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Message
re: Louisiana is trying to get rid of the death penalty
Posted on 4/10/18 at 2:53 pm to ShortyRob
Posted on 4/10/18 at 2:53 pm to ShortyRob
Mind you, I am NOT saying that I have a moral problem with the death penalty.
If I personally could guarantee the govt wouldn't frick it up and it would always get it right and it would be meted out in a somewhat non-haphazard way........I'd be like, "fry the frickers!".
In fact, I'd want it MORE painful.
But, our govt PLUS our juries are EXTREMELY error prone.
If I personally could guarantee the govt wouldn't frick it up and it would always get it right and it would be meted out in a somewhat non-haphazard way........I'd be like, "fry the frickers!".
In fact, I'd want it MORE painful.
But, our govt PLUS our juries are EXTREMELY error prone.
0
Posted on 4/10/18 at 2:58 pm to ShortyRob
My point is that the kinds of shitbags who deserve the death penalty tend to collect lawyers who seek out the worst of the worst to represent in constitutional law cases so they can get famous.
Even the ones of them who get LWOP tend to find lawyers who will fight every step of the way and eventually get them sprung on a technicality.
Even the ones of them who get LWOP tend to find lawyers who will fight every step of the way and eventually get them sprung on a technicality.
Posted on 4/10/18 at 3:01 pm to ShortyRob
quote:
..........but oh, we should have the death penalty".
Well we have the death penalty because of it's constitutional origin. The framers were well aware of it in 1791 and the Eighth Amend. didn't abrogate it. Shouldn't that matter, at least a little bit?
But then again, I might be speaking to an irrelevant point.
Posted on 4/10/18 at 3:06 pm to teke184
quote:
My point is that the kinds of shitbags who deserve the death penalty tend to collect lawyers who seek out the worst of the worst to represent in constitutional law cases so they can get famous.
Ya know what would make those lawyers not give a frick anymore about such people unless they had legit cases?
quote:
Even the ones of them who get LWOP tend to find lawyers who will fight every step of the way and eventually get them sprung on a technicality.
I mean. Not for nothin, but, if a person can "get out on a technicality", then he probably shouldn't be in line to be fried.
Look. I get it. This means that some guilty people won't get fried that we ALL(including me) really would like to fry.
But, we get shite wrong WAY too often in our court system to be frying people.
Moreover, we can't sit here and pretend juries aren't affected by shite that has ZERO to do with guilt or innocence. Now, I know you're gonna think race.
But, let's be honest. Dude that looks like
Has a MUCH better shot before a jury than dude that looks like
Posted on 4/10/18 at 3:08 pm to JoeBock
quote:
Well we have the death penalty because of it's constitutional origin. The framers were well aware of it in 1791 and the Eighth Amend. didn't abrogate it. Shouldn't that matter, at least a little bit?
They allowed for it, yes.
They didn't exactly mandate it. So, I have no problem saying that experience with our govt tells me it's a bad idea.
Again. I'm just fascinated that we trust the govt on this. How the frick do we trust the govt and juries on this?
Step aside from the simple desire to kill the bad guy. I absolutely SHARE that desire.
Tell me why the frick you think the govt can be trusted to the level of success one would actually want when deciding to kill people?
Posted on 4/10/18 at 3:09 pm to kingbob
quote:Compare today's murder legal process to 1933 when Giuseppe Zangara attempted to assassinate President-elect Franklin Roosevelt on February 15, 1933 in Miami, FL.
It takes like 30 years to put someone to death.
His shots missed Roosevelt but one of his bullets hit the mayor of Chicago, Anton Cermak, who was with Roosevelt and who died from his wounds on March 6.
Zangara was tried for murder, found guilty, sentenced to death and was executed on March 20, 1933.....33 days after the shooting.
Posted on 4/10/18 at 3:12 pm to BlackHelicopterPilot
quote:
Louisiana is trying to get rid of the death penalty
What value is the death penalty, if an infamous criminal like Patrick Kennedy can't be executed for the horrifying rape of a young girl?
Posted on 4/10/18 at 3:20 pm to ShortyRob
quote:
They allowed for it, yes.
They didn't exactly mandate it. So, I have no problem saying that experience with our govt tells me it's a bad idea.
Again. I'm just fascinated that we trust the govt on this. How the frick do we trust the govt and juries on this?
Step aside from the simple desire to kill the bad guy. I absolutely SHARE that desire.
Tell me why the frick you think the govt can be trusted to the level of success one would actually want when deciding to kill people?
I don't necessarily have an opinion on the issue. But If the People think the law should be changed, then there's a prescribed process in order to do so.
