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Posted on 11/18/16 at 7:42 pm to inadaze
Thinking that one's opinion is the absolute "right" one in topics as multi-faceted as this is unrealistic, idealistic bullshite. It doesn't matter if it's Jemele Hill or Christians or a Subway sandwich artist.
Posted on 11/18/16 at 10:41 pm to Sun God
quote:
in topics as multi-faceted as this
I don't see that specific topics have been established, so it seems we're just talking generally/open-endedly.
2 questions:
1. Are you a nihilist?
2. Are you familiar with how the 'Insanity Defense' is defined?
(I'm just attempting to get you to be more clear and specific. I'm not necessarily disagreeing with you.)
Posted on 11/18/16 at 11:06 pm to SlowFlowPro
i don't mean to go off track here, but ESPN has driven me crazy with everything being a freaking list. Rankings of players and teams in All Time Lists, mind numbing discussions on players' "legacies," all this bullshite. It all started at ESPN and it's out of control. They influence selections of teams for the playoff with their coined, "Eye Test" bullshite, circumventing statistical data, have absolutely ruined the Heisman Trophy Award and what started out as a neat thing, The Espys, has turned into a shite show. I pray Fox, or someone else sinks money into their Sports Broadcasting and knocks these assholes off their throne.
Oh, and that Jemelle idiot is a waste of human life.
Oh, and that Jemelle idiot is a waste of human life.
Posted on 11/18/16 at 11:50 pm to Dubosed
quote:
I work in the sun all day. Have for 30 years. I loved coming home popping open a beer and watching highlights on ESPN. Not any more. It's all idiots with insane opinions with zero consequence. frick them
Same here. From May until today to be exact for three years, I'm in the excruciating Georgia sun multiple days a week and I work 14-18 hours a day. Only difference is I'm surrounded by radical hardcore liberals and it's insufferable because I can't say a damn word in fear of being booted and blacklisted from this industry. I make great money and I really don't have to work again from now until May and it's a once in a lifetime opportunity... BUT there are literally NO republicans in sight and there are times when it's so hard to keep quiet and the shite I hear daily is almost unbearable to the point where it's not even worth it. The irony is knowing these people are fleeing California by the dozens to work in Georgia due to the Republican tax breaks....
I never knew ESPN switched to the left as literally the only time I ever watch ANY ESPN station is on Saturdays during CFB season, but it really doesn't surprise me. If this is truly the case, then I won't bother spending any money or tuning in to anything ESPN related anymore.
As someone else noted, it's a great little escape from reality (especially for those of us who basically spend every waking minute around neo-liberal lunatics) and it's a fricking shame they've infiltrated sporting networks.
Posted on 11/19/16 at 8:50 am to inadaze
quote:
This seems to align with one of the options I mentioned, it's just that you didn't specify which one.
again, naw
quote:
You could easily flip the situation/people around. E.g., conservative christians -- there are lots of people on "the right" who are guided by christian ethics and believe that their views are morally right, and those who oppose certain ways of life are morally wrong.
that's only tangentially related to my point
the point is silencing opposition v. discussion and the exchange of ideas.
this used to be a halmark of the left and over the past 15 years or so they have become JUST like the Evangelicals who believe in silencing and punishing dissent. when i was a young liberal, the Evangelicals were the biggest fear and progs have become that exact type of person
The only true wisdom is in knowing you know nothing
quote:
So, we should be able to agree that there are people on the right and left who do this.
but only one side pretends that inquiry and discovery are part of their political philosophy
conservatism, by its very definition, does not seek out these new methods/thoughts to conserve historical society. liberalism and progressivism seek out new ideas to change society (and they're smug as frick about it). they have become the authoritarians they claim only their enemies are. conservatives who are Evangelical admit the authoritarian nature of their God (and his rules over society)
quote:
Or are you saying that "right and wrong" exist in some way(s), but they are too obscure/indeterminate to discern?
this is irrelevant to my point
what you believe or how you got there is irrelevant. how you handle the exchange of ideas is what i'm discussing
Posted on 11/19/16 at 9:05 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:I was literally just about to post this. Modern "liberals" have become everything that real Liberals fought against.
over the past 15 years or so they have become JUST like the Evangelicals who believe in silencing and punishing dissent. when i was a young liberal, the Evangelicals were the biggest fear and progs have become that exact type of person
I miss real liberals. Couldn't always agree with them, but I could always respect that their goal was to increase freedom.
We need REAL liberals today now more than ever--because both sides now are all about authoritarianism (just differing directions).
Today it's all about taking others down and surpassing them.
This post was edited on 11/19/16 at 9:07 am
Posted on 11/19/16 at 9:09 am to SlowFlowPro
The Prog/Lib virus was injected into the educational system and media over 60 yrs ago and now we have 2-3 generations of Prog/Lib indoctrination......, these anti Trump protests are nothing more than drone attacks.
