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re: Leonard Fournette and the saints visiting
Posted on 4/16/17 at 4:18 pm to CocoLoco
Posted on 4/16/17 at 4:18 pm to CocoLoco
quote:
I do believe Fournette is the best RB in the draft, but that doesn't mean he's the best for for this offense, nor does it mean that he'll be Adrian Peterson like some people on here are saying
I didn't realize the GOAT of NFL scouting was a LSU homer?
1
Posted on 4/16/17 at 4:32 pm to hellsu
quote:
Actually we played out of the shotgun formation only
43% of the snaps last year. I know it seemed like more but for as pass happy as our offense is that put us right dead in the middle of all the league as far as using this formation.
Good point. This board can toss around misconceptions until most believe them as fact. The Saints run way more power than the average fan gives them credit for & they turned it up a notch higher in 2016. This is from this past season:
quote:
Since Week 8, the Saints lead the NFL in rushing yards per game (cite the stats) behind the re-emergence of Tim Hightower and Mark Ingram as dependable workhorse ball-carriers. Hightower in particular has taken his game up a notch since being promoted to a bigger role in the backfield. Over the past two games, he has amassed 189 rushing yards on 49 attempts with a score. Most importantly, he has given the Saints' running game the kind of "thump" that had been missing since the beginning of the season.
quote:
For Ingram, the change has resulted in fewer overall carries in each game but better production (11.3 yards per carry on 6.0 rushing attempts over the past two games). From I-formations, the veteran runner has averaged 4.7 yards per carry on an average of 3.0 rushing attempts during that span. Interestingly, Ingram hasn't logged a single carry from a shotgun formation after averaging 4.6 shotgun runs during the first seven games. Although he successfully pounded the ball between the tackles to the tune of 4.7 yards per rush out of the gun, Ingram and the offense work best when the RB1 aligns at the "dot" position.
quote:
Now, this isn't necessarily a new trend for the Saints or Payton, as he would regularly use an extra offensive tackle at tight end during the Jimmy Graham era. But he has doubled down on the package of late. After using six-man offensive lines on 31.9 percent of the team's offensive snaps during Weeks 1-7, the Saints have featured their "heavy" package on 46.8 percent of their snaps the past two games. They have averaged 3.5 yards per play in the package during that span, which suggests the offense is able to stay on schedule when playing "big-boy football" at the line of scrimmage.
LINK
Posted on 4/16/17 at 5:17 pm to BigBrod81
You think they don't get a lot of things wrong?
Mel Kiper thought Clausen was going to be amazing. You don't think that claiming Fournette will be better than AP is fricking ridiculous?
I'll answer that for you. It is. Speaking as though it is a lock that Fournette will be one of the greatest NFL running backs of all time.
I guess Fournette will be a lock for 2k yards in a season, and an MVP. It is written. It will happen.
Mel Kiper thought Clausen was going to be amazing. You don't think that claiming Fournette will be better than AP is fricking ridiculous?
I'll answer that for you. It is. Speaking as though it is a lock that Fournette will be one of the greatest NFL running backs of all time.
I guess Fournette will be a lock for 2k yards in a season, and an MVP. It is written. It will happen.
This post was edited on 4/16/17 at 5:21 pm
Posted on 4/16/17 at 6:08 pm to CocoLoco
quote:
Mel Kiper thought Clausen was going to be amazing. You don't think that claiming Fournette will be better than AP is fricking ridiculous?
Mel Kiper was a nobody who ESPN picked up back in the early 80s to help with their draft coverage. Kiper has NEVER been involved as a scout, director of player personnel or GM professionally in his life. Sorry if you take what he says as gospel. Gil Brandt on the other hand has drafted more Hall of Famers than you can shake a stick at. Whether you want to hear it or not, his word holds weight in the football unlike Kiper's. The modern scouting process is based off the model Brandt designed in the 60s so he knows a lil something when it comes to eyeing talent.
quote:
Speaking as though it is a lock that Fournette will be one of the greatest NFL running backs of all time.
Fournette's body type & skill set are very similar to both Jim Brown & Earl Campbell.
quote:
I guess Fournette will be a lock for 2k yards in a season, and an MVP. It is written. It will happen.
Are you menstruating?
Posted on 4/16/17 at 6:23 pm to BigBrod81
No, I'm being rational.
Fournette could* be great, but acting as though it's a guarantee he'll be AP is absurd to me.
