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re: AD's just unreal (PER, ortg, drtg, vorp)
Posted on 11/19/14 at 4:19 pm to Galactic Inquisitor
Posted on 11/19/14 at 4:19 pm to Galactic Inquisitor
There's plenty more where that came from. This is from multiple boards, not just PR.
On PR he was actively campaigning against selecting AD. He wanted Thomas Robinson.
He still wasn't admitting he was wrong this summer. GOod times.
On PR he was actively campaigning against selecting AD. He wanted Thomas Robinson.
He still wasn't admitting he was wrong this summer. GOod times.
0
Posted on 11/19/14 at 4:23 pm to TigerinATL
quote:Its interesting how that narrative has changed, especially nationally.
Assuming health I think his floor will be in the same tier with the big name centers of the late 80's to mid 90's. I think his ceiling is probably the next LeBron/Kobe, trying to unseat Jordan. A Pelicans Dynasty would be pretty sweet.
Here's Coach David Thorpe(who I think is probably the best pure "basketball guy" left at espn.com) last night:
quote:Amazing stuff from somebody who truly knows what he's talking about. At 21, Davis is more dominant vs nba players than other nba stars were vs guys working at Wendy's right now.
david b. thorpe @coachthorpe · 17h 17 hours ago
I was lucky enough to coach future NBA stars when they were in high school.A Davis is more dominant now than they were against other preps.
It's domination that is almost hard to swallow, in part because he almost does not even need to sweat. It's like he's playing w children.
It's an enormous mistake to only appreciate his physical talent. His intelligence and emotional IQ are just as much a part of the story.
Pelicans execs should be burning the midnight oil trying to make upgrades in an effort to win now. I mean WIN IT ALL NOW. AD is that good.
What stands out to me is this, though:
quote:In the matter of, what, months? Maybe dating back to the end of last season? The narrative about the Pelicans front office has begun to shift from "they're morons for rushing, RUSHING!!!, the rebuild around Davis. To, they ought to speed it up and try win NOW with him because of how good he is.
Pelicans execs should be burning the midnight oil trying to make upgrades in an effort to win now. I mean WIN IT ALL NOW. AD is that good.
From pairing him with Trey Burke and/or Nerlens Noel(who looks awful right now, btw) being nba twitter's ideal Pelicans' rebuild, to "who can the Pelicans package to win a championship this season?"
Dell basically split the difference, imo.
I'm sure Davis would be pumped to be looking at a another 15 win season with Trey Burke by his side and Dario Saric ready to make an impact in 2017...
This post was edited on 11/19/14 at 4:28 pm
Posted on 11/19/14 at 4:27 pm to eyeran
I realize you never know when you're going to get a chance at the ring, and a year when KD is out and LeBron is adjusting to new surroundings is certainly an opening that won't exist next year, but if AD is this good at 21, doesn't it seem like they have enough time to not cash in any more future assets for present gains? The credit card is kind of maxed out right now.
Posted on 11/19/14 at 4:34 pm to TigerinATL
Yes, now is the time to stop with giving away future assets.
Now its time to start building depth, actually using draft picks, getting young legitimate end of bench talent, assets, cheap veterans looking to win, etc. If you have a chance to add a star then you do it. You never know whats going to fall in your lap.
You've gotten young veteran talent. Now time to shape the roster.
Now its time to start building depth, actually using draft picks, getting young legitimate end of bench talent, assets, cheap veterans looking to win, etc. If you have a chance to add a star then you do it. You never know whats going to fall in your lap.
You've gotten young veteran talent. Now time to shape the roster.
This post was edited on 11/19/14 at 4:35 pm
Posted on 11/19/14 at 4:37 pm to TigerinATL
AD is that good, but I just don't see how we can realistically upgrade the roster this year to even compete for a championship. Maybe Dell can make a move before next season, but everything is pointing to 2016. At that point the Pels would have hopefully made 2 playoff appearances with hopefully a series win or 2.
I have a basic understanding of contracts and the what nots, but am I off base for thinking we just don't have the assets or roster construction to make a legit push at the finals over the next 2 years?
I have a basic understanding of contracts and the what nots, but am I off base for thinking we just don't have the assets or roster construction to make a legit push at the finals over the next 2 years?
Posted on 11/19/14 at 4:39 pm to eyeran
I don't disagree with what you're saying, but you could easily look at Thorpe's
as an indictment of what they have built around Davis. And it's not like they have many assets worthy of getting much of a return to bring more help.
quote:
Pelicans execs should be burning the midnight oil trying to make upgrades in an effort to win now. I mean WIN IT ALL NOW.
as an indictment of what they have built around Davis. And it's not like they have many assets worthy of getting much of a return to bring more help.
Posted on 11/19/14 at 4:44 pm to corndeaux
I agree that 2016 looks like a year we should be shooting for.
