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re: If We Sign Holiday, What Next?

Posted on 6/13/17 at 3:10 pm to
Posted by TigerinATL
Member since Feb 2005
61576 posts
Posted on 6/13/17 at 3:10 pm to
quote:

If the Wolves successfully trade Rubio this offseason, they are expected to pursue a free agent point guard.


This doesn't sound Jrue specific but more "if we can get something of value for Rubio we'll use our cap space to go after the top remaining PGs on the market."
Posted by BallHawk
Orlando
Member since Jul 2011
5740 posts
Posted on 6/13/17 at 3:20 pm to
I would think a S&T of Jrue to them would kill both birds with one stone, no?
Posted by Fun Bunch
New Orleans
Member since May 2008
116310 posts
Posted on 6/13/17 at 3:23 pm to
To me losing Jrue and gaining Rubio doesn't really do us a whole lot of good. You've got a guy for a year that maybe can distribute better, but you still have a variety of issues and really wouldn't improve THAT much.

My want would be to pair Jrue and Rubio (obviously that would mean Jrue got less than 25 per and you could make a trade for Rubio work.
Posted by BallHawk
Orlando
Member since Jul 2011
5740 posts
Posted on 6/13/17 at 3:26 pm to
By doing that trade we gain a major TPE. We could then target another SG to fill that role.

SG is tougher than PG, mind you, but I think we could get some players.
Posted by Fun Bunch
New Orleans
Member since May 2008
116310 posts
Posted on 6/13/17 at 3:30 pm to
That's true. It also keeps us more flexible in the future, which is a plus.

I'm really not for keeping Jrue for anything more than 22-23 per (and even that is high to me).
Posted by PelicansBay
Huber Heights, Ohio
Member since Jun 2017
679 posts
Posted on 6/13/17 at 5:36 pm to
I hope we keep Jrue, 4 year $92 million seems fair. If someone wants to pay him more than that, I hope we do a sign-and-trade. We can't have him walk for nothing, we have no depth as is. We had 3 roster spots that were revolving doors for 10-day signings,that's not a recipe for success.

If we do a sign-and-trade, we realistically could get someone like: Rubio, Rondo, Tobias, Mudiay, Carmelo. I would rather take my chances short-term with any of those players than to sign Holiday to a 5 year max.
Posted by PelicansBay
Huber Heights, Ohio
Member since Jun 2017
679 posts
Posted on 6/27/17 at 8:57 am to
Posted by ghost2most
Member since Mar 2012
6662 posts
Posted on 6/27/17 at 9:37 am to
It's never smart to overpay out of desperation. See Asik, Hill, etc.

Posted by BallHawk
Orlando
Member since Jul 2011
5740 posts
Posted on 6/27/17 at 2:34 pm to
TBW has an article out this morning regarding Jrue

NBA Free Agency: Hints now point to Jrue Holiday re-signing with the New Orleans Pelicans

This is the part of the article that really gives me pause
quote:

“I think New Orleans is prepared to spend, from what I understand. I think ownership understands the point in time they are with Anthony Davis and DeMarcus Cousins. Even if you don’t look at him as a $30 million point guard, he’s about to head there from what I understand; it will be very close.” Windhorst is one of the more connected NBA writers working for ESPN so listening to him detail the notion that the Pelicans are leaning towards meeting Holiday’s contract demands shows the two parties are no longer far apart on the terms as once presumed.


If this, in fact, true then Dell is competing against himself again and is now unprepared to walk. Maybe it's the maybe using past history as future plans either way if it walks like a duck and talks like a duck...
Posted by TigerinATL
Member since Feb 2005
61576 posts
Posted on 6/27/17 at 2:45 pm to
quote:

Dell is competing against himself again and is now unprepared to walk.


They created cap space for a reason. I just hope that reason isn't to max Holiday and pay Justin $11 million per.
Posted by NOFOX
New Orleans
Member since Jan 2014
9955 posts
Posted on 6/27/17 at 2:56 pm to
quote:


They created cap space for a reason.