Fournette could* be great, but acting as though it's a guarantee he'll be AP is absurd to me.
Posted on 4/16/17 at 6:43 pm to CocoLoco
quote:
No, I'm being rational.
Comparing statements given by Mel Kiper to ones given by Gil Brandt isn't being very rational.
Who the hell is Mel Kiper?
quote:
The SI story alleges that Wichard and Luchs called Kiper when the agents were meeting with Stanford defensive lineman Willie Howardin 2000. As the story goes, Wichard told Kiper he was meeting with the best defensive lineman in college football. To which, Kiper responded by saying Wichard must be in the room with Howard. The tone of the article suggests that Wichard called Kiper in advance so they could ham it up about Howard and get him to sign with Wichard.
The story also implies that Kiper rates Wichard's clients more favorably in his rankings, which appear on ESPN, ESPN.com and in Kiper's books published by Mel Kiper Enterprise Inc.
quote:
Kiper has faced scrutiny in the past about his involvement with agents. In April of 2009 when Kiper had Clausen rated as the top quarterback (ahead of Sam Bradford) and fourth overall, the Washington Post said there were whispers about the draft analyst's friendship with Wichard.
LINK
quote:
Gil Brandt: The Draft Guru Who’s Seen It All
Over six decades as a scout, personnel boss and analyst, the man who helped invent sophisticated player evaluation has watched the NFL’s annual talent roundup evolve from seat-of-the-pants to a year-round, made-for-TV (and internet) spectacle. One thing that hasn't changed: the qualities that make a prospect ready for the pros
quote:
There were five characteristics that were common to every position: 1) character, 2) mental alertness, 3) quickness, agility and balance, 4) strength and explosion and 5) competitiveness and aggressiveness
quote:
BRANDT: The same characteristics I talked about in scouting players, those five characteristics, are still en vogue today. Maybe the weights of them change, maybe we put less of an emphasis on strength and explosion for a quarterback and more on mental alertness, because the game has become so intellectual. But I think the five characteristics we started with in 1961 are still the same characteristics. And I think most of the position specifics are the same, though in-line blocking was probably more important in the past than it is now, and pass protection back then was probably less important. So you change the weighting system, and the way you change it is you look to see what leads to success and what leads to failure.
This is a must read for anyone attempting to learn the scouting process
Posted on 4/16/17 at 6:46 pm to BigBrod81
Look man, let's agree to disagree on it.
I strongly believe Fournette is the most gifted RB in this class, and I think he will be realllllly good, potentially great depending on where he ends up. I just believe in waiting to see them play (in this case taking NFL snaps) before I'll say if he's headed toward the HoF
I will read the article, though.
I strongly believe Fournette is the most gifted RB in this class, and I think he will be realllllly good, potentially great depending on where he ends up. I just believe in waiting to see them play (in this case taking NFL snaps) before I'll say if he's headed toward the HoF
I will read the article, though.
Posted on 4/16/17 at 7:11 pm to CocoLoco
quote:
I just believe in waiting to see them play (in this case taking NFL snaps) before I'll say if he's headed toward the HoF
When you follow this stuff long enough, you begin to be able to see & project it before it happens. It's all a repetitive cycle which most don't seem to grasp. The personalities, the body types, the physical traits. History is constantly repeating itself so if you educate yourself on the past, it helps to understand the present & the future.
Barring a rash of injuries or one catastrophic injury, Fournette will be a great one. I don't care where he would have played collegiate ball at. Honestly, I would still have the same opinion of him regardless. I felt the same way about Marcus Lattimore but unfortunately he had ended up having that gruesome knee injury before he could make it to the NFL.
Marcus Lattimore Highlights
Posted on 4/16/17 at 8:04 pm to BigBrod81
I think in most circles Jim Brown is considered the greatest of running backs. He set the benchmark.
A phenomenal competitor.
1. 104.3 yd. aver. per game career
2. 5.2 yd. per carry aver. career
3. 9 years in the NFL . 9 pro bowls- 8yrs. all pro.
L.F.7 has the speed , power , vision and so far character , (the tools), (the potential) to be great.
However he hasn't even strapped on a helmet or is even a drafted rookie yet. No one knows yet how good or how bad he will be. I think there is one thing that is the equalizer to him and any other competitive athletes. This is the most important stat of Jim Browns career.
4. 9 straight seasons 0 missed games due to injury.
