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Defense Lawyers point of view for using your concealed firearm

Posted on 2/14/16 at 10:32 pm
Posted by TigerTatorTots
The Safeshore
Member since Jul 2009
80781 posts
Posted on 2/14/16 at 10:32 pm
Very good read

LINK /

Posted by Kino74
Denham springs
Member since Nov 2013
5344 posts
Posted on 2/15/16 at 3:14 am to
Definitely a good read. One thing too is if you are carrying and have to use your weapon, I personally would holster the weapon as soon as possible. I do not expect a cop to automatically know who is the innocent member in the incident. Do not expect the person on the phone to relay everything 100% to the arriving officer. Holding a firearm when a cop shows up has the potential for a tragic mistake.

Second thing is invoking your right to silence is highly important. The use of a firearm in a defensive manner that results in an injury or fatality is not something that happens everyday for law abiding citizens. You most likely didn't do everything 100% right and you better believe that can hurt you. Think of anything you had to do the first time in your life and the mistakes made. Furthermore you probably will be emotionally affected and saying anything that can be construed against you will be used against you. If anyone thinks not talking is an admission of guilt then that person is in a for a rude awakening. Innocent people can and do go to jail.

The gun can save your life but your brain can save your liberty.
Posted by bapple
Capital City
Member since Oct 2010
11895 posts
Posted on 2/15/16 at 6:46 am to
quote:

Kino74


You absolutely nailed it sir! Well done.
Posted by 911Moto
Member since Sep 2013
5491 posts
Posted on 2/15/16 at 7:39 am to
Good article. My favorite line:

quote:

At this point, your immediate plan should be not to get shot by the police




ETA: Reading that section to my dog right now.
This post was edited on 2/15/16 at 7:40 am
Posted by Mung
NorCal
Member since Aug 2007
9054 posts
Posted on 2/15/16 at 8:40 am to
don't forget to have $25K-50K in the bank to pay his fees up front.
Posted by AlxTgr
Kyre Banorg
Member since Oct 2003
81655 posts
Posted on 2/15/16 at 8:41 am to
quote:

don't forget to have $25K-50K in the bank to pay his fees up front.


Especially if you remain silent.
Posted by SpeckledTiger
Denham Springs
Member since Jul 2010
1477 posts
Posted on 2/15/16 at 8:47 am to
I've had very limited involvement with LEOs in a criminal sense. A few scuffles during tailgating where statements were given no charges filed, minor stuff as a juvenile (like really minor curfew violations)... with that said, if I remain silent, I imagine my chances of going home within the next 48 hours are just a tad above 0%. Are there any LEOs here that can disagree with that assessment?
Posted by AlxTgr
Kyre Banorg
Member since Oct 2003
81655 posts
Posted on 2/15/16 at 8:57 am to
quote:

statements were given no charges filed,


quote:

with that said, if I remain silent, I imagine my chances of going home within the next 48 hours are just a tad above 0%.


You are wise.
Posted by SpeckledTiger
Denham Springs
Member since Jul 2010
1477 posts
Posted on 2/15/16 at 9:04 am to
While I found the article to be a "good read", it seemed to be very self-serving. Think of this, if you are so calmly able to analyze the situation to determine if using your weapon is necessary, as the author suggests, shouldn't you be able to just as calmly explain yourself to the officer? Again, don't be an idiot, don't say more than you need to, but explaining yourself to the responding officer doesn't seem to be a horrible idea.
Posted by diat150
Louisiana
Member since Jun 2005
43572 posts
Posted on 2/15/16 at 9:12 am to
quote:

While I found the article to be a "good read", it seemed to be very self-serving. Think of this, if you are so calmly able to analyze the situation to determine if using your weapon is necessary, as the author suggests, shouldn't you be able to just as calmly explain yourself to the officer? Again, don't be an idiot, don't say more than you need to, but explaining yourself to the responding officer doesn't seem to be a horrible idea.


thats a terrible idea and could cost you some time in prison and a hefty civil suit.
Posted by AlxTgr
Kyre Banorg
Member since Oct 2003
81655 posts
Posted on 2/15/16 at 9:17 am to
quote:

thats a terrible idea and could cost you some time in prison and a hefty civil suit.


Posted by SpeckledTiger
Denham Springs
Member since Jul 2010
1477 posts
Posted on 2/15/16 at 9:23 am to
quote:

thats a terrible idea and could cost you some time in prison and a hefty civil suit.


