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re: Why aren't more conservatives in education?
Posted on 3/30/17 at 8:44 am to boogiewoogie1978
Posted on 3/30/17 at 8:44 am to boogiewoogie1978
my experience is there's an alignment with the disciplines. STEM and the business schools tend to be far more conservative as they deal will actual data and structured thought. Making money in a business or flying to the moon has nothing to do with how you feel.
1
Posted on 3/30/17 at 8:47 am to NIH
quote:
The amount of oil field and industrial baws I know who live with their parents and spend all their money on trucks and hunting would shame your take.
I wouldn't think that to be a social American norm.
I believe everyone would agree that there is a social norm throughout America that males are expected to provided and fend for themselves at a much earlier age than females.
Posted on 3/30/17 at 8:49 am to ndtiger
quote:
Those that can...do. Those that can't....teach.
this is obviously utter bullshite.
and i had great non-lib profs at LSU. They've been slowly replaced with libs I'm sure.
One of my best friends is teaching five (5) courses at UGA right now and is definitely not a liberal (or a scientist or engineer).
I gave up on the idea of academia a long time ago, and not due to some dumb "can/do" meme. I just could not see myself dealing with fringe liberals who teach their ideas as though they are mainstream thought.
Posted on 3/30/17 at 8:53 am to theCrusher
quote:
STEM and the business schools tend to be far more conservative as they deal will actual data and structured thought.
Wait---I know we are not running with the "Conservatives live off facts and Liberals live off emotions" narrative.
Especially not from the minds of the ppl that live in a constant "conspiracy theory everywhere" world and the "alternative facts" vantage point.
Posted on 3/30/17 at 8:55 am to boogiewoogie1978
So now that we've gotten that "can't do" catch phrase out of the way a handful of times, I'll give you my perspective as a centrist conservative in higher education.
A) Yes, there are a ton of people who fit the "can't do = teach" paradigm that y'all have already noted. And they are a problem for my profession
B) But there are also a ton of people who don't fit that description at all. I know that I could make more money on the private market, not even close. But I choose to be an educator for a few reasons that, for me personally, I find more valuable than money.
First and foremost amongst them is that I think that what I do genuinely matters. I believe that a more educated society is objectively better off than a worse educated one (see my sig quote), and I want to be a part of making the world marginally better. This is one thing that unites myself and many of my liberal colleagues. We do hold a degree of idealism about the value of education and we feel an internal reward when we help others achieve it. One reason there tends to be a disproportionate number of liberals to conservatives is that the "bleeding hearts" tend to be the ones who feel this internal reward to the largest degree. Further, the typical paradigm of our society is that progressives are the ones who tend to want the world to change quickly while conservatives tend to want the world to change slowly. Given that education is an objectively effective means to enact large-scale change, it's not surprising that a lot of idealistic progressives naturally gravitate to the profession.
All this said, I'll reiterate a common pitch of mine that more conservatives need to get involved in higher education. Liberal dominance of the field is a real problem and many students are getting terribly skewed educations as a result. But until more conservatives choose to be a part of the solution, this reality will only continue on it's current path
A) Yes, there are a ton of people who fit the "can't do = teach" paradigm that y'all have already noted. And they are a problem for my profession
B) But there are also a ton of people who don't fit that description at all. I know that I could make more money on the private market, not even close. But I choose to be an educator for a few reasons that, for me personally, I find more valuable than money.
First and foremost amongst them is that I think that what I do genuinely matters. I believe that a more educated society is objectively better off than a worse educated one (see my sig quote), and I want to be a part of making the world marginally better. This is one thing that unites myself and many of my liberal colleagues. We do hold a degree of idealism about the value of education and we feel an internal reward when we help others achieve it. One reason there tends to be a disproportionate number of liberals to conservatives is that the "bleeding hearts" tend to be the ones who feel this internal reward to the largest degree. Further, the typical paradigm of our society is that progressives are the ones who tend to want the world to change quickly while conservatives tend to want the world to change slowly. Given that education is an objectively effective means to enact large-scale change, it's not surprising that a lot of idealistic progressives naturally gravitate to the profession.
All this said, I'll reiterate a common pitch of mine that more conservatives need to get involved in higher education. Liberal dominance of the field is a real problem and many students are getting terribly skewed educations as a result. But until more conservatives choose to be a part of the solution, this reality will only continue on it's current path
This post was edited on 3/30/17 at 9:00 am
Posted on 3/30/17 at 8:57 am to The_Duke
quote:
STEM and the business schools tend to be far more conservative as they deal will actual data and structured thought.
Wait---I know we are not running with the "Conservatives live off facts and Liberals live off emotions" narrative.
Especially not from the minds of the ppl that live in a constant "conspiracy theory everywhere" world and the "alternative facts" vantage point.
In some ways, STEM and business disciplines are more conservative simply because of the nature of the subject matter. STEM concentrations tend to attract left-brained individuals with a more logical train of thought and analytical approaches to problems. Humanities and Social Sciences focus on non-empirical disciplines in which "truth" is culturally relative. Sometimes the stereotypes are true.
This post was edited on 3/30/17 at 8:59 am
Posted on 3/30/17 at 8:58 am to The_Duke
quote:
Wait---I know we are not running with the "Conservatives live off facts and Liberals live off emotions" narrative.
Especially not from the minds of the ppl that live in a constant "conspiracy theory everywhere" world and the "alternative facts" vantage point.
Posted on 3/30/17 at 9:00 am to boogiewoogie1978
Thread not going as planned?