Literally every G.M., scout ,coach, fan and Chinese banjo player knows Fournette has the potential to be a difference maker but no one knows if an injury or a wayward meteor will put an end to his or anyones career. Just like investing in the market, previous results don't guarantee future gains but it's all we've got to go on.
A phenomenal competitor.
1. 104.3 yd. aver. per game career
2. 5.2 yd. per carry aver. career
3. 9 years in the NFL . 9 pro bowls- 8yrs. all pro.
L.F.7 has the speed , power , vision and so far character , (the tools), (the potential) to be great.
However he hasn't even strapped on a helmet or is even a drafted rookie yet. No one knows yet how good or how bad he will be. I think there is one thing that is the equalizer to him and any other competitive athletes. This is the most important stat of Jim Browns career.
4. 9 straight seasons 0 missed games due to injury.
Literally every G.M., scout ,coach, fan and Chinese banjo player knows Fournette has the potential to be a difference maker but no one knows if an injury or a wayward meteor will put an end to his or anyones career. Just like investing in the market, previous results don't guarantee future gains but it's all we've got to go on.
Posted on 4/16/17 at 8:25 pm to hellsu
I can agree with all of that. 
Just keep in mind though in terms of Brown's ability to stay healthy. In his first 4 seasons in the league, the NFL played 12 regular season games. During his final 5 seasons, the regular season consisted of 14 games.
Just keep in mind though in terms of Brown's ability to stay healthy. In his first 4 seasons in the league, the NFL played 12 regular season games. During his final 5 seasons, the regular season consisted of 14 games.
Posted on 4/16/17 at 8:32 pm to bayou39
Ball control is the key to a great defense.
Posted on 4/16/17 at 9:01 pm to BigBrod81
Also Brown was playing against players that were considerably smaller and slower than todays competition.
Posted on 4/17/17 at 7:05 am to Covingtontiger77
quote:
Ricky Williams 2.0 Will be good but not great RB in the league
I agree. He wasn't even the best RB on his team.
Down Vote Away! I'll get it started.
Posted on 4/17/17 at 8:39 am to bayou39
I love Fournette, but:
1.) I don't think the Saints will trade up to get him,
2.) He isn't going to last till the 11th pick - I think he'll end up in Carolina, and
3.) I don't think he'd be the best fit for a Payton/Brees offense.
1.) I don't think the Saints will trade up to get him,
2.) He isn't going to last till the 11th pick - I think he'll end up in Carolina, and
3.) I don't think he'd be the best fit for a Payton/Brees offense.
Posted on 4/17/17 at 9:20 am to bayou39
If the saints wouldn't have fricked up at every turn the last few years, we might have enough talent to trade up...
Let's be clear, if brees had fournette in his backfield, we would put up even better offensive #s....championship type #s
Let's be clear, if brees had fournette in his backfield, we would put up even better offensive #s....championship type #s
Posted on 4/17/17 at 12:34 pm to hellsu
quote:
If our defense was at least middle of the road quality yes I would. I believe L.F. is potentially the kind of back to build your offense around. Not just because of his physical tools but due to his character and potential I think he is one of the few running backs worth the 1st round investment.
Saints defense does have some talent issues, but their biggest issue is that they are loaded with injury-riddled players.
Honestly, if Kikaha, PJ Williams, and Ellerbe stay healthy this defense will be middle of the pack this season with the already brought in additions and another year in the new system.
If you trade 42 for Butler on top of that, you are pretty well off.
Now, do they have top tier talent and depth? No, but they aren't as bad off on paper as many think.
If Lattimore and Barnett are gone at 11, but LF is still there, you take him in a heartbeat. This is a very good draft, but at the DL players are more a great collection of depth than top tier talent outside what seems likely to be the top 5 picks.
LF could also fit the Saints offense, and still leave room for Ingram. Just because Fournette made his living running with a FB in LSU's offense, doesn't mean he doesn't fit a more open offense. His skillset actually has shown he's one of the most complete backs in a long time and is much like Zeke Elliot. Honestly, the two best total package running backs to come out in the last 10-15 years.
Posted on 4/17/17 at 2:14 pm to Carville
You just don't have a clue, do you ?
Posted on 4/17/17 at 2:23 pm to breauxmosexual
quote:
Can you say Trent Richardson 2.0?
I appreciate when posters make posts like this. It lets me know that i can ignore their future opinions on any subject. You cant fix stupid but you can identify it.
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