re: The Left's new attack on the death penalty: 8 in 11 days is traumatic for executioners

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While I think all of this is utter nonsense, it's one of the main reasons I'm in favor of getting rid of the death penalty. I'm tired of fighting over it.

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It isn't utter nonsense that ARkansas can't find volunteers to witness the execution...which means most states will change the requirement and start doing them under the cloak of darkness.

I grew up in Cobb County Georgia, a bastion of conservatives since the 40's when they were all employed by the federal governmet at lockheed (nothing makes a person a republican quicker than a big old fat government paycheck). When I moved from Georgia in 2006 Cobb County had never sentenced a person to the death penalty...the country overwhemingly supported the death penalty...they just couldn't bring themselves to do it ...and that is the case here. As we kill more and more people and more and more evidence comes out as to just how truly fricked up our criminal justice system is there will be more and more cobb county type juries around the country...all for the death penalty except when they have the throw the switch....

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Long before Christianity existed, there were laws against murder. To attribute any good act by a non-Christian as plagiarizing Christianity's morality is both insulting and historically inaccurate. I mean, it's even historically inaccurate within Christianity - the Jewish faith had laws against it long before Jesus made it here.

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The Jewish faith prior to Jesus is part of Christian history.

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Long before Christianity existed, there were laws against murder. To attribute any good act by a non-Christian as plagiarizing Christianity's morality is both insulting and historically inaccurate.

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See it from my perspective (the Biblical narrative), please. The Bible claims to be the word of God and describes God's working in history. The Bible says that God created mankind and communicated directly with him for a time. Man rebelled against God and lost that direct communication when they were kicked out from His presence. Man then went on to pervert the knowledge of God for thousands of years without any direct revelation from Him. The former knowledge of God was passed down but corrupted and people worshiped other gods instead, giving them the attributes collectively of the one, true God. These people still had the law of God written on their hearts just as all men today do, but they suppressed the truth and perverted it, just like people today do.

Fast forward to Abraham (then called Abram). Abraham was in a society that worshiped other gods that were a perversion of the truth. God reached out to Abraham and used him to make a new nation for himself that He would communicate with again, teaching them about Himself and what He requires of His people (the law) later through Moses. The nation of Israel was born (through Jacob, Abraham's grandson) and the specific worship of the true God (Yahweh) was called Judaism.

From that recounting, the truth was always there but it was rejected and perverted by man for years until God created a nation for Himself. Since the moral law of God is a reflection of His eternal and unchanging character, that law reflects what is eternal. It existed before Jesus was incarnated as a man on earth; it existed before the 10 commandments were given to Moses; it existed before Abraham was chosen by God; it existed before the other nations perverted the knowledge of the true God and His law; and it existed even before God made mankind. Therefore, since Christians believe in an eternal morality given by an eternal law giver, it's quite consistent for Christians to say that atheists borrow from the Biblical worldview.

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I mean, it's even historically inaccurate within Christianity - the Jewish faith had laws against it long before Jesus made it here

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To summarize the long-winded explanation I just provided, I'll say this:

-Christians believe the Bible is the word of God
-The Bible teaches that the moral law is a reflection of the character of God
-The Bible teaches that God is eternal and unchanging
-If the Bible is true, the moral law of God must therefore be eternal and unchanging

If what the Christian believes is true, the atheist is borrowing from the Christian worldview, which is found in the Bible. It doesn't matter when Jesus came to earth or what year Abraham was called by God if the Bible speaks the truth about God's eternal and unchanging character which is reflected in the moral law of God, which is imprinted on the hearts of all men.

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That is reality that I've observed.

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As have I, which I believe proves my point that an atheistic understanding of morality is prone to change, frequently, if not constantly. That's why I'm always curious to understand why someone who holds to moral subjectivity would condemn anyone for acting in accordance to their own moral code. It's irrational, if I may say so.

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I've never been able to wrap my head around an objective morality. I took classes in high school (Catholic) that tried to argue it but it just does not make sense to me.Homosexuals are accepted in certain cultures around the world today. Maybe tomorrow they will be fed to lions and christians will lead the persecution. Three hundred years from now maybe religion will be outlawed then years later there will be a revival. Morals are constantly changing is my opinion.

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My point is that in an atheistic worldview, morality will constantly change because it is subjective. It's to be expected to change because there is no objective moral standard of right and wrong outside of the axiom "might makes right". Therefore, "morality" as a system of acceptable and unacceptable behaviors as defined by one individual or group is only applicable where that particular version may be enforced.

Where is the justification for imposing our moral standard in the West on the Middle East or in Africa or Asia? How can we confidently say that our way is the right way when there is no right or wrong way? How do we justify condemning Adolf Hitler, Saddam Hussein, Boko Haram, Mao Zedong, or ISIS for what they do to their own people when they are just enforcing their own moral standard as best as they can, just like we are?

In an atheistic worldview, there is no "right" way, so if you like your standard better than others (at that particular time, at least) then you can either keep it to yourself or you can try to force it on others, just like other cultures and nations do, but you cannot legitimately condemn anyone else for their own standard. It would be like getting in an argument over the "best" flavor of ice cream and trying to force other people to admit that chocolate is best.

The application to this is that atheists really don't have an objective reason to judge anyone else. You can't say I'm "wrong" or "evil" for saying homosexuality is sinful and you can't judge ISIS as "wrong" or "evil" for lopping off heads of children for not converting to Islam. Why? Because there is no universal standard to judge right and wrong and there cannot be "evil" if there is no standard for good and bad. Your moral code has no greater validity than anyone else's moral code.

As I've said before, if you are an atheist, you have no basis for judging anything I believe, but as a Christian, I have a basis for judging what you believe.

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See it from my perspective (the Biblical narrative), please

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I am well aware of your perspective. I see no reason to dive head first into yours while being dismissive of others.

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-If the Bible is true, the moral law of God must therefore be eternal and unchanging

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Exodus 21:2
2 When you buy a Hebrew slave,[a] he shall serve six years, and in the seventh he shall go out free, for nothing

Exodus 21:17
“Whoever curses[c] his father or his mother shall be put to death.

Leviticus 25:44
'Your male and female slaves are to come from the nations around you; from them you may buy slaves.


I hope it's changeable.