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re: How empathetic do you think you are?
Posted on 3/4/14 at 10:50 pm to SlowFlowPro
Posted on 3/4/14 at 10:50 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
the 2nd question can't be answered until we define empathy!
Nah.
Your answer is...not very important.
Logic is important.
1
Posted on 3/4/14 at 10:50 pm to Draconian Sanctions
I am very empathetic with my own feelings. That is to say, *I* feel empathy.
I am not empathetic with others feelings; I don't necessarily think others do or should feel the same things I do
I am not empathetic with others feelings; I don't necessarily think others do or should feel the same things I do
Posted on 3/4/14 at 10:50 pm to Stingray
quote:
Your answer is...not very important.
i don't think this has ever been true in the history of everdom
...and if you were empathetic, you'd know that!
Posted on 3/4/14 at 10:51 pm to SlowFlowPro
so the next question is, what is OP's trollpoint?
Posted on 3/4/14 at 10:53 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
How empathetic do you think you are? quote: Your answer is...not very important. i don't think this has ever been true in the history of everdom ...and if you were empathetic, you'd know that!
we are on the poly board.
logic is what solves problems.
empathy is what gets Obama elected.
"I feel your pain."
Posted on 3/4/14 at 10:54 pm to McLemore
quote:
so the next question is, what is OP's trollpoint?
there is a line of thinking/meme of people of a certain socio-poligical ilk, that those who believe in liberty and individualism don't have empathy. they get sympathy and empathy confused (as do many people in this thread :troll:)
i don't know if this is an attempt at "gotcha" moments (finding non sympathetic posts of people) or a legitimate attempt to discuss emotions and socio-political issues
Posted on 3/4/14 at 10:55 pm to McLemore
quote:
whatever definitions we're using, i think for this emotion to be meaningful/productive in any way, it must involve more than just feeling bad for someone/thing. i feel bad for the roach i squash in the kitchen, and i don't want to be squashed myself, but that doesn't keep me from destroying the MF'er every time.
I agree, and that's why I didn't include feeling bad for something in that definition.
I feel as if this is going to be spun into foreign policy very fast
eta: I'm empathetic with the African-American race for the evils of slavery, but I don't feel bad because their own people sold them into it, and not a single person on this planet is within 2 generations of someone who even knew someone who was a slave.
This post was edited on 3/4/14 at 10:57 pm
Posted on 3/4/14 at 10:56 pm to Stingray
quote:
logic is what solves problems.
empathy is what gets Obama elected.
problems involve people
you can only either create/serve people in the market with a healthy understanding (or at least appreciation) of empathy, OR you can only function in society being able to communicate emotionally with others. even sociopaths know that
Posted on 3/4/14 at 10:57 pm to Stingray
quote:
"I feel your pain"
What dies this mean really?
Unless you have gone through the exact same thing the other person did, this is a nonsensical statement.
Anyway, I'm pretty empathetic but I'm also grounded enough that I'm at a point where I will never allow my empathy to overcome logic, reasoning, cost benefit analysis and practicality.
Posted on 3/4/14 at 10:57 pm to SlowFlowPro
You don't have to be a great philanthropist...or donate money - or "put others ahead of you" - whatever that means.
But you to have an ear - a real ear - sometimes that's emphatic enough - people just want their story to be heard -
You need the ability to listen honestly and once listening can care to varying degrees - depending on the situation.
Empathy is putting yourself in that person's shoes fully.
It's not carte blanche absolving...or putting others ahead of you. That's philanthropy.
Empathy can be emotional support or simply - human being - support...you can still come to reasonable conclusions with empathy - conclusions that do not jive with carte blanche philanthropic.
But you to have an ear - a real ear - sometimes that's emphatic enough - people just want their story to be heard -
You need the ability to listen honestly and once listening can care to varying degrees - depending on the situation.
Empathy is putting yourself in that person's shoes fully.
It's not carte blanche absolving...or putting others ahead of you. That's philanthropy.
Empathy can be emotional support or simply - human being - support...you can still come to reasonable conclusions with empathy - conclusions that do not jive with carte blanche philanthropic.
Posted on 3/4/14 at 10:59 pm to Zamoro10
quote:
Empathy can be emotional support or simply - human being - support...you can still come to reasonable conclusions with empathy - conclusions that do not jive with carte blanche philanthropic.
well said
sometimes "human being support" is simply being able to recognize a potential wrong. to be empathetic does not require torches and pitchforks to capitol hill
Posted on 3/4/14 at 10:59 pm to Zamoro10
quote:
But you to have an ear - a real ear - sometimes that's emphatic enough - people just want their story to be heard -
well what if you know what they're feeling b/c you've heard the same story before and know the ending before they get there?
most people are not different than most other people. most stories/patterns of human interaction are not that different
quote:
Empathy is putting yourself in that person's shoes fully
i'll accept this definition, and i will still say that listening to their whole story isn't necessary
hell, their inherent bias often re-creates a non-objective viewpoint of the story (which is a bad thing to allow them to reinforce, as i understand what they're feeling and how that reinforcement will affect them)
Posted on 3/4/14 at 11:01 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
healthy understanding (or at least appreciation) of empathy
Awesome.
You agree with me.