Just listen to any interview from the participants of the protests and it's clear they have been programmed with every Prog/Lib talking point and headline. Not one protestor can answer a question that challenges their reason for protesting without reverting to "Trump's a xenophobe, misogynist, racists, homophobe, bigot...etc."
Once all those isms and ists words dribble from their mouths they go glassy eyed and fall back into the crowd and continue the drone march.
Just listen to any interview from the participants of the protests and it's clear they have been programmed with every Prog/Lib talking point and headline. Not one protestor can answer a question that challenges their reason for protesting without reverting to "Trump's a xenophobe, misogynist, racists, homophobe, bigot...etc."
Once all those isms and ists words dribble from their mouths they go glassy eyed and fall back into the crowd and continue the drone march.
Posted on 11/19/16 at 9:13 am to Taxing Authority
i'm glad i checked back on this thread b/c it reminded me of a joke i was formulating last night along these lines
basically it goes something like
the problem with liberals today is they're too scared to admit that they may possibly be wrong. they are scared that if you can disprove the wrong Jenga block of their ethos, the whole thing will fall down because they don't have a pre-programmed response that they've been told beforehand and they're not used to engaging in actual discussion anymore. I'm fine with admitting when I'm wrong and I"ve been wrong a lot over my life and that's why I win these discussions. I'll give you a great example of how I used to be wrong. I used to be a liberal.
need to work on shortening the middle (that statement works better as text and not a joke), but yeah
basically it goes something like
the problem with liberals today is they're too scared to admit that they may possibly be wrong. they are scared that if you can disprove the wrong Jenga block of their ethos, the whole thing will fall down because they don't have a pre-programmed response that they've been told beforehand and they're not used to engaging in actual discussion anymore. I'm fine with admitting when I'm wrong and I"ve been wrong a lot over my life and that's why I win these discussions. I'll give you a great example of how I used to be wrong. I used to be a liberal.
need to work on shortening the middle (that statement works better as text and not a joke), but yeah
Posted on 11/19/16 at 9:17 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:yep
The left believes its opinions and feelings are facts; those who disagree are therefore either morons or fascists.
the regressive left
Which is why there is a "new left" forming around people like Dave Rubin, Sam Harris, and others who see the fascist left as completely regressive and incongruent with true liberalism
Posted on 11/19/16 at 9:18 am to Pilot Tiger
yeah i like how they've promoted and popularized that term
Posted on 11/19/16 at 9:37 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
the problem with liberals today is they're too scared to admit that they may possibly be wrong. they are scared that if you can disprove the wrong Jenga block of their ethos, the whole thing will fall down because they don't have a pre-programmed response that they've been told beforehand and they're not used to engaging in actual discussion anymore. I'm fine with admitting when I'm wrong and I"ve been wrong a lot over my life and that's why I win these discussions. I'll give you a great example of how I used to be wrong. I used to be a liberal.
I was once a "liberals liberal". Was born in 1958, somehow I shook off all the drone programming from my 1960's and 70's education. I think my generation was lucky because the drone programming had not been perfected until the late 80's/early 90's so we still possessed free thought. I have actually de-programmed some drones but it takes many sessions of hard hitting political logic and then it does not always work. I have noticed a lot of the drones I interact with have rather short attention spans which tends to make the de-programming efforts even more frustrating........, I vow to not let you drones down, I will not give up on America or my drone friends/acquaintances, I will continue to bathe you in truth and bold thinking whenever the opportunity presents itself.
Posted on 11/19/16 at 11:35 am to SirWinston
quote:
This is where James Schilling and Tebow all need to speak up
His brother Curt should speak up, too.
Posted on 11/21/16 at 7:43 pm to SlowFlowPro
I'll reply to your full post tomorrow. I had a long reply typed out a couple days ago, but I got busy and scrapped it. I'll have more time tomorrow. For now, I'll just try to ask a basic question. What is your basis for determining "right and wrong"? (Or do you not make such determinations?)
Posted on 11/22/16 at 8:57 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
naw
Yaw.
quote:
that's only tangentially related to my point
No, it's not. To be "tangentially related" would mean to be some kind of side commentary, related indirectly, some kind of peripheral issue. It was one example which is applicable to most people in America who call themselves "christians" (Defining that label with everything that generally goes along with it. One could make an argument that there are a lot of phony "christians" and they wouldn't get much argument from me. That doesn't matter to a lot of people because to them being a fricking phony pretty regular. Me, I don't like phonies too much.) What I'm talking about is fundamental to your point.
Tangential note - Christopher Ryan has a podcast called Tangentially Speaking with Dr. Christopher Ryan that I would recommend to anyone who has an interest in sex, psychology, sociology, evolution, and all sorts of interesting topics as the name of the podcast suggests.
The example that I used with "christians" was only meant to show that it definitely goes both ways in terms of right and left politically. And according to most surveys I've seen, Republicans are more religious than Democrats. Party affiliation doesn't account for everyone, but I think you could safely say that people on the right are more dogmatically religious than people on the left, and "right and wrong" goes right along with that.
quote:
the point is silencing opposition v. discussion and the exchange of ideas.