Posted on 4/10/18 at 3:22 pm to ShortyRob
When I talk about this stuff, I am typically referring to the Hurricane Carters and Wilbert Rideaus of the world.
Carter got convicted in two separate trials and when the second trial was overturned in 1985, he wasn’t tried for a third time because it was near impossible to hold a trial 22 years after the crime.
Rideau was convicted and sentenced to death, which was commuted to LWOP after the death penalty was ruled unconstitutional in 1972. He ended up getting four trials, all convictions, though the conviction in the fourth was for the lesser charge of manslaughter which was declared as “time served” since he had been in prison for 44 years.
My point is that a cause celebre prisoner will keep getting bites at the apple until he’s released unless he ends up executed first.
Commuting their sentence from death to LWOP just lowers the stakes for the defense as they can keep fighting until the prisoner wins or dies of natural causes.
Carter got convicted in two separate trials and when the second trial was overturned in 1985, he wasn’t tried for a third time because it was near impossible to hold a trial 22 years after the crime.
Rideau was convicted and sentenced to death, which was commuted to LWOP after the death penalty was ruled unconstitutional in 1972. He ended up getting four trials, all convictions, though the conviction in the fourth was for the lesser charge of manslaughter which was declared as “time served” since he had been in prison for 44 years.
My point is that a cause celebre prisoner will keep getting bites at the apple until he’s released unless he ends up executed first.
Commuting their sentence from death to LWOP just lowers the stakes for the defense as they can keep fighting until the prisoner wins or dies of natural causes.
Posted on 4/10/18 at 3:50 pm to NYNolaguy1
Why are you taking the stance that Louisiana is a trigger happy state looking to kill people?
If they have been to trial, SOLID evidence was heard, convicted by a jury, etc., there is no reason to sit on death-row for decades. Put them to death.
I don't know what tangent you're on.
If they have been to trial, SOLID evidence was heard, convicted by a jury, etc., there is no reason to sit on death-row for decades. Put them to death.
I don't know what tangent you're on.
Posted on 4/10/18 at 3:53 pm to glassman
quote:
The Catholic Church and I share the same view.
Do you also believe there is no Hell?
I'll stick with the Bible on matters of the death penalty and Hell. The Catholic church should try doing the same.
Posted on 4/10/18 at 3:54 pm to The Boat
Honestly, they could easily get rid of it by changing the statutes for each law that carries it as a possible sentence.
Posted on 4/10/18 at 3:57 pm to glassman
quote:
The only way a human life should be taken is in self defense
Supporters of the Death Penalty would claim that it is society's defense against monsters. I've personally always been against it because how could I justify the instituion if it is found an innocent man was put to death....it has happened. But on a practical level, we had a very functional death penalty through the 1980's and 1990's and the murder rate was unchanged or went up...I don't see its effectiveness....It does not save money because of he appeals and overall, whenever we executed someone, there were always a bunch of willing/qualified candidates o replace them on death row.
It just satisfies some people's bloodlust and I'm not speaking of the victims.
Posted on 4/10/18 at 3:58 pm to pwejr88
quote:
If they have been to trial, SOLID evidence was heard, convicted by a jury, etc., there is no reason to sit on death-row for decades. Put them to death.
I don't know what tangent you're on.
You have much more faith in Louisianas public servants and the average juror (
) than I do. I guess you think they are more about going after guilt than convictions, and more about the truth than their reputations. Its like you think every politician is out for greed and cronyism except the prosecutors who send people to jail for a living. Theres no way they would ever do anything shady
.Posted on 4/10/18 at 4:01 pm to NYNolaguy1
quote:
I always find it interesting that so many "small govt conservatives" who trust the govt extremely little and assume it full of paid idiots, suddenly has full faith that this same govt will always execute only the guilty.
If the government is willing to cede back a small portion of its monopoly on lethal retributive force, I'd be happy to let them off the hook.
Posted on 4/10/18 at 4:23 pm to NYNolaguy1
And once again you add nothing substantive in your opposition to the death penalty.
Posted on 4/10/18 at 4:25 pm to maine82
quote:
It's been over 8 year since we last imposed it.
That's a shame.
Posted on 4/10/18 at 4:26 pm to Joshjrn
quote:
Joshjrn
First one I clicked on:
"No physical or biological evidence linked either man to the murder"
Shouldn't have been on death row.
This post was edited on 4/10/18 at 4:27 pm
Posted on 4/10/18 at 4:27 pm to The Boat
The moment the first innocent man was put to death any support for the penalty should’ve been buried with him. I can’t fathom the mindset of a populace that doesn’t agree.
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