Can you point me to examples of where a justified use of a firearm later led to prison time and/or a civil suit? I've heard this many times before, even from an attorney that spoke at our CHP class, but I've not read where this has actually occurred.
Posted by Clames
Member since Oct 2010
16590 posts
Posted on 2/15/16 at 9:45 am to
Used to happen frequently until laws were passed with regards to civil immunity and permissive CCW schemes had expanded to most states.
Posted by DownshiftAndFloorIt
Here
Member since Jan 2011
66763 posts
Posted on 2/15/16 at 9:48 am to
I'm sure shooting someone regardless of the circumstance is going to keep you from going home anytime soon regardless of what you do or do not say.
Posted by bapple
Capital City
Member since Oct 2010
11895 posts
Posted on 2/15/16 at 10:07 am to
quote:

Again, don't be an idiot, don't say more than you need to, but explaining yourself to the responding officer doesn't seem to be a horrible idea.


The reason is very simple:

If you are not accustomed to regularly shooting a living human being, when you are forced to, you will be absolutely hysterical.

Regardless of how justified I felt I was - the rush of adrenaline, the overwhelming of emotions, the constant questioning of my actions - all of these things put me in a terrible position to make a statement. I can say with almost utmost certainty that I would be crying my eyes out and be short of breath if I had to take a person's life, or even if I simply shot someone and didn't know his or her fate. The dust must settle and the smoke must clear in your own mind before you are of sane mind enough to make a legal statement.

Remember, regardless of whether you are hysterical or emotional, anything you say can be used against you in court.

My best advice: "Officer, I was in fear for my life and I will make an official statement when my attorney is present."
This post was edited on 2/15/16 at 10:08 am
Posted by MahiFishn
NOLA
Member since Aug 2011
536 posts
Posted on 2/15/16 at 10:38 am to
This was indeed a good read, but just like any article you read there are some things to take into consideration.

First of all, this guy is from Arizona and their laws seem to have some differences than that of Louisiana Law.

Second, i think he made some really good statements, but after reading the part about not keeping a round in the chamber, i had a difficult time taking him serious.

As far as not making a statement and LEO goes, its pretty common. The physical evidence should speak for itself. In the event that it doesn't, your lawyer will definitely be better at giving the statement.

For example, you have to call 911 because an intruder broke into your house and you shot him in fear for your life. The intruder is wearing a mask, gloves, and a hoodie. The intruder has a weapon (considered deadly). After you shoot and kill him, he drops where he is. What physical evidence does the officer have if you give no statement?
Posted by bapple
Capital City
Member since Oct 2010
11895 posts
Posted on 2/15/16 at 10:52 am to
quote:

For example, you have to call 911 because an intruder broke into your house and you shot him in fear for your life. The intruder is wearing a mask, gloves, and a hoodie. The intruder has a weapon (considered deadly). After you shoot and kill him, he drops where he is. What physical evidence does the officer have if you give no statement?


Location, location, location.

While I agree with your critiques about not carrying condition 0/1, that doesn't completely downplay everything else he's saying.

If you shoot an unwelcomed intruder that comes into your home, you have a lot more legal protection than if you engage this person in an open area. The biggest reason is Castle Doctrine.

It's more difficult to rationalize a self defense encounter from a concealed carry perspective versus a home defense perspective. The law in Louisiana for Justifiable Homicide specifically states "dwelling, place of business, and motor vehicle" as three key areas. If it doesn't fall into these three, you have a lot more burden of proof that your life was in danger.

And even though he's not talking about Louisiana specifically, I think he's focusing on concealed carry as a whole, not something like home defense.
This post was edited on 2/15/16 at 10:54 am
Posted by MahiFishn
NOLA
Member since Aug 2011
536 posts
Posted on 2/15/16 at 10:58 am to
quote:

Location, location, location.


Ok change the word "home" to "place of business".

Or "Subway for Lunch"
This post was edited on 2/15/16 at 11:00 am
Posted by diat150
Louisiana
Member since Jun 2005
43572 posts
Posted on 2/15/16 at 11:11 am to
quote:

Can you point me to examples of where a justified use of a firearm later led to prison time and/or a civil suit? I've heard this many times before, even from an attorney that spoke at our CHP class, but I've not read where this has actually occurred.


I know the guy that shot the black guy that was trying to kill a police officer in baton rouge a few years back had to deal with a lawsuit. since then, the state has modified the laws to favor the justified shooter.

Thats not what I am talking about though. You absolutely do not want to tell a police/investigator anything without a lawyer present. You are asking to frick up and say the wrong thing in a tense situation that may cost you in the long run. what you tell a cop in the heat of the moment may end up being the deciding factor in what is justified and what isnt.
This post was edited on 2/15/16 at 11:13 am
Posted by Hammertime
Will trade dowsing rod for titties
Member since Jan 2012
43030 posts
Posted on 2/15/16 at 11:33 am to
I've learned over the years (the hard way), that no matter what they say, cops are never trying to help you go home. They are not your friends. They are looking to arrest people all day long.

Remember, if you say one wrong thing, you could go to jail for life
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