If you're saying this is the point relative to Jemele Hill, I just think it's a weak point. She didn't say anything about 'silencing' anyone. Really, what she said was pretty vague, and could be interpreted in different ways. Does ESPN silence people? Or are some right-wingers scared to speak their minds?
quote:
over the past 15 years or so they have become JUST like the Evangelicals who believe in silencing and punishing dissent.
I disagree. I don't see all that. Sure, you can find some examples here and there, college campuses and whatnot, but I think this gets exaggerated by bitches and complainers.
It's not like all the churches all over America are inviting dissenting views to be heard.
quote:
The only true wisdom is in knowing you know nothing
That's very postmodern of you.
It's a nice quote. I mean, there are all sorts of reasons why people should be less certain about things than they are, and I'm generally in favor of people being less certain about things. But do you live your life by this wisdom?
quote:
but only one side pretends that inquiry and discovery are part of their political philosophy
This is too broad and general to be meaningful, but let's say it were true -- if the "left side" knew that the other side wasn't interested in "inquiry and discovery" then it actually would be reasonable in a number of ways to shut down the "right side" once their static philosophy was explained and understood. But there are all sorts of problems here. First you used the verb "pretends" which seems to say that you think people on the left are not interested in "inquiry and discovery". I don't know where you're trying to go with that. Another big problem is that I can give you so many fricking examples of right-wingers who are extremely interested in "inquiry and discovery". Take Rand Paul for instance. How do you think he would respond if you asked him how he felt about inquiry, discovery, creativity, ingenuity, entrepreneurship, etc.? And you might know many right-wingers who aren't as curious and interested in discoveries as Rand Paul, but most right-wingers survive and thrive with progress made in science, advances made through various discoveries, technological and medical innovation, etc.
quote:
conservatism, by its very definition, does not seek out these new methods/thoughts to conserve historical society.
On some issues, but like I said, they embrace all sorts of changes/progress once they see how it can improve their lives in various ways.
quote:
liberalism and progressivism seek out new ideas to change society (and they're smug as frick about it)
Oh, c'mon. Maybe liberals and progressives are smug sometimes, but in most cases it's probably an appropriate reaction to nonsense.
quote:
conservatives who are Evangelical admit the authoritarian nature of their God (and his rules over society)
I disagree, and these evangelical conservatives generally don't self-describe as "authoritarians".
quote:
this is irrelevant to my point
No, it's fundamental to the point. It is a tough thing to talk about, and I wouldn't have even brought it up, but that's the part you focused on. You can't just ignore that foundational part if you want to focus on "right and wrong".
quote:
what you believe or how you got there is irrelevant.
No, it's not. It is really the most important part. (Especially since we're not dealing with something specific from Jemele Hill here. We're just talking about a vague mention of "right and wrong".)
Posted on 11/22/16 at 9:14 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
yeah i like how they've promoted and popularized that term
Who is "they"?
New Left is a decades-old term. I haven't heard it used by Sam Harris to describe his politics or by people to describe Sam Harris.
By the way, Harris did a podcast with Peter Singer recently and they discussed some of this "right and wrong" stuff.
Waking Up With Sam Harris #48 - What is Moral Progress? (with Peter Singer)
Peter Singer is sometimes demonized by right-wing conspiracy theorists as an "evil globalist" (he mentions his opposition to Donald's trade plans in this podcast on a basis of utilitarianism) or something like that. If those right-wing freaks would take the time to listen to him, they would surely see that he is not deserving of their ridiculous demonization.
Posted on 11/22/16 at 10:45 pm to crash1211
Don't forget Phyllis George
Posted on 11/22/16 at 10:59 pm to PowerTool
quote:
Live sports are the only reason to watch ESPN anymore. It's kind of like losing an old friend, if you watched it a lot when you were younger.
That is so true ... and well stated.
It was such the bomb when it launched ... and now they have finally fricked it up.
Let's not forget what happened though - which is even more mind boggling to some of us .... Disney. Disney happened to both ABC and ESPN.
Uncle Walt is twirling in his grave.
Posted on 11/22/16 at 11:07 pm to inadaze
quote:
Peter Singer is sometimes demonized by right-wing conspiracy theorists as an "evil globalist" (he mentions his opposition to Donald's trade plans in this podcast on a basis of utilitarianism) or something like that. If those right-wing freaks would take the time to listen to him, they would surely see that he is not deserving of their ridiculous demonization.
Well you have proven yourself to be a fricking left wing nut so you need someone else to tell us this. Maybe you should make an alter
Posted on 11/22/16 at 11:26 pm to SlowFlowPro
I don't visit their website anymore. And I don't watch any of their programming. I'll only tune in for college football broadcasts. Their liberal bias rivals CNN.
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