You only have to understand empathy, not actually have it.
Posted on 3/4/14 at 11:03 pm to Stingray
quote:
You only have to understand empathy, not actually have it.
i think we're splitting hairs
i think people are just rejecting my robotic view of empathy for a romantic, emotional, non-scientific view
Posted on 3/4/14 at 11:09 pm to SlowFlowPro
SFP - You're a lawyer right?
Clients often pay us good money - just for someone to hear their story.
I suppose - that's not empathy because someone is getting paid. But you see the craving for empathy in society.
It shows how desperate people are just to be heard. Empathy is honest listening. Which mankind so seldom does.
Lawyer duties can often take on the form of simply psychiatric listening.
I think most people aren't empathetic because they can't be bothered.
There seems to be a real need for people wanting to be heard - and paying good money - just so someone will listen about their plight and understand their situation...or at least, where they are coming from...
Some people are trained in this - for often different motives - most people can't seem to mentally grasp the concept of putting themselves in someone else's shoes.
Empathy is often not truly altruistic - because it is very hard to the average person dealing with their own life.
Clients often pay us good money - just for someone to hear their story.
I suppose - that's not empathy because someone is getting paid. But you see the craving for empathy in society.
It shows how desperate people are just to be heard. Empathy is honest listening. Which mankind so seldom does.
Lawyer duties can often take on the form of simply psychiatric listening.
I think most people aren't empathetic because they can't be bothered.
There seems to be a real need for people wanting to be heard - and paying good money - just so someone will listen about their plight and understand their situation...or at least, where they are coming from...
Some people are trained in this - for often different motives - most people can't seem to mentally grasp the concept of putting themselves in someone else's shoes.
Empathy is often not truly altruistic - because it is very hard to the average person dealing with their own life.
Posted on 3/4/14 at 11:13 pm to Zamoro10
quote:
SFP - You're a lawyer right?
Clients often pay us good money - just for someone to hear their story.
we're a service industry, and depending on which type of law you do, you have to assume a role of an (emotional) counselor. this is part of giving them proper service, as we have to give them advice over an arena they do not understand, often in light of their actual desires
we need empathy for communication purposes
in a domestic/family law setting, i'll almost always shut down those discussions. if they can't appreciate the system and processes for what they are, and want to use it in order to push an emotional agenda, they need to hire another lawyer (who will suck them dry).
in a criminal law setting, i allow much more leeway. in a personal injury setting, i allow exponentially more.
Posted on 3/4/14 at 11:20 pm to Draconian Sanctions
People put entirely too much stock in emotions such as empathy. Don't intrude upon others; who cares how you feel?
This post was edited on 3/4/14 at 11:21 pm
Posted on 3/4/14 at 11:25 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
in a domestic/family law setting, i'll almost always shut down those discussions. if they can't appreciate the system and processes for what they are, and want to use it in order to push an emotional agenda, they need to hire another lawyer (who will suck them dry).
This is so true. It's a circus if you give them leeway.
I dealt with domestic abuse previously in prosecution and then criminal defense - completely different story and empathy is important for trust. And have done the previously mentioned family law.
Regardless of empathy being a tool for a trade or an industry.
It's opened my eyes over the years to how much people crave it and how little they get it.
So empathy is something important in society we rarely give freely.
And most people don't know how to listen.
This post was edited on 3/4/14 at 11:26 pm
Posted on 3/4/14 at 11:27 pm to Zamoro10
Empathy is an emotion one experiences that is born from the emotion of another.
While I can be unfeeling at times, typically it is difficult for me to NOT be empathetic.
But the more I live my life, the more I realize that there can be a lot of wasted emotion, and it is draining and usually nonproductive.
My goal is to make decisions logically and not have emotion trick me into making illogical decisions.
That is why empathy is not important.
Example. Say you're a doctor. Say a very sick patient asks you to sign their handicap license form. Maybe they don't exactly qualify, but when they ask you, you feel the pull to help someone who is down/weak. I don't need the irrational, emotional empathy clouding my judgement to make the right decision. All I need to do the right and just thing is logic.
While I can be unfeeling at times, typically it is difficult for me to NOT be empathetic.
But the more I live my life, the more I realize that there can be a lot of wasted emotion, and it is draining and usually nonproductive.
My goal is to make decisions logically and not have emotion trick me into making illogical decisions.
That is why empathy is not important.
Example. Say you're a doctor. Say a very sick patient asks you to sign their handicap license form. Maybe they don't exactly qualify, but when they ask you, you feel the pull to help someone who is down/weak. I don't need the irrational, emotional empathy clouding my judgement to make the right decision. All I need to do the right and just thing is logic.
Posted on 3/4/14 at 11:29 pm to Stingray
quote:
Example. Say you're a doctor. Say a very sick patient asks you to sign their handicap license form. Maybe they don't exactly qualify, but when they ask you, you feel the pull to help someone who is down/weak. I don't need the irrational, emotional empathy clouding my judgement to make the right decision. All I need to do the right and just thing is logic.
by that token you're letting outside forces decide what you think is right and logical. Why wouldn't you sign the license form? (I picture this situation as a temporary handicap parking hangtag, I know nothing about handicap drivers licenses)
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