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re: Gun control in Europe is almost total. Hasn't stopped mass shooting attacks like Las Vegas
Posted on 10/4/17 at 9:47 am to Vacherie Saint
Posted on 10/4/17 at 9:47 am to Vacherie Saint
quote:
It's always the same. You don't even understand what you aim to regulate and you sure as hell don't understand why the framers sought to ensure this right.
This is debatable, but I find it interesting that so many "small govt conservatives" fight for the war on drugs because of "public well being", yet totally turn a blind eye when confronted with thousands of gun deaths a year.
To be clear I am not asking anyone to turn in their private arsenals, but the lack of conversation about it is interesting, especially when "public safety" is paramount in one policy, yet ignored in another.
2
Posted on 10/4/17 at 9:50 am to cajunangelle
quote:
I beluieve you are missing the overall point. The UK has banned guns and knives. The last I heard you could only have a gun or use one at the shooting range-- as you left you turned the gun in.
Thats not completely true. Hunting, skeet, trap, etc is still common there.
Aside from that, why ignore the fact that those countries have a small fraction of the gun deaths we do, but point out that gun control laws dont work for only mass shootings?
Posted on 10/4/17 at 9:51 am to NYNolaguy1
Your argument assumes that "thousands of gun deaths" won't turn into "thousands of knife deaths" or "thousands of hammer deaths" once you get your precious gun ban.
I think CA has demonstrably shot that argument to shite within the first page of this thread.
And for what it's worth, a well armed populous is perhaps the best mechanism the constitution has given us to maintain small government. Take a hard look at places with gun bans and you will consistently find massive, power hungry governments and people with limited freedom.
I think CA has demonstrably shot that argument to shite within the first page of this thread.
And for what it's worth, a well armed populous is perhaps the best mechanism the constitution has given us to maintain small government. Take a hard look at places with gun bans and you will consistently find massive, power hungry governments and people with limited freedom.
Posted on 10/4/17 at 9:53 am to SG_Geaux
quote:
Same goes for Australia
Posted on 10/4/17 at 9:55 am to cajunangelle
quote:all four shootings in 2004. wow. four whole shootings
Countries such as France may have made all semi-automatic guns illegal, but that hasn’t stopped killers from getting fully automatic machine guns to use in mass shooting attacks. All four of the 2015 mass public shooting in France involved machine guns, including the 130 people killed in November of that year in multiple attacks including one at a concert venue.
meanwhile in America, we had 371 in 2015, 477 in 2016, and 340 so far in 2017. LINK
but yeah, four in france, frick gun control!
Posted on 10/4/17 at 9:55 am to Lakeboy7
I think if we can kill off nearly all of the blacks like the Australians did, then dig a pacific ocean sized moat around the lower 48, some of those snazzy australian gun control laws might work here!
But you geniuses won't even let us build a wall.
But you geniuses won't even let us build a wall.
Posted on 10/4/17 at 10:02 am to cajunangelle
Let's face it, most of Europe is populated by the off spring guillotine and Inquisition fodder, bubonic plague, and all sorts of upper-class inbreeding.
Not exactly the population sample that one would pick from when engaged in a game of survival...
Not exactly the population sample that one would pick from when engaged in a game of survival...
Posted on 10/4/17 at 10:05 am to Vacherie Saint
quote:
Your argument assumes that "thousands of gun deaths" won't turn into "thousands of knife deaths" or "thousands of hammer deaths" once you get your precious gun ban.
Couple of things:
1)I like guns. I like shooting guns. If I were living in LA I would own one. I have never called for a gun ban.
2)I am a numbers guy. I am not emotional at all about this. So you claim that if there was a "gun ban" here, those deaths would turn into knife deaths. Can you justify that by numbers?
quote:
I think CA has demonstrably shot that argument to shite within the first page of this thread.
Not really, how easy is it to get a gun in say Nevada or Arizona and bring it into Cali?
This post was edited on 10/4/17 at 10:07 am
Posted on 10/4/17 at 10:17 am to Fat Bastard
quote:
is not just those. it is ALL semi autos. EVERYTHING!
Oh... you are 100% correct. There are plenty of illegal guns of all makes and models over there.
Just the AK47s are the ones that make the news it seems.
Posted on 10/4/17 at 10:18 am to NYNolaguy1
quote:
am a numbers guy. I am not emotional at all about this. So you claim that if there was a "gun ban" here, those deaths would turn into knife deaths. Can you justify that by numbers?
So the presence of a gun is what motivates a man to kill? Was there a gun in the glove box in Barcelona? Mexico traffics guns illegally over the border by the thousands and there are already some 300 million guns in the us. A gun ban is fricking laughable.
Maybe you are willing to cede much of your freedom for what you think is security. Security brought to you by government. I am not. I'm also smart enough to know that tyrannical governments have killed millions of their own people frequently throughout history. Our country was born of English tyranny. I'm smart enough to see, in my travels, that police can be shockingly unreliable throughout the world and that pattern is starting to show here. I understand the risk of these guns as sure as I understand the risk of getting in my car everyday and driving my kids to school. I accept those risks as I accept the ultimate responsibility to protect myself and my family from ANY threat.
