast ball. Hitter’s can’t lay off them, and they can’t hit them. Learn to develop an eye for this pitch, and practice good discipline by learning to lay off it.
Notice, the high heat is the number one strike out pitch in amateur baseball. It's not in the pros because you don't last in the pros if you can't lay off the high heat. Pro pitchers will eat you alive.
Teaching LSU's hitters to lay off the high heat should be one of the fundamentals that the staff stresses from the first day of practice every year. However, Manieri's post game comments show that they are not teaching that fundamental batting skill day in and day out and tried to do it at the last minute.
They also are clearly not teaching bunting, another fundamental skill. So, you end up with very talented athletes who are still playing like amateurs. They are skilled enough to hit well against college pitchers who will never see the pros, but when they face a good pitcher, their fundamental deficiencies are exposed. That happened when they faced Stanek, Gray and both pitchers in the CWS.
Also, I'm sure that the opposing coaches had LSU scouted well and had pitchers with the skill to exploit LSU's weaknesses.
Posted on 6/19/13 at 6:24 pm to ramchallenge
quote:
these Tigers weren't mentally into it
Should have had Les give them a pep talk like he did before 1/9/12
Posted on 6/19/13 at 6:28 pm to Fabius
Fabius
Literally nothing you said in that entire rambling pile of crap was even close to being accurate. God there are some incredibly stupid people that post here.
Your post is fricking laughable. Holy cow. "From a basic hitting manual".. What a dipshit.
Literally nothing you said in that entire rambling pile of crap was even close to being accurate. God there are some incredibly stupid people that post here.
Your post is fricking laughable. Holy cow. "From a basic hitting manual".. What a dipshit.
This post was edited on 6/19/13 at 6:33 pm
Posted on 6/19/13 at 6:42 pm to PurpleAndGold86
Very astute Purple. I suppose that you think that chasing the high heat is sound batting technique and bunting is an unnecessary skill. The reason I quoted a "basic" hitting manual is because the principles are basic. There is no mystery to hitting fundamentals.
Did you ever play the game?
Did you ever play the game?
Posted on 6/19/13 at 6:50 pm to Fabius
You are gold. I was laughing out loud reading your post and my wife wanted to know why. I showed her your post. She is still laughing. You should be happy that you could provide two people with such a good laugh.
quote:
Did you ever play the game?
Posted on 6/19/13 at 6:53 pm to OldManRiver
it means they should have set the machine up chest high because that's where the pitches in the game were.
Posted on 6/19/13 at 6:56 pm to PurpleAndGold86
quote:
You are gold. I was laughing out loud reading your post and my wife wanted to know why. I showed her your post. She is still laughing. You should be happy that you could provide two people with such a good laugh.
quote:
Did you ever play the game?
Always happy to entertain. Simple minds are so easy to amuse. I guess your wife played the game, too?
This post was edited on 6/19/13 at 6:57 pm
Posted on 6/19/13 at 7:39 pm to The Mick
The Mick
For those that played baseball, help me out with this statement
means we kept hacking at high heat and popping the ball up... and couldnt stop doing it batter after batter.
Actually especially against ucla it wasn't hacking at high heat. That kid was lobbing BP up there and lsu was playing baseball. Only problem is that much in the same way the hot bats created illogical baseball results from logical baseball plays, dead bats in that field create unrealistic outcomes to the "correct" baseball actions.
Had they "layed off" most would've struck out in 3-4 pitches looking.
For those that played baseball, help me out with this statement
means we kept hacking at high heat and popping the ball up... and couldnt stop doing it batter after batter.
Actually especially against ucla it wasn't hacking at high heat. That kid was lobbing BP up there and lsu was playing baseball. Only problem is that much in the same way the hot bats created illogical baseball results from logical baseball plays, dead bats in that field create unrealistic outcomes to the "correct" baseball actions.
Had they "layed off" most would've struck out in 3-4 pitches looking.
Posted on 6/19/13 at 11:03 pm to OldManRiver
I had this discussion with my fellow baseball coaches today. In theory it sounds good, practicing NOT hitting a certain pitch. But when I thought about it more. It can lead to improper thinking.
If you go up to the plate thinking, "Don't swing at the high one," you're still thinking about "the high one."
Now, if you go up to the plate thinking, "Nothing above my hands," that's a better approach.
Now I've never played collegiate baseball, and I don't have the slightest clue what the LSU batters were thinking, but I do know a thing or two about sport psychology. Just my two cents.
If you go up to the plate thinking, "Don't swing at the high one," you're still thinking about "the high one."
Now, if you go up to the plate thinking, "Nothing above my hands," that's a better approach.
Now I've never played collegiate baseball, and I don't have the slightest clue what the LSU batters were thinking, but I do know a thing or two about sport psychology. Just my two cents.
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