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Message
1
Posted on 7/8/15 at 6:49 pm to paco_noles
I was born and raised right outside the base.. My Uncle is still out there as a retried major in the ANG
Posted on 7/9/15 at 8:48 am to Napoleon
I get the military pilots want to take care of their own, but I can't see how the Cessna pilot is to blame. Look guys military people are not infallible. Yes we are playing armchair QB but still... I don't see why people are bent out of shape when it's mentioned that the fighter pilot was at fault.
More facts came out today.
LINK
Not saying they were hot dogging, but if you guys are saying a Fighter has no way of seeing a Cessna at speed, then we better keep a lid on it, or the terrorists will switch to single engine planes for attacks.
More facts came out today.
quote:
Both aircraft had operable transponders that basically report back to the radar site the aircraft's location and altitude
quote:
pilots are required to announce their intention to take off and land, but otherwise do not need to be in communication with air traffic control. It is the responsibility of the pilot to avoid all traffic
quote:
All F-16s are equipped with radar systems, and there have been no reports of malfunctions with the jet.
LINK
Not saying they were hot dogging, but if you guys are saying a Fighter has no way of seeing a Cessna at speed, then we better keep a lid on it, or the terrorists will switch to single engine planes for attacks.
Posted on 7/9/15 at 11:06 am to Napoleon
quote:
Napoleon
Are you an aviator or familiar with VFR vs IFR?
None of the information you provided or is in the USA Today article can be used to determine who is at fault, if any one.
Posted on 7/9/15 at 11:08 am to paco_noles
Posted on 7/9/15 at 11:10 am to paco_noles
Sometimes no one is at fault though the F-16 is much more maneuverable.
Posted on 7/9/15 at 11:14 am to paco_noles
quote:
Are you an aviator or familiar with VFR vs IFR?
None of the information you provided or is in the USA Today article can be used to determine who is at fault, if any one.
It's my understanding that the F16 was conducting practice IFR approaches. He's still responsible to for seeing and avoiding traffic if he is conducting approaches in VFR conditions
Posted on 7/9/15 at 11:28 am to GeauxxxTigers23
Father, Michael Johnson, and adult son Joseph killed. Michael Johnson's brother and s-i-l were allegedly murdered Saturday by their 16 year old grandson.
The son Joseph Johnson was a Braves draft pick in 2006 and the pilot.
The son Joseph Johnson was a Braves draft pick in 2006 and the pilot.
Posted on 7/9/15 at 11:30 am to duggieblue
quote:
Father, Michael Johnson, and adult son Joseph killed. Michael Johnson's brother and s-i-l were allegedly murdered Saturday by their 16 year old grandson.
saw in our paper this morning where the father's brother and sil were murdered in MO last week by their grandson
This post was edited on 7/9/15 at 11:44 am
Posted on 7/9/15 at 11:38 am to 777Tiger
That's terribly tragic.
Posted on 7/22/15 at 1:06 pm to sicboy
UPDATE
Two weeks ago a U.S. Air Force F-16 hit a little Cessna 150 propeller airplane while both were in the air near Charleston, South Carolina. The Air Force pilot ejected to safety; the two people aboard the Cessna were killed. I wrote about the larger challenge of separating military and civilian general-aviation aircraft here.
Today the National Transportation Safety Board released its “preliminary information” on the crash. Final NTSB assessments can take many months, often years, to complete. This preliminary report has some compelling details. A lot of attention will be paid to the sequence described here.
The F-16 is making a practice instrument approach to Charleston airport, on a path that turns out to directly intersect with the Cessna’s as it is taking off from the small-Berkley County airport:
LINK
Two weeks ago a U.S. Air Force F-16 hit a little Cessna 150 propeller airplane while both were in the air near Charleston, South Carolina. The Air Force pilot ejected to safety; the two people aboard the Cessna were killed. I wrote about the larger challenge of separating military and civilian general-aviation aircraft here.
Today the National Transportation Safety Board released its “preliminary information” on the crash. Final NTSB assessments can take many months, often years, to complete. This preliminary report has some compelling details. A lot of attention will be paid to the sequence described here.