Posted on 10/4/17 at 10:24 am to Tridentds
quote:
Correct. AK47s are illegal in France, UK, etc... Terrorist get them easily.
Actually both of those countries' supreme courts declared it was unconstitutional to take away a rapefugee's ak47 because that infringes on his ability to practice Islam
Posted on 10/4/17 at 10:28 am to Vacherie Saint
quote:
So the presence of a gun is what motivates a man to kill?
No, it just improves his efficiency at it.
quote:
Was there a gun in the glove box in Barcelona?
Nope, but now you're changing the subject of our discussion. My original comment was that gun control policies in Europe dont deter terrorists, but do prevent civilian gun deaths. This is easily backed up by statistics.
quote:
Mexico traffics guns illegally over the border by the thousands and there are already some 300 million guns in the us. A gun ban is fricking laughable.
Who is calling for a gun ban? If you think that person is me, can you provide a link or quote please?
quote:
Maybe you are willing to cede much of your freedom for what you think is security. Security brought to you by government. I am not. I'm also smart enough to know that tyrannical governments have killed millions of their own people frequently throughout history. Our country was born of English tyranny. I'm smart enough to see, in my travels, that police can be shockingly unreliable throughout the world and that pattern is starting to show here. I understand the risk of these guns as sure as I understand the risk of getting in my car everyday and driving my kids to school. I accept those risks as I accept the ultimate responsibility to protect myself and my family from ANY threat.
Thats fine and all, but the population who thinks like this is ironically in favor of the big brother and nanny state 100% of the time if their party tells them to. I find it ironic that so many peolle who heavily favor the 2nd amendment also favor uncle sam in the war on drugs or the growth of the surveillance state, and ultimately peoples right to privacy.
Posted on 10/4/17 at 10:30 am to boogiewoogie1978
quote:
I'm all for owning guns but nobody needs a damn AR 15 for any purpose.
Good thing your opinion doesn't matter.
Posted on 10/4/17 at 10:35 am to NYNolaguy1
Don't address me like I'm some stereotypical conservative charactature you've created in your mind. It cheapens your argument. I'm pretty pure of heart on all forms of government overreach, I loathe the surveillance state, the war on drugs and other vice crimes, and the death penalty.
And as for the gun ban comment, once again, stop pretending that this isn't the lefts end game. We can't have any honest conversations about the subject while the left pretends it only wants a few "common sense" laws. It's bullshite and everyone knows it.
And as for the gun ban comment, once again, stop pretending that this isn't the lefts end game. We can't have any honest conversations about the subject while the left pretends it only wants a few "common sense" laws. It's bullshite and everyone knows it.
Posted on 10/4/17 at 10:40 am to Vacherie Saint
quote:
And as for the gun ban comment, once again, stop pretending that this isn't the lefts end game. We can't have any honest conversations about the subject while the left pretends it only wants a few "common sense" laws. It's bullshite and everyone knows it.
Fair enough.
If you havent figured it out yet, I was once on the GOP band wagon, but have since migrated over to the libertarian side once I realized "small govt" was never a goal of the GOP. I just wish more people were consistent with their views, and that they thought for themselves. I think we both agree that could be said for both sides of the aisle.
Posted on 10/4/17 at 10:42 am to boogiewoogie1978
quote:
I'm all for owning guns but nobody needs a damn AR 15 for any purpose.
Better ban sports cars then too .... because nobody needs a damn sports car either.
Posted on 10/4/17 at 11:53 am to NYNolaguy1
In the UK only air guns (BB Guns) are allowed to hunt.
quote:
You must have permission from the land owner.
Firearms and shotgun certificates
You must get a certificate to use a shotgun, rifle or other firearm.
You don’t need a certificate for:
air rifles up to 12ft lb in power
air pistols up to 6ft lb in power
You can’t use:
bows or crossbows
explosives (other than the legal ammunition for a firearm)
LINK
Posted on 10/4/17 at 11:56 am to cajunangelle
Exactly not like bad guys and terrorist follow gun laws.
Posted on 10/4/17 at 11:56 am to NYNolaguy1
quote:False equivalence. One doesn't have an enumerated right to drugs. Nor do drugs protect our freedom. And most of all... illegal drug use is FAR more prevalent and damaging to society than mass shootings.
This is debatable, but I find it interesting that so many "small govt conservatives" fight for the war on drugs because of "public well being", yet totally turn a blind eye when confronted with thousands of gun deaths a year.
Posted on 10/4/17 at 11:57 am to cajunangelle
Wrong
/cdn.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_asset/file/9371299/gun_homicides_per_capita.jpg)
While shootings do happen in other countries...the sheer frequency of them is the problem in the United States.
Nice try though.
While shootings do happen in other countries...the sheer frequency of them is the problem in the United States.
Nice try though.
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