Posted on 3/30/17 at 9:13 am to BBONDS25
quote:
Thread not going as planned?
Planned? I legitimately wanted to know why. The consensus I got was it doesn't pay enough, not wanting to work it that political climate, and not able or wanting to attend college.
I understand these reasons but don't understand all of the bitching. If you don't want to get involved and make a change then stop complaining.
Posted on 3/30/17 at 9:21 am to McLemore
quote:
I gave up on the idea of academia a long time ago, and not due to some dumb "can/do" meme. I just could not see myself dealing with fringe liberals who teach their ideas as though they are mainstream thought.
I listened to the CSpan/Q&A interview of Thomas Sowell last Sunday. The bolded in your assessment is exactly what he said.
There is the Theoretical Ideal...and there is Reality. Libs serve the Ideal. Just like Jesus was the Ideal, he told them that follow him to "turn your cheek" and "love your enemies". But us Realists know that if we did such...the very Philosophical/Theological Idea of Jesus would cease to exist...because the enemies of said Idea...would censor it. With violent means if necessary.
The Government regulates Public Education. The Government Bureaucracy/Courts have been stacked to serve the Global Authoritarian Socialist Ideal...Secular Egalitarian version. As a most simple example, the qualifiers of an anti-Egalitarian Model (based on reality/merit) have been abandoned, and standards of behavior and true learning have been thrown aside as 'hurtful'...and the relative learning environment of the class room has deteriorated accordingly. A lot of good folk who would love to teach...abandon such because they are scared for their own welfare as they are expected to discipline students who are effectively...psychotic and/or sociopathic dangers to all whom the interact with.
"Behold, there is a way that seemeth right unto man, but the end thereof is destruction". Qualifiers and standards MUST be maintained. There is a judgment/qualifier 'gate'/fence around 'Heaven'...for good reason.
Posted on 3/30/17 at 9:23 am to GumboPot
quote:
Why aren't their more liberals in engineering, hard science, math, technology and business?
There are a ton of liberals in math and science, both in academia and industry.
Posted on 3/30/17 at 9:25 am to The Easter Bunny
quote:
There are a ton of liberals in environmental science, both in academia and industry.
Most of the Math/Physics/Chemistry profs at my university are either foreigners or unaffected traditional conservatives.
Posted on 3/30/17 at 9:39 am to boogiewoogie1978
quote:
keep reading the schools run by liberals complaints but I can't figure out why there aren't more conservatives in education.
What is the reason for this?
Simple really. the education courses in colleges are taught by liberals who dont tolerate conservative students, and word gets around and so conservative students don't even enter the schools of education, so they can't enter the field.
I mean if you were a conservative 18 year old and you knew that the professors would hate every thing about your beliefs and make that hate known, would YOU take their classes?
Same can be said for journalism , by the way.
Posted on 3/30/17 at 9:41 am to The Baker
quote:
One of the biggest mistakes I've made was revealing my conservative POV in graduate school.
Came here to post this.
They are out there. But if they want to remain employed, they keep their trap shut.
Posted on 3/30/17 at 9:42 am to 50_Tiger
quote:
People who can DO don't teach.
Reminds me of something I've heard all my life: Those that can, do. Those that can't, teach.
Posted on 3/30/17 at 9:43 am to boogiewoogie1978
Professors teach less than 3 classes per semester, are only required to have one hour of office hours, and publish semi-meaningless research in their colleague's journal. They choose academia because of the lifestyle it affords them. Not a bad gig, really.
Posted on 3/30/17 at 9:46 am to boogiewoogie1978
quote:
Why aren't more conservatives in education?
Why aren't there more Christians in ISIS?
Posted on 3/30/17 at 9:47 am to boogiewoogie1978
It's the money. Teachers don't make enough of it.
Posted on 3/30/17 at 10:01 am to HeyHeyHogsAllTheWay
quote:
Simple really. the education courses in colleges are taught by liberals who dont tolerate conservative students, and word gets around and so conservative students don't even enter the schools of education, so they can't enter the field.
I mean if you were a conservative 18 year old and you knew that the professors would hate every thing about your beliefs and make that hate known, would YOU take their classes?
Same can be said for journalism , by the way.
You just spent 5 minutes typing a whole bunch of words that amount to nothing more than dog shite. No professor pre-judges your Calculus, Organic chemistry, Physics, Anatomy, English etc test questions on whether or not you are a 2nd amendment holy rolling gun nut who hate's Muslims and think black ppl are lazy. You either got the question right or you got wrong on the test--that's it. Students who believe in climate change do not receive more points on a test than a student who believe in trickle-down economics.
Graduate school is the only place where you get into the more nuanced Socratic discussion where your thoughts prevail more so than a right or wrong answer.
This post was edited on 3/30/17 at 10:04 am
Posted on 3/30/17 at 10:04 am to The_Duke
quote:
You just spent 5 minutes typing a whole bunch of words that amount to nothing more than dog shite. No professor pre-judges your Calculus, Organic chemistry, Physics, Anatomy, English etc test questions on whether or not you are a 2nd amendment holy rolling gun nut who hate's Muslims and think black ppl are lazy. You either got the question right or you got wrong on the test--that's it. Students who believe in climate change do not receive more points on a test than a student who believes trickle-down economics worked.
Graduate school is the only place where you get into the more nuanced Socratic discussion where your thoughts prevail more so than a right or wrong answer.
Yeah right, you've obviously never set foot on a college campus if you believe that.
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