2 years is a long time in roster construction. You never know if you'll move a Gordon or an Evans for value, strike gold in the draft, etc etc.
2 years is a long time in roster construction. You never know if you'll move a Gordon or an Evans for value, strike gold in the draft, etc etc.
Posted on 11/19/14 at 4:52 pm to corndeaux
quote:True. But, the other option for the Pelicans rebuild wasn't magically having better, more "ready-to-win" players surrounding him. It was the exact oppposite. It was Trey Burke, Noel, Saric etc...much further away from Thrope's "win now" thought process. Or we could have signed Brandon Jennings like Simmons kept screaming...
I don't disagree with what you're saying, but you could easily look at Thorpe's as an indictment of what they have built around Davis. And it's not like they have many assets worthy of getting much of a return to bring more help.
Almost any other way Dell went about it, Davis isn't fighting for a playoff spot this year.
This post was edited on 11/19/14 at 4:55 pm
Posted on 11/19/14 at 4:55 pm to corndeaux
What I think happened is, Demps took a page out of Loomis' book and based this rebuild around the new tv deal that should increase the cap a good bit.
We obtained assets that can be valuable based on their play. We also obtained assets that will be required to build a contender.
As of right now, your core 3 "untouchables" are Ryno, AD, and Asik.
Jrue, Tyreke, and EG are all pieces that can be moved or let expire to improve a team by getting FA acquisitions or assets through trades.
Lets just say the possibility of Tyreke improving his FG%/FT% to his career numbers (38.7->44.4; 65.9->76.4), while keeping his 3pt, ft, apg, and rpg stable.
His numbers would go from 16.1ppg to 18.3ppg.
He'd average: 18.3ppg, 6.5rpg, and 7.0apg, while shooting 44/47/76.
Do I think his 3pt % will stay? Probably not, so I'd say it drops from 47 to somewhere around 39 or less, so drop it down 1-1.5ppg to about 17ppg.
EG may re-sign for a cheaper deal, maybe not. If he doesn't you find a serviceable 3pt specialist (Anthony Morrow-esque) on the market and find that 3&D SF like Ariza who can come in and do his job. AD re-signs for max.
Hell, you might get a biter for Jrue or Tyreke's contract for a very good SF to build around. The possibilities are very high if the guards continue to improve. Hell, you might just stick with this team and re-sign everyone that is necessary and find some random assets that can contribute/want to play with AD.
We obtained assets that can be valuable based on their play. We also obtained assets that will be required to build a contender.
As of right now, your core 3 "untouchables" are Ryno, AD, and Asik.
Jrue, Tyreke, and EG are all pieces that can be moved or let expire to improve a team by getting FA acquisitions or assets through trades.
Lets just say the possibility of Tyreke improving his FG%/FT% to his career numbers (38.7->44.4; 65.9->76.4), while keeping his 3pt, ft, apg, and rpg stable.
His numbers would go from 16.1ppg to 18.3ppg.
He'd average: 18.3ppg, 6.5rpg, and 7.0apg, while shooting 44/47/76.
Do I think his 3pt % will stay? Probably not, so I'd say it drops from 47 to somewhere around 39 or less, so drop it down 1-1.5ppg to about 17ppg.
EG may re-sign for a cheaper deal, maybe not. If he doesn't you find a serviceable 3pt specialist (Anthony Morrow-esque) on the market and find that 3&D SF like Ariza who can come in and do his job. AD re-signs for max.
Hell, you might get a biter for Jrue or Tyreke's contract for a very good SF to build around. The possibilities are very high if the guards continue to improve. Hell, you might just stick with this team and re-sign everyone that is necessary and find some random assets that can contribute/want to play with AD.
Posted on 11/19/14 at 4:56 pm to eyeran
In retrospect...I think Dell did it mostly right.
If Davis keeps up his pace this year, the Pels make the playoffs, and Davis improves again next year...the summer of 2016 could be pretty interesting.
If Davis keeps up his pace this year, the Pels make the playoffs, and Davis improves again next year...the summer of 2016 could be pretty interesting.
Posted on 11/19/14 at 4:59 pm to htran90
Good post, but I rate Jrue higher than you do.
Posted on 11/19/14 at 5:04 pm to Fun Bunch
quote:
Good post, but I rate Jrue higher than you do.
I personally don't think we will move Jrue. He's borderline untouchable because he does everything you want. Good AST:TO ratio, good vision, good mid-range jumper, and good defense. But in some random universe where you can get Curry or Thompson and they wanted Jrue in part of it, would you?
Posted on 11/19/14 at 5:04 pm to Fun Bunch
quote:
If Davis keeps up his pace this year, the Pels make the playoffs, and Davis improves again next year...the summer of 2016 could be pretty interesting.
A side effect of the Pels making the playoffs this year is that we likely keep our 2015 pick we traded for Asik until it turns into future 2nds in several years. That'd give us another asset to start building depth with.