The F-16 is making a practice instrument approach to Charleston airport, on a path that turns out to directly intersect with the Cessna’s as it is taking off from the small-Berkley County airport:
LINK
Posted on 7/22/15 at 1:22 pm to Jbird
quote:
At [time] 1100:18, the controller advised the pilot of the F-16, “Traffic 12 o'clock, 2 miles, opposite direction, 1,200 [feet altitude] indicated, type unknown.” [This was the Cessna, which because it was outside Charleston’s “Class C” controlled airspace was not required to be in touch with the controller.]
quote:
The F-16 pilot responded and advised the controller that he was "looking" for the traffic.
Sounds like someone was given an order to turn to heading 180 and didn't do it.
quote:
At 1100:26 [eight seconds later], the controller advised the F-16 pilot, “Turn left heading 180 if you don't have that traffic in sight.” The pilot responded by asking, “Confirm 2 miles?”
Eight seconds later, the controller stated, “If you don't have that traffic in sight turn left heading 180 immediately.” [The word immediately is one you don’t hear very often from air traffic controllers. When you do, you know they mean it. You’re taught to do what they say immediately — turn right, turn left, climb, descend — and only then talk with them about it or ask further details.]
Over the next 18 seconds, the track of the F-16 began turning southerly. [Emphasis added.]
At 1100:49 [15 seconds after the first instruction to turn], the radar target of the F-16 was located 1/2 nautical mile northeast of the Cessna, at an indicated altitude of 1,500 feet, and was on an approximate track of 215 degrees. [That is, not yet at the requested heading of 180 degrees.] At that time, the Cessna reported an indicated altitude of 1,400 feet, and was established on an approximate track of 110 degrees.
I stand by my earlier assessment of this situation.
Posted on 7/22/15 at 1:23 pm to Jbird
I knew it was gonna be the F16's fault. What a shame. WTF was he thinking?
Posted on 7/22/15 at 1:25 pm to Jbird
You didn't quote the really damning part of the initial report. Sounds like the USAF pilot fricked up and killed two people.
To spell this out: Some 30 seconds before the collision, the air-traffic controller was alerting the Air Force pilot that another plane might be in its path. Between sweeps of the radar beam there is some delay in radar-screen readings catching up with the planes’ real positions, so controllers must anticipate their paths. More than 20 seconds before the crash, the controller told the Air Force pilot to turn left, away from the other plane. More than 15 seconds before the crash, the controller said “turn left immediately.” For whatever reason this did not avert the crash.
To spell this out: Some 30 seconds before the collision, the air-traffic controller was alerting the Air Force pilot that another plane might be in its path. Between sweeps of the radar beam there is some delay in radar-screen readings catching up with the planes’ real positions, so controllers must anticipate their paths. More than 20 seconds before the crash, the controller told the Air Force pilot to turn left, away from the other plane. More than 15 seconds before the crash, the controller said “turn left immediately.” For whatever reason this did not avert the crash.
Posted on 7/22/15 at 1:28 pm to jbgleason
quote:It almost sounds as if the F16 pilot did this intentionally. Regardless, alot of people in here owe Napoleon an apology
You didn't quote the really damning part of the initial report. Sounds like the USAF pilot fricked up and killed two people.
To spell this out: Some 30 seconds before the collision, the air-traffic controller was alerting the Air Force pilot that another plane might be in its path. Between sweeps of the radar beam there is some delay in radar-screen readings catching up with the planes’ real positions, so controllers must anticipate their paths. More than 20 seconds before the crash, the controller told the Air Force pilot to turn left, away from the other plane. More than 15 seconds before the crash, the controller said “turn left immediately.” For whatever reason this did not avert the crash.
Posted on 7/22/15 at 1:31 pm to lsupride87
frick him, I blamed it the F16 guy on the first page. Also at some point I pointed out that a pilot doing instrument approach training was still required to see and avoid any traffic in VFR conditions.
Posted on 7/22/15 at 1:31 pm to lsupride87
quote:not me. I was on the same page from the get go
alot of people in here owe Napoleon an apology
Posted on 7/22/15 at 1:32 pm to GeauxxxTigers23
quote:
frick him
I like your style 
Posted on 7/22/15 at 1:33 pm to CP3
quote:
CP3
quote:
Lol, or it was the dumbass cessna's fault. I have more confidence in a highly trained fighter pilot than someone who took a few classes for a pilots license.
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