What cap space did they create?
Posted by TigerinATL
Member since Feb 2005
61576 posts
Posted on 6/27/17 at 3:03 pm to
I guess I should have said they dumped Frazier for a reason. A precursor to creating cap space.
Posted by Fun Bunch
New Orleans
Member since May 2008
116310 posts
Posted on 6/27/17 at 3:08 pm to
quote:

Even if you don’t look at him as a $30 million point guard, he’s about to head there from what I understand; it will be very close.”


FML

Anything above 25 for Jrue is fricking abysmal. shite, I think anything above 20 for him isn't great.

Posted by BallHawk
Orlando
Member since Jul 2011
5740 posts
Posted on 6/28/17 at 6:16 am to
OK, so I have been playing around with potential off-seasons myself for the shits and giggles of it...

Thoughts on this?

Re-sign Jrue Holiday - 4yrs $100m
Re-sign Dante Cunningham - 3yrs $15m

Sign Justin Holiday to a slightly less MLE - 4yr $30m (this helps make room to sign Frank Jackson using exception)

Sign Jonas Jerekbo to BAE - 2yrs $6.5m

Trade E'Twaun Moore, Quincy Pondexter, and a Top 5 Protected First for Evan Fournier & Mario Hezonja (if salary doesn't work then sign Casspi to Vet Min)

Trade Alexis Ajinca & Axel Toupane for Kyle O'Quinn

Jrue Holiday / Quinn Cook / Frank Jackson
Evan Fournier / Justin Holiday / Jordan Crawford
Solomon Hill / Dante Cunningham / Mario Hezonja or Omri Casspi
Anthony Davis / Jonas Jerekbo / Chieck Diallo
DeMarcus Cousins / Kyle O'Quinn / Omer Asik

Pros:

You have multiple lineup options - Jrue can play the 1 or 2, Justin can play the 2 or 3 as can Fournier, if you want to go small Solo or Dante can play the 4...you have shooting with Jrue, Justin, Fournier, Jerekbo...you also have guys that can play offball at guard or on


Cons:

You are now hard capped having used both the MLE and BAE and you have used your last trade chip in your 1st rd pick to enhance roster during season...would still have the TPE from the Buddy/Boogie trade however

Don't know if this is a tax team but I'm pretty sure it's damn close. May have to stretch Asik to avoid it.
This post was edited on 6/28/17 at 6:18 am
Posted by pawel
Warsaw, Poland
Member since Oct 2016
788 posts
Posted on 6/28/17 at 6:22 am to
Not bad offseason

I have done math in my head - dumping Asik might not be enough to avoid tax.
this year we must be below tax line. We can go into tax at the earliest with boogie extension.
Tax penalty and repeater tax might not be easy for Benson to swallow...
Posted by pawel
Warsaw, Poland
Member since Oct 2016
788 posts
Posted on 6/28/17 at 6:24 am to
Jeez - so many wings in Your team...
Posted by BallHawk
Orlando
Member since Jul 2011
5740 posts
Posted on 6/28/17 at 6:37 am to
Yep. Need them in the modern NBA.

Help me out here assuming those contracts for the Holiday brothers what would their first year salaries be?
Posted by cgrand
HAMMOND
Member since Oct 2009
38907 posts
Posted on 6/28/17 at 7:20 am to
that's a one year team though
I don't think you could then re sign cousins and not be a tax team but someone smarter than me would have to do the math

plus Marios deal is coming up

Posted by cgrand
HAMMOND
Member since Oct 2009
38907 posts
Posted on 6/28/17 at 7:22 am to
Fournier is 17MM for each of the next four BTW
Posted by BallHawk
Orlando
Member since Jul 2011
5740 posts
Posted on 6/28/17 at 7:24 am to
Yeah, for some reason I was thinking Fournier was closer to $12-13m than $17m. That changes things, clearly.

I also like the idea of Jerebko, but I don't want to be hard capped and want to avoid the tax line.

This all points back to why Jrue's $25m contract is more of a hindrance. If you get a Rubio, Bledsoe, Lin who's cap number is far less then you've got more depth and more flexibility. Sure the fit may or may not be as good but they'd make it work versus the overpay that's surely coming.
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