Posted on 11/19/14 at 5:07 pm to eyeran
quote:
But, the other option for the Pelicans rebuild wasn't magically having better, more "ready-to-win" players surrounding him
Obviously not. It's a longer term plan that includes more losing and more developing.
Just to play devil's advocate here, it may also have created more flexibility to find a 2nd banana now. Who knows?
I like the frontcourt. Not sold on the backcourt- or the unbalanced roster makeup. But the team right now is good enough to get into the playoffs in the Westl that;s pretty damn good. Nothing to complain about. Hope they find a way to improve the roster- it'll be interesting to see what Demps has in mind.
Posted on 11/19/14 at 5:10 pm to Fun Bunch
this guy makes 480 and boom look like Nostradamus.
Posted on 11/19/14 at 5:11 pm to htran90
quote:
s of right now, your core 3 "untouchables" are Ryno, AD, and Asik.
Jrue, Tyreke, and EG are all pieces that can be moved or let expire to improve a team by getting FA acquisitions or assets through trades.
I agree. I just don't think there's much of a market for any of the guards.
Holiday is good, but how many teams are looking for a point guard? 1, 2? Evans has no position and that scares a lot of teams off. And we all know about Gordon....
I fear they might move Anderson since he has the most value. If it's just to move Gordon, I don't think I would like that deal. I unrealistically hope a team with cap space (which will be half the league) whiffs on a FA and takes a one year flier on expiring Gordon.
Either way, resign Asik. Put everyone but AD on the block and see what's out there. If nothing, use Salmons $$ for someone with a pulse, then hope continuity helps, Duncan/Ginobili retire, and Dirk starts to slow down.
Posted on 11/19/14 at 5:13 pm to corndeaux
The rebuild was altered/ruined by EG's contract, but as of right now we can't do anything about it.
It takes away current depth (no one past rivers is of use) and players having to play out of position (tyreke at SF).
We're stuck with him, but if he continues to improve his shooting and is consistent with his defense, I don't see a problem with having him here or re-signing him to a smaller contract and solidify a position that is lacking across the league.
ETA: the reason I say you can't or shouldn't move Ryno is because of two things, AD can be a stretch 4, but why would you make him do that when he is fast enough and dominate enough to play inside. Asik is a defensive stalwart, but he's limited on offense. Ryno complements both pieces and when you have all 3 on the court, this offense can move extremely well.
Unless we're getting Thompson or a 3&D SF for him, I don't want to lose Ryno.
It takes away current depth (no one past rivers is of use) and players having to play out of position (tyreke at SF).
We're stuck with him, but if he continues to improve his shooting and is consistent with his defense, I don't see a problem with having him here or re-signing him to a smaller contract and solidify a position that is lacking across the league.
ETA: the reason I say you can't or shouldn't move Ryno is because of two things, AD can be a stretch 4, but why would you make him do that when he is fast enough and dominate enough to play inside. Asik is a defensive stalwart, but he's limited on offense. Ryno complements both pieces and when you have all 3 on the court, this offense can move extremely well.
Unless we're getting Thompson or a 3&D SF for him, I don't want to lose Ryno.
This post was edited on 11/19/14 at 5:15 pm
Posted on 11/19/14 at 5:14 pm to TigerinATL
quote:
A side effect of the Pels making the playoffs this year is that we likely keep our 2015 pick
This could be really huge for a team whose best hopes this year are to make the playoffs and be competitive in a series.. The only thing that changes for 2015 (aside from resigning Asik) is if Dell does magic(which is a pipe dream) or we pick up a SOLID bench guy who can contribute right away.
Dream mode off [on]
Make the playoffs, keep our pick and steal a guy late in the draft like Kawhi or Butler... League fricked
Posted on 11/19/14 at 5:19 pm to corndeaux
quote:The only reason I wasn't in favor of that Philly model is, you collect more players or assets, but i'm not sure its good for Davis' development(or sanity) to be playing with scrubs for the first 3? 4? 5? years of his career.
Obviously not. It's a longer term plan that includes more losing and more developing.
quote:No doubt the backcourt can be awkward at times, especially with Gordon struggling. He seems to be the guy that gets lost in the shuffle between the three. Even still, its not too bad when EG's knocking down his catch and shoot jumpers(especially 3s), like he was last year.
I like the frontcourt. Not sold on the backcourt- or the unbalanced roster makeup. But the team right now is good enough to get into the playoffs in the Westl that;s pretty damn good. Nothing to complain about. Hope they find a way to improve the roster- it'll be interesting to see what Demps has in mind.
This post was edited on 11/19/14 at 5:34 pm
Posted on 11/19/14 at 5:26 pm to eyeran
whenever EG gets the ball, I notice he looks for AD a good bit. That is the type of ball movement I hope the other two find on a consistent basis. One minute, they're lobbing it or dishing it to AD to dominate. the next 5 possessions, they're playing hero ball.
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